Stickburners! [Poll]

[Fsonicsmith]

After trying so many approaches I found that what works best for me is to run a very calm fire using full splits—making sure flames are never pulled into the cooking chamber and placing logs to reduce airflow and prevent the fire from growing too strong—while using the damper and the firebox door to achieve a large mass of hot air moving slowly through the cooking chamber, rather than having a really hot log-powered hairdryer

Every smoker is different. Stack height and diameter, smoke collector, port between fire box and cook chamber, direct flow vs. reverse flow.
I do not believe in dirty fires. If a clean burning fire causes your meat to taste like it was cooked on a pellet pooper than something else is likely wrong. It is completely false to state that smaller fires create more heat and dry out meat. Perhaps with your smoker and the way you cook the meat dries out but it would not be due to that. It might be due to having too small a fire for your particular smoker causing cook times to be lengthy. In fact, the reverse tends to be true-hot and fast cooks will often result in more moisture in the meat at the greater risk of not having optimum tenderness.
And though I say that there are no absolutes, dirty smoke leads to off-flavors virtually always. As bizarre as it might sound, it is analogous to incomplete or flawed distillation of spirits leading to non-desirable compounds that cause hangovers. So to keep with my analogy, if you and your friends like your hooch than nobody can say differently but others likely would not be so fond of it.
Every time I have encountered someone who says "BBQ gives me heartburn" I say well try mine and they find out only certain BBQ gives then heartburn.

 

[SirPorkaLot]

Every smoker is different. Stack height and diameter, smoke collector, port between fire box and cook chamber, direct flow vs. reverse flow.
I do not believe in dirty fires. If a clean burning fire causes your meat to taste like it was cooked on a pellet pooper than something else is likely wrong. It is completely false to state that smaller fires create more heat and dry out meat. Perhaps with your smoker and the way you cook the meat dries out but it would not be due to that. It might be due to having too small a fire for your particular smoker causing cook times to be lengthy. In fact, the reverse tends to be true-hot and fast cooks will often result in more moisture in the meat at the greater risk of not having optimum tenderness.
And though I say that there are no absolutes, dirty smoke leads to off-flavors virtually always. As bizarre as it might sound, it is analogous to incomplete or flawed distillation of spirits leading to non-desirable compounds that cause hangovers. So to keep with my analogy, if you and your friends like your hooch than nobody can say differently but others likely would not be so fond of it.
Every time I have encountered someone who says "BBQ gives me heartburn" I say well try mine and they find out only certain BBQ gives then heartburn.

While I agree with most of that, I do think too much emphasis is put on “dirty smoke”.

There’s some that think if they see any white smoke they ruined their meat. lol

 

[Fsonicsmith]

While I agree with most of that, I do think too much emphasis is put on “dirty smoke”.

There’s some that think if they see any white smoke they ruined their meat. lol

We're still in agreement. I said so in the other thread-some dirty smoke is inevitable and is not normally harmful. No one in their right mind is going to feed a firebox from a burn barrel. Some folks knock the bark off their splits. I prefer no bark and if it is falling off I take the rest off but I go to no great lengths to remove the bark. It burns off quickly.
I will say it again-it is great that every smoker works differently and that even with one smoker there may be multiple ways to get the desired results. I personally don't understand how gravity feed insulated cabinet owners and pellet cooker owners stay interested in backyard Q. Many of the ones I have met don't seem to think much about the process other than with fork and a beer in hand. They have their place in comps but comps and backyard Q have little in common.
I hate to keep bringing up AF but he writes in his book that as flawed as his first "curbside freebie" smokers were, he eventually learned how to make some passable brisket on them. Like my high school photography teacher said on the first day of class looking at fifteen of us with our parents SLR's around our necks, "I got news for you idiots, I can take far better photos with this here Brownie camera than you can with those fancy cameras you borrowed for this class".

 

[sandro]

I find there's a distinct difference in flavor between thick yellow slow moving dirty smoke, and white "dirty smoke"—the former seriously ruins your cook, I would go as far as to say it has a numbing effect on my tongue to some degree

I don't purposely run dirty, inefficient fires, but I do let the fire do whatever it wants—I used to worry whenever a slightly thicker, maybe less seasoned split produced white smoke for 10 minutes before it caught; I'd go there and blow on it or move it around to increase airflow... Things we all do or used to. Turns out it's completely fine. Better than fine actually, meat cooked with fires going naturally through the cycle of white -> blue -> thin blue -> transparent taste so much better, and the cooks are so much more enjoyable and relaxing

My cooker is a weird beast. It's quite small (1/4" 16x36, about 31 gal) but has an oversized stack and firebox (4"ø and over 2' tall, and the firebox is 22" long) and pulls like crazy if I leave everything be

 

[Lynn Dollar]

Jimmy Daniels, founder of Workhorse pits, has a YT channel called Quetorials. He once had a vid on that channel of taking a Yoder Wichita and modding it to improve the air flow. He put a collector and larger stack on it and cut out the convection plate. He's taken down that video for some reason, who knows why.

He also spent $25,000 for a course in computational fluid dynamics, per him Tweeting about this, to learn about air flow through a smoker.

I find it ironic now, that there's people with Workhorse pits who are closing off the exhaust to cut down the air flow and turn their Workhorse into a Yoder Wichita.

Why ? Because the editors at Texas Monthly magazine decided one Texas barbecue joint was better than 49 ( or more ) of the others. So whatever they do at that joint, must be the best , huh ? I guess so, if you worship at the feet of Danel Vaughn.

I'm sorry folks, but this is getting ridiculous.

For every one of you people claiming better barbecue from cutting down your air flow in your cooker, there's a bunch on the Old Country facebook page who've cut the stack off their Brazos, added a collector, and cut out the baffle and now are saying their barbecue is a lot better.

Whatever lights your fire.

 

[sandro]

For every one of you people claiming better barbecue from cutting down your air flow in your cooker, there's a bunch on the Old Country facebook page who've cut the stack off their Brazos, added a collector, and cut out the baffle and now are saying their barbecue is a lot better.

Whatever lights your fire.

I feel there's a misunderstanding here—more or less airflow doesn't necessarily make your cue better or worse; the crux of the matter is having the choice to! Sometimes ya really need to slow down the airflow, sometimes to speed it up. Depends on the fire, the weather, the wind. A factory Brazos doesn't give you this choice as its flow is barely enough, worse still with a Yoder. On the other hand, an undampened Franklin might tend to pull way too hard with little adjustments left to the end user. It's never about a dogma, always about choice. I'm cooking a brisket today, it's gonna be tasty, even though I'm fighting 40mph wind gusts. Always great having these discussions, one's food can only improve from them

 

[Lynn Dollar]

I feel there's a misunderstanding here—more or less airflow doesn't necessarily make your cue better or worse; the crux of the matter is having the choice to! Sometimes ya really need to slow down the airflow, sometimes to speed it up. Depends on the fire, the weather, the wind. A factory Brazos doesn't give you this choice as its flow is barely enough, worse still with a Yoder. On the other hand, an undampened Franklin might tend to pull way too hard with little adjustments left to the end user. It's never about a dogma, always about choice. I'm cooking a brisket today, it's gonna be tasty, even though I'm fighting 40mph wind gusts. Always great having these discussions, one's food can only improve from them

How do you know this ?

You don't. Its pure speculation on a message forum, without any real experience to back it up.

You read what other people say.

You watch YT vids.

And then you repeat what you're " learned " . And a lot of other people are doing the same thing. And it creates a lot of bunk.

 

[sandro]

How do you know this ?

You don't. Its pure speculation on a message forum, without any real experience to back it up.

You read what other people say.

You watch YT vids.

And then you repeat what you're " learned " . And a lot of other people are doing the same thing. And it creates a lot of bunk.

Observation and deduction; Brazos have a reduced OKJ exchange and a long downward deflector 3” off the bottom, coupled with a plenum which is a smaller diameter than its exhaust, flow will always be impaired, that’s fluid dynamics at work; factory Yoders suffer from similar issues because of their stack, wouldn’t be surprised to learn that most people take out the baffle and run it as an open offset instead. Didn’t you mod your Brazos as well? I feel you’ve got a bone to pick with the YouTube crowd because there’s a lot of information nowadays but I think it’s great, gatekeeping makes bad food, and as an Italian I’m very familiar with that issue

 

[Lynn Dollar]

And everything you just said comes from what you've read on the internet. You know all about it, without any real experience. Message board experts are a dime a dozen.

Stuff gets repeated so often that it becomes fact. It goes beyond ridiculous.

A factory Brazos can make some very good barbecue. How do I know this, I've done it.

You've just proven my point.

 

[sandro]

And everything you just said comes from what you've read on the internet. You know all about it, without any real experience. Message board experts are a dime a dozen.

Stuff gets repeated so often that it becomes fact. It goes beyond ridiculous.

A factory Brazos can make some very good barbecue. How do I know this, I've done it.

You've just proven my point.

Why’d you mod it then? Either way I don’t really appreciate the weirdly targeted toxic way this discussion is evolving into, it’s best to leave the thread to other people that want to stay on topic, cheers!

 

[Lynn Dollar]

And btw, if ya want some dirtied up smoke at the start of your cook ............ just go charcoal/chunk.

You can save yourself a lot of money and trouble with a WSM.

 

[Lynn Dollar]

Why’d you mod it then? Either way I don’t really appreciate the weirdly targeted toxic way this discussion is evolving into, it’s best to leave the thread to other people that want to stay on topic, cheers!

I added a stack extension. I couldn't tell it did a whole helluva lot and took it off. There was no difference in my barbecue.

Other than adding an LSG fire basket to help me with the fire. I did nothing else to it.

And oh yeah, I fixed the leaks from the sprung door.

 

[Bob C Cue]

Can we please get this thread back on track? I think we were talking about the feasibility of a smoker that uses little pieces of wood. Perhaps they could be pellet shaped or something like that.

 

[Fsonicsmith]

Can we please get this thread back on track? I think we were talking about the feasibility of a smoker that uses little pieces of wood. Perhaps they could be pellet shaped or something like that.

I think it was about how you run you stick burner-wide open or damped or somewhere in between. Oh, I get it now. You're making a joke. Sorry.

 

[sudsandswine]

 

[4ever3]

We’ve gone from this…



To spending $25,000 to study smoke (if true, that’s where two fools met) all trying to achieve the same thing.

Then we have cigarette smoke drawn from 10', in open air? Video or it didn’t happen.

If I could make a wager, the open pit food and experience would rival anything today.

Ok y’all keep arguing, this has been good reading!

 

[sandro]

If I could make a wager, the open pit food and experience would rival anything today.

If only that pesky downstairs neighbor of mine wouldn’t mind me digging a hog-sized hole into his ceiling. One can dream

 

[TXArmy]

Morning Brethren. For conversation's sake and to continue the convo, attached are some pics from my cook this morning. Stack 1/2 open, firebox vent 1/4 open, Shirley Tel-Trus 285, all 3 grate temps cruising within 10 degrees. Been steady for 3 hours adding 2-3 splits every 40ish min and running TBS.

 

[Fooball]

Morning Brethren. For conversation's sake and to continue the convo, attached are some pics from my cook this morning. Stack 1/2 open, firebox vent 1/4 open, Shirley Tel-Trus 285, all 3 grate temps cruising within 10 degrees. Been steady for 3 hours adding 2-3 splits every 40ish min and running TBS.

Ok...That's sounds good but now you've got me wanting a food pic of what you're cooking!

 

[TXArmy]

Lonely butt and bacon for bfast. Whole jerk chicken and comp thighs (trial run) will go on around noon. Such a different sight compared to last weekend....