How to get DQed for no reason in 9 easy steps

[kcquer]

One thing i realize that the reps are not my enemy.

John, If the reps DQ someone for no reason they are the enemy. The reps incompetence robbed Guy of a chance at a top 10 finish.

An apology and the return of Guy's entry fee is a minimum of a corrective action and the Rep needs to be barred from officiating any contest until he/she knows how to follow procedure.

 

[Smoker]

John, If the reps DQ someone for no reason they are the enemy. The reps incompetence robbed Guy of a chance at a top 10 finish.

An apology and the return of Guy's entry fee is a minimum of a corrective action and the Rep needs to be barred from officiating any contest until he/she knows how to follow procedure.

Kc has a point. Also, and VERY importantly, we never even knew about the cooks meeting that they had on Saturday so if there were any questions, we never really had the opportunity. The rep should have had the judges score it as they liked and found out afterwards if the chicken was fried.IMHO

 

[Jeff_in_KC]

Agreed, Scott!

 

[Pigs on The Run]

last reply

Whew. God bless you all. I no desire to get upset any one about BBQ.(thats what the wife is for lol) I do it becuase i love the people. Lord knows i dont want to make people mad who i have never seen. Guys good luck and have fun Stop by at the Royal and say Hi.
John

 

[arlieque]

John,

It is no ones point to make someone mad. I understand your point and I think that is great! Point is the reps should have allowed the judging to take place in which they could have ran straight to you and asked about the entry. They didnt do that, did they? You should at the least be given your entry fee back by KCBS and the reps retrained. I had a problem at Guitarbeque...I have sent emails to board members and have received no answer either as of today. Three weeks have gone by. I also sent an email about a judge that needs to be retrained back in April of 06 and have never received any reply about what should have been done. Whats up with that?Answering a email isnt that hard is it? You are what bbq is really about though.......having fun!!!!


Arlie

 

[Kevin]

John,

It is no ones point to make someone mad. I understand your point and I think that is great! Point is the reps should have allowed the judging to take place in which they could have ran straight to you and asked about the entry. They didnt do that, did they? You should at the least be given your entry fee back by KCBS and the reps retrained. I had a problem at Guitarbeque...I have sent emails to board members and have received no answer either as of today. Three weeks have gone by. I also sent an email about a judge that needs to be retrained back in April of 06 and have never received any reply about what should have been done. Whats up with that?Answering a email isnt that hard is it? You are what bbq is really about though.......having fun!!!!


Arlie

Point well taken. I don't play yet but this is an interesting thread. The basic point Guy wanted to make was that he was dissed without confirmation of the facts. Kind of like life in general. Barbecue is a philosophy of sorts me thinks.

 

[YankeeBBQ]

Point well taken. I don't play yet but this is an interesting thread. The basic point Guy wanted to make was that he was dissed without confirmation of the facts. Kind of like life in general. Barbecue is a philosophy of sorts me thinks.

Here's a hypothetical situation. Please don't anybody take this the wrong way it's simply hypothetical.

Let's say a team did fry their chicken hoping for an advantage over the rest of the teams. Let's say they knew frying was illegal. Now when the rep approaches the team to confirm whether or not their chicken was fried of course the team will simply deny it. How can a team prove they didn't fry their chicken ? How can a rep prove they did ?

Again I'm not trying to infer anything. I believe the original poster of this thread cooked the chicken just like he said and he was mistakingly DQ'd.

Steve

 

[voodoobbqIL]

The best thing that they did was take pictures of the process. We all know the old saying and we as a group have judged the outcome from those pictures and so should the rep. But also out of this the lack of response from the sanction body is not making this any better. I hope that the KCBS learns something from this and makes a point for reps to have some sort of formula to deal with a unique situation. The judging teacher we had said something very profound at our class he said "I do not automatically look for the bad things when I am judging / repping, I error on the side of the competitor and if I think something is fishy I fish for the answer. Always judge and rep on the positiveness of the sport, remember you want people to judge you entry based on the good things not the bad"
Sage advice for all of us, I am sorry that this happened and I hope that some learning has come from it.

 

[backyardchef]

Steve--

Isn't that the risk at every contest? I've seen on this forum and others people asking questions about possible ways to 'skirt' the rules-- most people acknowledge it's possible, though claim it isn't that likely to happen, at least without being reported to a rep. If someone is in their trailer, who knows what's happening? Unless it is seen and/or reported, how can 'cheating', which Guy did not do, be completely prevented?

Here's a hypothetical situation. Please don't anybody take this the wrong way it's simply hypothetical.

Let's say a team did fry their chicken hoping for an advantage over the rest of the teams. Let's say they knew frying was illegal. Now when the rep approaches the team to confirm whether or not their chicken was fried of course the team will simply deny it. How can a team prove they didn't fry their chicken ? How can a rep prove they did ?

Again I'm not trying to infer anything. I believe the original poster of this thread cooked the chicken just like he said and he was mistakingly DQ'd.

Steve

 

[kcquer]

How can a team prove they didn't fry their chicken ?

In this particular case, there was compelling photographic evidence that their chicken was not fried.

BTW-I would think one taste would provide the answer, smoke flavor would be a big clue, as would the lack of excess fat in the coating.

 

[YankeeBBQ]

In this particular case, there was compelling photographic evidence that their chicken was not fried.

BTW-I would think one taste would provide the answer, smoke flavor would be a big clue, as would the lack of excess fat in the coating.

Smoke taste wouldn't prove anything. The meat could be smoked before being fried or liquid smoke could be used in the coating. Something that's been fried right has no excess fat or grease. If the team smoked the meat and sprayed it with some butter or pam or something then there may be some excess fat in the coating.

Just saying there is no easy way to prove it one way or the other.

 

[Sawdustguy]

Guys,

I just want to thank you all. I am overwhelmed by the support you all gave me. I doubt that the KCBS will ever respond to my emails. I very nicely asked for an explanation but doubt a reply will ever come. The whole purpose of this thread was to expose a flaw in the judging process and hopefully prevent it from ever happening again to anyone.

 

[kcquer]

Smoke taste wouldn't prove anything. The meat could be smoked before being fried or liquid smoke could be used in the coating. Something that's been fried right has no excess fat or grease. If the team smoked the meat and sprayed it with some butter or pam or something then there may be some excess fat in the coating.

Just saying there is no easy way to prove it one way or the other.

You don't eat as much Q or fried chicken as I do.

 

[Al Dente]

The DQ should never have taken place. The Rep should have confirmed exactly what method was used to cook the chicken. What is stopping anyone from trying a new ingredient, only the threat of a DQ!!!!! What if you decided to wrap your chicken in a banana leaf and then smoke it, it would not appear to be "smoked", instead steamed, so that's an automatic DQ as well. C'mon man, it can't be left up to a "judgement" call, it has to be DETERMINED through investigating what was done. To DQ someone on a whim, "well it looks like it MIGHT be fried" is ridiculous. And where were the Reps who were supposed to be walking around to insure thst everyone was playing by the rules. I wasn't visited at all, nor did I ever see a Rep roaming the site. We're all on the honor system, and if you have to cheat at BBQ you need to get a new arena, and a life!!!! Guy, I feel for ya, that was total BS what happened, and to not be notified at the time makes no sense. You're always trying somehting new and as long as it falls within the rules, who cares. Thinking outsdie of the box should not be punished.

 

[Paola Greg]

Guys,

I doubt that the KCBS will ever respond to my emails. I very nicely asked for an explanation but doubt a reply will ever come.

The KCBS may want to put your question in front of the whole board for discussion before sending you an official responce. If that is the case, the board only meets once each month. But it would be nice if they would acknowledge receiving your mail, and let you know when to expect an answer.

 

[Solidkick]

The KCBS may want to put your question in front of the whole board for discussion before sending you an official responce. If that is the case, the board only meets once each month. But it would be nice if they would acknowledge receiving your mail, and let you know when to expect an answer.

Greg is right, and my feeling that this is the case.

 

[scottyd]

guy in my eyes your are a pioneer and what a great idea, I for one back you in this all the way I tryed this at home this weekend and wow. You my friend should never have been DQ on this. the rep put the wood to you. I do feel your pain.

 

[Pig Headed]

Guy,

I spoke to 2 reps this weekend about your situation and they both said that they felt that it was a type of "marking". I tried to explain the whole scenerio and asked why the reps of your comp wouldn't at least speak with you. They still said that DQ was proper. I still agree with you, as a certified judge I would not think of it as marking at all. This could be a benchmark case if you ask me. Hope you hear from KCBS.

 

[racer_81]

Guy,

I spoke to 2 reps this weekend about your situation and they both said that they felt that it was a type of "marking". I tried to explain the whole scenerio and asked why the reps of your comp wouldn't at least speak with you. They still said that DQ was proper. I still agree with you, as a certified judge I would not think of it as marking at all. This could be a benchmark case if you ask me. Hope you hear from KCBS.

Marking?

That sounds silly.

Does that mean if everybody used a ton of black pepper in their rub and one entry used white pepper only, thereby making their submission lighter in color than everybody else's, they would be guilty of "marking"?

Or, if all contestants but one used tomato-based glazes and one contestant used a mayo-based glaze, thereby making his submission lighter in color than the others, then that's "marking" too?

Or - do they consider that whichever submission doesn't look like all the others is "marked"?

 

[MilitantSquatter]

I'm with Racer on the marking point... he's dead on and it just goes to show that the rules need to be re-examined and re-defined.

The rules as written in the KCBS 2006 rule book are extremely vague as to what marking exactly is... Now, when I took the judges class, I recall being instructed of one or two examples of "marking" (ex. using a jello mold to form the pulled pork etc). Sure, shaping your pulled pork in the form of a fish could be considered "marked", but to back to Racers point, almost anything could then be classified as marking if you go based on ingredients etc, layout etc as long as someone knows what to look for. Who is to say putting 4 pc. of burnt ends in one corner is any less of "marking" as laying the pulled pork neatly like a triangle or a heart. I still can't classify what Guy and team did as marking.

To the Contest Reps defense, I am sure most of them when getting put on the spot with a situation out of the norm, may not have ample time to put things in perspective and determine the best course of action as to how to address with a team so as not to be surprised.

We can only be hopeful that the KBCS will discuss at their next meeting, but a courtesy response just acknowledging that they are in receipt of a cook's issue should become standard protocol.