Myrtle Beach contest puts stop payment on checks

[djqualls]

For starters, you're hardly qualified to pass judgement on the abilities of my accountant or the financial health of my organization. Secondly, it doesn't make a helluva lot of sense to generate another form then track it along with the original entry, 'prize sheet' and the KCBS score sheet when one cancelled check is proof enough.

Let's see, I've been a General Manager in the Casino Gaming industry for the past 25 years this month, and have promoted $25 Million dollars plus worth of box office receipts in live concerts in the last five years as well. I'd say I know a little about cash based transactions and the proper reconciliation of those receipts.

If I told my patrons or Artists, I only pay by check, I'm out of business. I know this is a text based conversation so context is difficult to interpret however you seem to believe that your principals are above a contestants suspicion. That very attitude would blip my radar and I wouldn't patronize your event.

It's a pile of crap that one contest can spoil the spirit of the game but look at what one little airline incident did 11 years ago to what we all have to do just to get on a plane.

I do find it unusual for any organizer much less Shriners be corrupt or crooked but then again the eagles on my ring tell me they (The Shriners) are upright travelers....... I'd like to hear the other side to the story on this one.....

 

[Rolling Smoke]

We must follow some ridiculous rules and laws everyday at work, school, and in this country because of the actions of others and not of our own. Fair? No, but like the saying goes, life isn't always fair.

Maybe so but in case you missed my opening comment, I don't have to and will not continue to organize any event if i'm forced to pay cash at the awards. That's the bottom line.

 

[Rolling Smoke]

Let's see, I've been a General Manager in the Casino Gaming industry for the past 25 years this month, and have promoted $25 Million dollars plus worth of box office receipts in live concerts in the last five years as well. I'd say I know a little about cash based transactions and the proper reconciliation of those receipts.

If I told my patrons or Artists, I only pay by check, I'm out of business. I know this is a text based conversation so context is difficult to interpret however you seem to believe that your principals are above a contestants suspicion. That very attitude would blip my radar and I wouldn't patronize your event.

It's a pile of crap that one contest can spoil the spirit of the game but look at what one little airline incident did 11 years ago to what we all have to do just to get on a plane.

I do find it unusual for any organizer much less Shriners be corrupt or crooked but then again the eagles on my ring tell me they (The Shriners) are upright travelers....... I'd like to hear the other side to the story on this one.....

Thanks for the resume but it still does not qualify you to pass judgement on the abilities of my accountants or the financial condition of my organization. I will not bore you with my resume.

As was said earlier by someone else, there are very few contests out there in the pro circuit that pay cash and it has nothing to do with my principals being above a cooks suspicions. I trust them enough to receive a check for their entry and they extend the same trust.

I think your 9/11 analogy is a little overblown but I understand where you're going. I have to travel for work but I do not have to organize or compete in barbecue contests and like I said in the beginning, if I am forced to pay cash because of something a cranial rectal inverted organizer did, I will cease to organize.....so mote it be.

 

[chrisnjenn]

Maybe so but in case you missed my opening comment, I don't have to and will not continue to organize any event if i'm forced to pay cash at the awards. That's the bottom line.

No, I caught it. I'm not trying to be argumentative (I have no dog in this fight-I see both sides), but you could quit organizing it and one thing I learned in life through school, family and career is there is always someone who will take your place. Always. I have fired people who were top performers, but felt they were not expendible because they were making our company a lot of money. Everyone is expendible. Everyone is replaceable. Everyone.

 

[roksmith]

Don't bet on it.
We all like the growth we have seen in competitive BBQ in the past couple of years. More money to win, more contests to cook at. It's a great thing. But start making lives more difficult on the honest organizers out there, and you will see it decline rapidly. Putting on a contest is not (usually) a big money making event. Organizers do it because although it's a lot of work, it is fun and rewarding. Take away the fun and/or make it more difficult and it won't happen.

I have no problem accepting checks for winnings. I think there is no real reason they cannot be handed out at the awards ceremony though. Waiting for a winnings check in the mail sucks.. but so does waiting until the last minute for entry checks.
Cash may be king, but unless you require all entry forms and payment in 30 days prior to an event, it ain't happening. And that too would drive down participation. Not too many teams are willing or able to pay for something too far in advance.

 

[timzcardz]

I read through ALL of this, and the only thing that I've gotten out of it is . . .

There is an issue between ONE COMPETITOR and ONE ORGANIZER, that may or may not be the result of something other than the competition itself, but yet, with only one side of the story, the knee jerk reaction of many is to rewrite the rules for sanctioning.

Makes no sense at all to me.


I think that it is good that the OP let people know that payment was stopped, in case others were experiencing the same thing. However, it would have been a lot better if it was also made known in the original post that there were other issues involved as well, rather than placing that it in the middle of a post last later.

 

[Bentley]

Does KCBS have a written policy that a Member or competing team can view that shows how a situation like this will be handled?

 

[djqualls]

Thanks for the resume but it still does not qualify you to pass judgement on the abilities of my accountants or the financial condition of my organization. I will not bore you with my resume.

As was said earlier by someone else, there are very few contests out there in the pro circuit that pay cash and it has nothing to do with my principals being above a cooks suspicions. I trust them enough to receive a check for their entry and they extend the same trust.

I think your 9/11 analogy is a little overblown but I understand where you're going. I have to travel for work but I do not have to organize or compete in barbecue contests and like I said in the beginning, if I am forced to pay cash because of something a cranial rectal inverted organizer did, I will cease to organize.....so mote it be.

Based on the information you provided on your accountants, you made it easy to form an opinion

I've cooked 17 KCBS so far this year. Four wrote checks. ( Sam's and another whom the organizer was very open about losing $20,000 on the contest) the others were Chamber of Commerces who had pre filled checks.

I'm quite sure you're resume would impress me. Have a nice day. I'm curious, what contests do you run?

 

[Fornia]

I'm pretty confident that comment regarding 9/11 should be deleted from this thread.

Awful analogy and a poor choice of words... and should not be mentioned in a thread about a BBQ contest regardless.

 

[Grizmt]

Sounds like you boys are cooking the wrong contests. I've cooked everything from unsanctioned events to Arlie Bragg productions and never been stiffed in ten years. Come on over to Xenia and I'll show you how simple it is.

It seems you've been lucky if you read the posts in this thread and heard the many stories at events on delayed,short payments and figure there's got to be many more teams who aren't represented here (or anywhere) that've had issues.

As for this being the only event to have issues, I beg to differ. Just ask the California teams about who's cheated them, many other states have stories as well.
The thought that if it's only "10 out of 300" so it's no big deal is flawed in several respects. 10 in what time frame? This month? This year? At all? Then you've got all the teams that are victims of these "10 bad events". If they just paid down to 5th place that's 50 teams who were cheated out of their hard earned money. So, how many (or who) have to be cheated before it becomes a big deal? You,your brother,father and mother,kids,best friend,your neighbor? At what point is it enough?
Kind of brings things into perspective doesn't it?

Like I said before, if KCBS would require escrow of funds prior to the event as they've done in the past with some events this would become a non-issue. Worst case they could require a performance bond to cover the payouts if there's a default.

I think it's a shame that such a conversation even has to take place and can understand how honest,upstanding business people who run clean events would get upset thinking they're being tarred with the same brush. I don't think that's the case, I think that these issues are just finally coming to a head and that teams (understandably) just want some protection from deadbeats or late-payers from the beginning. There isn't any at this point.

Unfortunately when it comes to money, especially larger sums the ethics and mortality of some people fade into the dark.

 

[HarleyGirl14226]

It's a pile of crap that one contest can spoil the spirit of the game but look at what one little airline incident did 11 years ago to what we all have to do just to get on a plane.

How offensive to refer to the tragedy of 9/11 as "one little airline incident". Those affected consider your statement disgraceful.

 

[bbqczar]

Based on the information you provided on your accountants, you made it easy to form an opinion

I've cooked 17 KCBS so far this year. Four wrote checks. ( Sam's and another whom the organizer was very open about losing $20,000 on the contest) the others were Chamber of Commerces who had pre filled checks.

I'm quite sure you're resume would impress me. Have a nice day. I'm curious, what contests do you run?

I also have cooked 8 years worth of contests and have had only about 6 checks in 8 years !!! So,it must be an ,east of the Rockies thing,thats the only thing I know,99.9% of all contests out west pay in cash and some have pay-outs well over 25K,so it isn't any problem at all to have pay-outs in cash ,it's just an excuse by some for no real reason,they just don't feel like doing it and I don't know why,sure would save problems like we are discussing here.

 

[bbqczar]

I read through ALL of this, and the only thing that I've gotten out of it is . . .

There is an issue between ONE COMPETITOR and ONE ORGANIZER, that may or may not be the result of something other than the competition itself, but yet, with only one side of the story, the knee jerk reaction of many is to rewrite the rules for sanctioning.

Makes no sense at all to me.


I think that it is good that the OP let people know that payment was stopped, in case others were experiencing the same thing. However, it would have been a lot better if it was also made known in the original post that there were other issues involved as well, rather than placing that it in the middle of a post last later.

Sorry,that is not correct at all.There have be numerous cases of bounced checks,closed accounts,etc. at competitions,this isn't an isolated case it happens several times a year,just look back at the last 10 years and you will be suprised and may even understand why cash would be the best way to go for this and again it would eliminate this problem forever,everywhere.Easy problem to fix and I bet ALL would agree if they ever have the misfortune of going thru this.

 

[Teamfour]

It's a pile of crap that one contest can spoil the spirit of the game but look at what one little airline incident did 11 years ago to what we all have to do just to get on a plane.

This is so offensive on many levels. IMHO, this poster is not worthy of being a Brethren.

 

[djqualls]

This is so offensive on many levels. IMHO, this poster is not worthy of being a Brethren.

Yes I don't know why I typed little, I mean no disrespect to the tragedy.

Thanks for policing the forum since July.

 

[nthole]

Yes I don't know why I typed little, I mean no disrespect to the tragedy.

Thanks for policing the forum since July.

This is a pretty common phrase used when people use the word 'little' with the point that it's an extreme exaggeration. You didn't really read that comment and think the guy was actually saying it was a little event did you!?!?

Bad timing given that it was this week, but I think it's a stretch to want to toast the guy up as an enemy of the state and Brethren.

It's a valid point about how one occurrence can have a broader impact. The butterfly flaps it's wing...

Instead of a roast how about we stay on topic? How many events like these would eventually, if ever, cause KCBS to alter their policies? Should it ever? Right now it appears no one else has had this issue, so more and more it's looking like it may be because of a specific occurence.

 

[Gowan]

What we are seeing in this thread is exactly why KCBS has never put up a forum of their own. While this type of media is a great way to exchange information of interest to specific communities, it also functions as a huge gossip fountain and rumour mill.

On these often-anonymous forums, titanic debates rage over scraps of information and disinformation, all sparked by a random post that may or may not be factual, probably doesn't include the whole story and most certainly is flavored by the personal motives of the originator. In the end the original issue gets obscured as egos and bruised feelings move to the fore.

I think the take-away from this thread is that there were some problems at a contest in Myrtle Beach. This will not change the status quo for all events nationwide, and that is as it should be.

 

[TooSaucedToPork]

Dang ya'll simmer down...

One fricken contest screwed up and it caused a waterfall of crazy comments that caused a bunch of ya to "not act like Brethren".

Yeah, bad 9/11 reference, but even I, a guy whose cousin was in the army section at the pentagon, and on that day my girlfriend was AT the WTC understood it was sarcasim.

The sport has grown...and with it grows problems. Just a few short years ago you had 75% less contests with most organizers in it for the Love not the money. Now, like any other American Fad...yes BBQ has become yet another fad...certain people have zeroed in on it and are looking to make a buck doing what is cool...Many do not have the Love of BBQ we do, many see us as $$$$$$ and this will pass. We will become less of a fad in the coming years as the BBQ craze fades. You just gotta weather the storm and expect that this will happen more and more until it gets better.

It sux but its the truth.

The Brethren will still be here cooking when the fad ends...We were here before the surge of fans, we will be here long after, because unlike the guys that see $$$$ we do it for the Love of Q...

Neil

 

[Rolling Smoke]

No, I caught it. I'm not trying to be argumentative (I have no dog in this fight-I see both sides), but you could quit organizing it and one thing I learned in life through school, family and career is there is always someone who will take your place. Always. I have fired people who were top performers, but felt they were not expendible because they were making our company a lot of money. Everyone is expendible. Everyone is replaceable. Everyone.

Since we're sharing lessons learned in life, one of my favorite ones is to not assume anything.

While you're absolutely right about everyone being expendable, it has nothing to do with this particular situation and I'm at a loss for why you even brought it up. I do not organize contests for a living. Furthermore, I do not benefit financially in any sense of the word from the events that I organize nor does anyone on my staff. It is strictly voluntary and the proceeds from the events go to the Fisher Nightingale House to provide temporary quarters for the families of service men and women who are in military hospitals. Sort of a Ronald McDonald house for veterans, if you will.

It's not likely that I will be fired from this position because nobody else would have it. Besides, the llc that backs the contest is in my name.

 

[chrisnjenn]

I assumed you didn't get paid and you volunteered your time. Guess my assumption was correct after all.

My post was general in nature and not specific nor was it necessarily directed to anyone in particular. My mistake was quoting your post.

It is a good thing you are doing. I hope you continue it.