A Serious Competition Question

[Scottie]

There's your answer. In my book, there's a difference between fun and competition. Fun is what I do in my backyard (entertaining and feeding friends); competition is serious business. Hence Scottie's post about making a bank deposit on Monday mornings. I know a lot of cooks swear competitions are fun but go over to their camp and try to cut up, pop a few beers and distract them at crunch time. You may get a Jaccard to the nose. It gets intense.

You can be a competitor and have fun too though. I know I always manage to find the "fun" at a contest.... But let's face it. He said something that was wrong and not coming from someone with experience. I get tired of folks coming on and making statements that they have no basis for doing. I don't consider the fact that someone doesn't think it shows what comp cooking is all about is a good enough reason. I cook under the rules. I've cooked on just about every kind of pit out there. It's almost insulting to me that folks think we cook on FE's because we don't know how to tend fires. Ridiculous.

The majority of my cooks, I am cooking on my own or with my 2 daughters. I don't have the luxury of having 5 guys on my team staying up all night. So maybe we should make that illegal? Level the playing field?

 

[Lake Dogs]

:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap

From the mouth of The Jack 09 winner!!! Hats off to you chris! :eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap



BTW... agree.. 100%! IMO, Fire control should be part of a contest equation.. Its not the fuel source thats the issue, its the thermostat. IMO, any type of thermostatically controlled device or assist should be left home.


Like chris says, its not gonna happen, (but sure wish it would!)



(heres where someone brings up fear of technology, digging holes for the purist, leave the thermometers home, test pit temps by licking the steel, dont use tongs, flip meat with your toes, etc..)

100% agreed. Love my Lang, and I mean LOVE IT. I do wish fire control
were more a part of it, and that includes the smoke that comes/goes with
fire... However, if it's not, I've probably got a Stumps or two in my
future... Dont know.... To me, personally, I enjoy staying up most of
the night and shift-sleeping when with a group of friends, drinking a
LITTLE, smoking a cigar or two...

 

[BChawg]

The majority of my cooks, I am cooking on my own or with my 2 daughters. I don't have the luxury of having 5 guys on my team staying up all night. So maybe we should make that illegal? Level the playing field?


Scottie--Stick with the your Girls---Not certain the 5 guys is such a luxury, the guys always seem to trip over the Kooker on their way to the booze.

Clark

 

[Jorge]

One of the best lines I've ever read came from a well known, and respected, cook in relation to the LP Que a couple of years ago. It went something like this..."I only regret that I won't have the opportunity to whoop your gas burning ass!".

I think that most of your better cooks have the same attitude. Bring what you want, and let the judges decide which cook has turned in the best product on any given day. There are no style points, or bonus points for sleep deprivation. Smokey D's didn't seem to be too handicapped cooking on WSMs this past weekend.

 

[Merl]

One of the best lines I've ever read came from a well known, and respected, cook in relation to the LP Que a couple of years ago. It went something like this..."I only regret that I won't have the opportunity to whoop your gas burning ass!".

I think that most of your better cooks have the same attitude. Bring what you want, and let the judges decide which cook has turned in the best product on any given day. There are no style points, or bonus points for sleep deprivation. Smokey D's didn't seem to be too handicapped cooking on WSMs this past weekend.

What they say about you Jorge is correct.
You may not have much to say, but when you speak, everyone should listen.
Merl

 

[Ford]

Stick Burner fact

My old Klose would get up to 225- 240 with 15 lbs of lump and a couple of sticks. At that point it would cook for 6 hours before the temps started to drop. No adjusting vents, no adding wood. Get 5 hours good sleep. However when it started to drop it was because the fire was out and coals were dead. But if you added 2 sticks every 90 minutes then it would go forever at that temp and never change. What's the fire control in that.:?::?: Also burned nice and clean and had no more smoke taste than an FE.

Now my even older 24x6' need a little more attention but then it was less than 2 tons of steel instead of 3.5 tons of steel with an insulated firebox.

And any Jambo owners can chip in but I hear add a log every hour or so (can't remember exact time) and it also chugs along forever. Wheres' the fire control skill people talk about. I bet some Jambo owners get more sleep than a lot of pellet cooks. Just think how often you see Johnny or Mike during the night. And I have been setup next to them managing a fire all night and thought how cool it would be to have such a quality pit. Of course that was before the FE's.:biggrin:

And on an el cheapo offset pit with light steel and air gaps maybe you do need to be constantly managing the vents and wood. If you didn't have pellets to complain about you'd be jumping on the quality offsets as cheating.

And last comment. It's the cook. The tools help a good cook. better quality tool = better quality product. But if you can't cook then it doesn't matter how good the tool is.

 

[Dale P]

We have 5 on our team most of the time and it can be a distraction. One guy wants to do this, one doesnt...
In the end, if Matt & I can stay sober and get the others drunk, we do better.

Just kidding of course.

 

[Lake Dogs]

Pellet pits take ALL the fun out of BBQ competitions. If only I had a fire to tend to on Oct 2-3. Soooooo boring

I heard a rumor that too much use of pellet cookers will make your
face get stuck in this position...

Well, at least you wont go blind!!!!

 

[TN_BBQ]

One guy wants to do this, one doesnt...
Just kidding of course.

On our team, those guys get to do whatever they want between midnight and 6AM :-D

I pretty much want to be in charge at the prep table.

If/when they do want to pipe up with cooking strategies, I give them about 15 pieces of raw chicken and tell them to knock themselves out. Funny how about half an hour with nasty yard bird will cure most folks from voicing their opinion too loudly.

In the end, it's important for a team to work together.

 

[monty3777]

My old Klose would get up to 225- 240 with 15 lbs of lump and a couple of sticks. At that point it would cook for 6 hours before the temps started to drop. No adjusting vents, no adding wood. Get 5 hours good sleep. However when it started to drop it was because the fire was out and coals were dead. But if you added 2 sticks every 90 minutes then it would go forever at that temp and never change. What's the fire control in that.:?::?: .

Wow, you could get your smoker to do that on a windy night when the temps dipped down into the 40s and on hot summer evenings when the wind was nonexistent? Or on a rainy day when the wind picks up, blows hard, then dies down? Come on!

The fact is that SOMETIMES operating a stickburner is real easy - and sometimes, especially when the weather is nasty, it takes real skill to maintain a temp.

Though I'm certanily not in the camp that believes that pellet cookers take no skill to operate, I would also not be willing to join the camp that believes there is no real skill in maintaining a constant temp in a stickburner. Let's be realistic, with the exception of $10,000 + units that are airtight and hooked up to Gurus, most off-sets take a lot skill to operate.

But from my experience the same can be said of pellet cookers. I watch my fellow competetors maintain their cookers as well - only a fool would simply plug in an FEC and then ignore it for 12+ hours. All this stuff takes real skill - which is why not everyone can make good competition BBQ (like me, for instance. My Q is pert near inedible).

 

[Ford]

Wow, you could get your smoker to do that on a windy night when the temps dipped down into the 40s and on hot summer evenings when the wind was nonexistent? Or on a rainy day when the wind picks up, blows hard, then dies down? Come on! 3.5 tons of steel keeps things pretty steady. It did this in 0F temps with 15-20 mph winds and once up to temp hardly took any work and rain hardly has any impact other than creating a lot of steam. that's a fact.

Though I'm certanily not in the camp that believes that pellet cookers take no skill to operate, I would also not be willing to join the camp that believes there is no real skill in maintaining a constant temp in a stickburner. Let's be realistic, with the exception of $10,000 + a Klose like my big one today goes for around 18-20K didn't say it was cheap units that are airtight and hooked up to Gurus, most off-sets take a lot skill to operate. Most offsets are not built to Klose quality. actually no where near that quality.

my comments in red above. I stand by them. I never said I used to cook on cheap offsets and got this performance.

 

[monty3777]

I get you, Ford. Makes sense when I rethink your post. I have an Horizon off-set that I am pretty much in love with and I also tend to forget that it may not be the best pit out there (especially because I paid what, to me, is a lot of $$$ for the thing). Once it is up to temp it can deal with almost any temp. variation - but getting it there on days when the weather gets in the way of building a good fire can be tough. Maybe a high dollar pit doesn't have those problems. For me and my pit, if there is too much wind it takes time to get a hot enough fire for a good clean burn and a good draw. Likewise, on a day with absolutely no wind it can be a challenge to get a good draw going because the fire needs a little extra attention. I think that's what I was addressing. I suppose I need to start saving my money for a better pit!!

 

[Brauma]

My old Klose would get up to 225- 240 with 15 lbs of lump and a couple of sticks. At that point it would cook for 6 hours before the temps started to drop. No adjusting vents, no adding wood. Get 5 hours good sleep. However when it started to drop it was because the fire was out and coals were dead. But if you added 2 sticks every 90 minutes then it would go forever at that temp and never change.

This is why I want a Klose so friggin bad.

It's on the wish list for Santa again this year. We'll see what happens.

 

[jagardn]

I'm gonna stick with my 1Kw Microwave. Meat will smoke if you keep it in there long enough.

 

[MilitantSquatter]

Mod Note : Guys - the mods have scrubbed this thread and will continue to keep a close eye on this thread. It's fine to make your points but no need for direct challenges or negative comments etc. Please keep it civil.


Thanks for your help.

 

[The_Kapn]

Interesting topic that comes up several times a year on every forum out there.
Always exciting.

I have competed with pure stick, charcoal/chunk, and now pellets.

I remember the thrill of keeping a fire in a Bandera going all night in 30 degree weather with 20 MPH winds.
Did I just call that a "thrill"?

I understand the position of the "purist" guys who want all the electronic gagetry banned.

This year, I witnessed the ultimate display of fire and heat control competition cooking using pure skill--no electronics and not even using a traditional stick or charcoal burning "smoker".

Imagine cooking all four comp meats in dutch ovens.
And then "walking" in several catagories!
His 2nd in Ribs, 5th in Brisket, and 7th Overall speak for themselves. :lol:

You might cry "fowl--how can that be legal"!!!
But they were cooked without oil and with only charcoal as the heat source.
Legal as can be, FBA and KCBS to the best of my knowledge.

This was done by Forrest at the annual FBA fun cook this last year.
Results are here:
http://www.flbbq.org/funcook.htm

Forrest says he will never do that again!
He moved 80# of briquets 2-4 times each, as individual briquets with tongs!
No sleep, no rest, never any down time overnight.
He is an "Iron Man" who needs little sleep--but he said he was "smack worn out" . :lol:
No temp probes--nothing but expertise and feel to control the cook.

Now, to me, that is the ultimate demonstration of the spirit of "pure--back to basics " BBQ cooking!
Not even a basic traditional "smoker" used--just one of the oldest cooking vessals still in current use.

That would be an interesting Comp if someone wants to put one together!

TIM

 

[Ford]

Well Kapn there used to be a restaurant in Townsend TN that cooked on a pit made of cement blocks, expanded metal grid, cardboard sides and cover and a burn barrell. It made mighty good Q although it was real slow and low. Get up every hour or so and add coals as needed and pork took 18-24 hours. Pit was 4x8. Now that's ironman. He moved pieces of burning wood to the pit by small shovel then used a poker to position them.

 

[SirPorkaLot]

Well Kapn there used to be a restaurant in Townsend TN that cooked on a pit made of cement blocks, expanded metal grid, cardboard sides and cover and a burn barrell. It made mighty good Q although it was real slow and low. Get up every hour or so and add coals as needed and pork took 18-24 hours. Pit was 4x8. Now that's ironman. He moved pieces of burning wood to the pit by small shovel then used a poker to position them.

I thought this is however one made Q? :mrgreen:

I entered my first comp. in the backyard division, and won 3rd place (1st & 2nd were caterers competing in the backyard) using a burn barrel, and loading an old offset every hour with coals from the burn barrel.

I use that set up for butt, brisket and chix, and enjoy the fire tending. I had a team beside with me with a stumps smoker shaking their heads at me while they went to sleep.

If i was a serious competitor i may would look at doing something differently, but I still want to continue cooking over/with live coals whatever I do.
It is part of the heritage of bbq, and something I enjoy. :-D

 

[smoke-n-my-i's]

I think that most of your better cooks have the same attitude. Bring what you want, and let the judges decide which cook has turned in the best product on any given day. There are no style points, or bonus points for sleep deprivation.

How true.... I took my 2 trusty CharGrillers to Fl a couple of weeks ago. I competed against some very strong FBA teams, my first FBA competition. I guess the judges didn't like my ribs and chicken, but the pork and brisket made up for it. The pork took 10th and the brisket took 2nd, right behind Swamp Boys... So, my $179 CG's did me good. They are classified as stick burners and CG actually recommend burning sticks. I myself use lump, so am I a stick burner, or a coal burner???? I do add a few sticks and chunks for added smoke.... Do I get much sleep, no. I got a total of maybe 2 hrs at that comp... Am I against a pooper, well, not totally. In fact, I was talking to the wife on the way home, and told her if this kept up, I am seriously thinking of a different cooker so I can get some much needed sleep... So yes, there could possibly be a change in the cookers in the future sometime. But for now, the el cheapo CG's will keep on cooking....