What happened last weekend in McMinnville, TN that warrants a special KCBS BOD meeting?

[moocow]

The Board made the right call deciding that the team needed to be punished. They totally screwed up the punishment and I am quickly loosing confidence in what they are doing. We voted you in because you said you would be fair and responsible and I don't feel that is being done on this matter. Who of you on the board has the balls to admit your wrong and your punishment needs to be adjusted to fit the crime? My guess would be nobody because you are hard headed and this is what we have come to expect for you. Just wanted to point out I love KCBS and am not a BoD basher, this is just not right!

 

[Jeff_in_KC]

Shane, I suggest you run for the board then. There are going to be openings. I've kept quiet for a day now and watched myself and the board be TOTALLY trashed and I'm sick of it. It's too bad those involved won't tell why the board did what we did because they know. You all demand answers from board members and when you get them, there's crap being flung in every direction. Well you got your answers. Board members came on and had the decency to answer what questions we are able to answer and paid the price for doing so. Probably best we leave you in the dark next time. Couldn't be any worse than this has been. I'm sure I'll see many of you on the ballot come January, right?

 

[Cue's Your Daddy]

In speaking with some people, it seems the individual who had the apron on has done some things at past contests that were very inappropriate. I don't know if it is true, but maybe someone can tell me if this is true. It seems to me that he is an individual that has caused some problems before. I don't believe evrything I hear that's why I am asking the question.

 

[bigabyte]

I just can't seem to keep my nose out of this one.

This thread has an interesting dichotomy.
The first pages are filled with hate and disgust towards the team, organizers and reps with many calls for zero tolerance and banning for any and all of them. Dmprantz himself commented on it.

After dmprantz's post, the thread became filled with hate and disgust towards the BOD.

The only story anyone has heard about in all this is what dmpramtz said, and he said he was unaware of what happened, provided no specifics as to what really happened, and said he accepted responsibility and apologized for that very thing he was unaware of and provided no specifics about. The BOD can't say anything. The guy who wore the apron hasn't said anything either.

Yet everyone claims to know what is wrong and what should have been done instead in light of the immense volume of jack chit that they actually know?:roll:

I would hate to know what you folks would do on a jury when you actually do have facts to arm your opinions, as opposed to the carnage you try laying down when you are clueless.

 

[The Cosmic Pig]

Mark, Cat Sass isn't sexually suggestive in any manner, and I think it would hardly fall into the offensive category. You might be over reacting a bit on getting your logo redone.

On the other hand, I guess there is a fair question there. Is the BOD ready to preapprove all team names and t-shirts so that a team doesn't have to worry about this? I can't imagine the man power that's going to require but it's a VERY fair question. If you set a precedent without setting rules on whats ok and whats not...that's not really ok.

Does it really need stated explicitly in the rules that "no contestant should wear a fake penis on stage to receive their award" to know that that's not acceptable behavior? And can't at least 99.9% of us look at any given sign, shirt, or logo and know what's lewd and what is acceptable without it being written in the rules? Come on, folks. Apply common sense. And if someone doesn't know better than to wear a fake penis on stage, are they going to be receptive to the suggestion that they take it off? I highly doubt it.
I was a union representative once and I know what it's like to try and please a small group of people, much less a group of this size; it can't be done. I also remember before the last KCBS election that lots of people wanted to "throw the bums out," and now it's the same thing all over again. It's a thankless task, and you couldn't melt me and pour me into a position like that again. Give these folks some credit for trying to do what they thought was right. I've seen the board members' post on this thread, and they seem very sincere in their attempt to resolve this situation with the best interest of competition BBQ in mind. The majority of the membership put their trust in them, and that's why they got elected. Don't second-guess their decisions unless you're willing to put yourself in their position. I guarantee you'll be the next "***hole" that someone, somewhere wants to throw out!

 

[bmonkman]

Shane, I suggest you run for the board then. There are going to be openings. I've kept quiet for a day now and watched myself and the board be TOTALLY trashed and I'm sick of it. It's too bad those involved won't tell why the board did what we did because they know. You all demand answers from board members and when you get them, there's crap being flung in every direction. Well you got your answers. Board members came on and had the decency to answer what questions we are able to answer and paid the price for doing so. Probably best we leave you in the dark next time. Couldn't be any worse than this has been. I'm sure I'll see many of you on the ballot come January, right?

I for one having served on a board of an organization run by volunteers know first hand how thankless your job is. It really is a shame you folks had to deal with this. Perhaps a mailing out to all KCBS members reminding them of the the fact these events are to be family friendly and EVERY member has the moral and ethical responsibility to speak up when actions/choices of others puts this at risk.

We can't refuse to take responsibility and say it is the BOD's responsibility (or their rep) and then scream foul when that is exactly what happens. I may disagree with the decision, but I do respect it.

 

[dmprantz]

In speaking with some people, it seems the individual who had the apron on has done some things at past contests that were very inappropriate. I don't know if it is true, but maybe someone can tell me if this is true. It seems to me that he is an individual that has caused some problems before. I don't believe evrything I hear that's why I am asking the question.

I've been to several competitions with the individual who wore the apron, and I am not aware of any "very inappropriate" behaviour in the past. I believe that "some people" are telling you "some misinformation." Personally, I think these "some people" should stick to facts and speak for themselves, both publically and privately. If some one believes that I am wrong and that there is a track record, feel free to let me know privately of what you mean, and I'll correct myself.

dmp

 

[Ford]

If that policy posted above is now used to govern contests then I think all members need to be made aware of it. I've never seen it before and I have read the bylaws and rules. Cooks need to know this. There's lots of team logos and names and "tag lines" that would disappear. I would think a pig that has obvious female organs not appropriately covered would be harassment. I know in the workplace a lot of calendars have been banned.

 

[moocow]

Shane, I suggest you run for the board then. There are going to be openings. I've kept quiet for a day now and watched myself and the board be TOTALLY trashed and I'm sick of it. It's too bad those involved won't tell why the board did what we did because they know. You all demand answers from board members and when you get them, there's crap being flung in every direction. Well you got your answers. Board members came on and had the decency to answer what questions we are able to answer and paid the price for doing so. Probably best we leave you in the dark next time. Couldn't be any worse than this has been. I'm sure I'll see many of you on the ballot come January, right?

Jeff, you are taking this way to personally. I supported your campaign and voted for you. You of all people know I am not a BoD basher and support them most of the time. I still support 99% of your decisions. I even support the decision of banning them just not how long the ban is. You guys gave them a death sentence in my opinion, they will probably never return again! Just remember it might be you some day who has a laps in judgment and makes a very bad decision. I have seen and heard you do or say questionable things in the past, we are all guilty of it including myself. I applaud you for all of your comments on here, that is exactly the reason I voted for you but that still doesn't mean I don't think you are wrong. I can disagree with the BoD and that does not make me a board basher/hater. I may of overstated that I was loosing confidence with the Board because over all they are doing a pretty good job but when poor decisions are made it reminds me of the past boards and it concerns me. Do you think the ban could be reduced to 1 year and still be effective? As to your original Question, I will not be running for the Board because I support you and feel like I can live with you being wrong 1% of the time on KCSB matters! Please don't take it so personally, it will eat you alive.

 

[Teamfour]

It's too bad those involved won't tell why the board did what we did because they know.

I wish Paul Harvey was around to tell "the rest of the story".

 

[USMC_BBQ]

In speaking with some people, it seems the individual who had the apron on has done some things at past contests that were very inappropriate. I don't know if it is true, but maybe someone can tell me if this is true. It seems to me that he is an individual that has caused some problems before. I don't believe evrything I hear that's why I am asking the question.

Whoever you talked to is misinformed or has him confused with someone else. The guy has cooked for 8 years on two different teams (MBN and KCBS) and has never had any prior incidents or issues.
I believe the penalty by the board was so outlandish because of the teams that complained, if it were not two TOTY contenders and it was Joe Blow BBQ than it might be different or if one of the people involved were not BOD Arlie Bragg the punishment might have fit the crime.

and by theway: GO Sachem Flaming Arrows!

 

[bbqbrad]

Too often we...enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John F. Kennedy

 

[Jorge]

Whoever you talked to is misinformed or has him confused with someone else. The guy has cooked for 8 years on two different teams (MBN and KCBS) and has never had any prior incidents or issues.
I believe the penalty by the board was so outlandish because of the teams that complained, if it were not two TOTY contenders and it was Joe Blow BBQ than it might be different or if one of the people involved were not BOD Arlie Bragg the punishment might have fit the crime.

and by theway: GO Sachem Flaming Arrows!

For the sake of clarity...Is your name Jesse?

 

[dmprantz]

And my second question about whether this applies to all forms of harrassment or just hostile workplace situations

So no one is able or willing to comment on wether all forms of harrassment are covered by this policy? Interesting. If any one ever finds out the answer, I'd appreciate it if you'd let me know.

dmp

 

[Pitmaster T]

I have a favor to ask

Someone mentioned in this thread other examples of behavioral problems (judges, contestants) and among them are "sex in porta potties," guns, fights, etc.

What I would like to have is somebody PM me some good evidence of these examples PLUS a picture of the offending apron and I will see what I can do about this. This is a serious issue that deserves a smear campaign of the highest order. It would also be great fun dragging members of the board through the mud in a youtube video. Great election year stuff.

I think what the team did was wrong, I personally would have made SURE the guy did not wear it, but I think 3 years is just way too much considering what goes on at a KCBS event. I think its lazy. They should have banned the team one year with one year probation (possibly more for the offender personally) and then sent out a new edict on moral conduct banning certain conducts and such. It would have gone a long way toward fixing the problem.

Personally, if its so family friendly, lets nix the alcohol all together. Three years plus 2 probation is ridiculous. Especially considering what went on with me and my team in that market in the 1990's regarding racial slurs sprayed on my camper years ago.

 

[Jorge]

Here is where I have to disagree, IMHO if the Rep for this contest was not a Board Member for KCBS, this incident would not have been handled so swiftly.

My reply was in answer to whether or not the board acted within 24 hours. There were actually three members of the board present at this contest. The board did have more first hand info than usual in this case, but I don't know that it drove the board to call the special meeting. There were multiple complaints submitted. One Rep did spend time talking with many teams at that contest, not just ToY contenders, and the feeling and comments were uniform and outspoken. There were also some time sensitive issues involved as well. One team is in the Jack draw. That draw will occur before the next scheduled meeting. Whether the Jack chooses to honor the ban is up to them. It's not a sanctioned KCBS event. Personally I'd hate to see a team drawn, banned, removed from the Jack, and not replaced. Had that scenario unfolded the board would then be criticized by some for not be decisive, whether that's right or wrong.

My personal decision was based on ALL of the info available to me Wed. night. When Mr. Pomerantz called me on Sunday to explain his side I told him I wouldn't make a decision until the board met, and I also suggested to him that he should communicate his side to the ENTIRE board sooner rather than later because I did not believe that he'd have 30 days until the next scheduled meeting. I can't, and won't, speak for the rest of the board but I don't feel that I rushed to judgment.

The Board made the right call deciding that the team needed to be punished. They totally screwed up the punishment and I am quickly loosing confidence in what they are doing. We voted you in because you said you would be fair and responsible and I don't feel that is being done on this matter. Who of you on the board has the balls to admit your wrong and your punishment needs to be adjusted to fit the crime? My guess would be nobody because you are hard headed and this is what we have come to expect for you. Just wanted to point out I love KCBS and am not a BoD basher, this is just not right!

Shane, read that and tell me that you don't understand why Jeff thought it went a little far. If you tell me that I made a mistake and explain why you believe that I'm fine. When you tell me I'm hard headed and have no balls, I'm not sure how you expect me to not take that at least somewhat personally. Knowing you personally, I'm sure I take that somewhat differently than those that don't know you at all would.

 

[USMC_BBQ]

For the sake of clarity...Is your name Jesse?

No, but Jesse is a friend,yeah, I know he's been a good friend of mine
But lately something's changed that ain't hard to define
Jesse wore himself an apron and he got himself a fine

 

[Jorge]

In speaking with some people, it seems the individual who had the apron on has done some things at past contests that were very inappropriate. I don't know if it is true, but maybe someone can tell me if this is true. It seems to me that he is an individual that has caused some problems before. I don't believe evrything I hear that's why I am asking the question.

I don't know who you talked to, and I can't really discuss the information presented in executive session. I can tell you that I don't recall having any information presented to me that the individual wearing the apron had a history of "problems" or anything like that. You might want to share that with your source, and suggest that they might want to quit sharing that scoop.

 

[WineMaster]

My personal decision was based on ALL of the info available to me Wed. night. When Mr. Pomerantz called me on Sunday to explain his side I told him I wouldn't make a decision until the board met, and I also suggested to him that he should communicate his side to the ENTIRE board sooner rather than later because I did not believe that he'd have 30 days until the next scheduled meeting. I can't, and won't, speak for the rest of the board but I don't feel that I rushed to judgment.

Thank you for explaining how you made your decision. It couldn't have been easy. I hope there is not alot of teams pushing buttons and seeing what they can get away with this weekend. Its time to put this thing to rest.

 

[moocow]

My reply was in answer to whether or not the board acted within 24 hours. There were actually three members of the board present at this contest. The board did have more first hand info than usual in this case, but I don't know that it drove the board to call the special meeting. There were multiple complaints submitted. One Rep did spend time talking with many teams at that contest, not just ToY contenders, and the feeling and comments were uniform and outspoken. There were also some time sensitive issues involved as well. One team is in the Jack draw. That draw will occur before the next scheduled meeting. Whether the Jack chooses to honor the ban is up to them. It's not a sanctioned KCBS event. Personally I'd hate to see a team drawn, banned, removed from the Jack, and not replaced. Had that scenario unfolded the board would then be criticized by some for not be decisive, whether that's right or wrong.

My personal decision was based on ALL of the info available to me Wed. night. When Mr. Pomerantz called me on Sunday to explain his side I told him I wouldn't make a decision until the board met, and I also suggested to him that he should communicate his side to the ENTIRE board sooner rather than later because I did not believe that he'd have 30 days until the next scheduled meeting. I can't, and won't, speak for the rest of the board but I don't feel that I rushed to judgment.



Shane, read that and tell me that you don't understand why Jeff thought it went a little far. If you tell me that I made a mistake and explain why you believe that I'm fine. When you tell me I'm hard headed and have no balls, I'm not sure how you expect me to not take that at least somewhat personally. Knowing you personally, I'm sure I take that somewhat differently than those that don't know you at all would.

Jorge, I have no problem with them being punished. I just don't like the fact that the punishment was so harsh considering some of the punishments that were handed out in the past for other infractions. We need to come up with some new rules and a way to investigate and enforce them. If there were a situation at a contest where the law had to be called because the cooks were out of line and the situation became dangerous it might warrant that type of punishment but it seems unfair to do that without a rule in place. A three year ban is a lifetime ban in my opinion, I am not saying they did not deserve it and i am in no way standing up for them. They made a very bad decision. You are one of the most stand up guys I know and no doubt have a big ole set between your legs. Sorry to ruffle your feathers, I should not have used the "balls" comment. I do have confidence in the Board and I am sure they will get this corrected for future problems.