Confusion with Appearance Scores (Or I hope you are as dumbfounded as me)

[Bentley]

But they are relevant due to the fact that because they are always the lowest score the second lowest score is always counted.:mrgreen:

Bing fricken go!

 

[musicmanryann]

Bing fricken go!

Not sure what that means.?

 

[monty3777]

I really think there is a good possiblity that the four was data entry - handwriting problem, esp. since the issues these reps had the week before in Sedalia. I just dont trust their work.


The four really makes no sense to me at all

Back when I used to finance depreciating assets I had a car loan that was ~$400 per month. One month my bank statement showed I was $500 over my limit. After checking my statements I realized that my 4 was mistaken for a 9.

Wouldn't that suck if the judge in question was giving you a perfect score?:roll:

 

[Bentley]

Not sure what that means.?

If I get a 9 8 8 7 6 5 were the 4 judges wrong and the 2 others correct?

If I get a 6 6 7 6 6 5 I can understand, my BBQ was average...Its when you get the other scores you scratch your head.

Like many have said it is a roll of the dice after 7 years of competing I am slowly accepting that.

That is why I have allways given a comment card if I score a 5 or below, I believe I owe it to that team to articulate why.

 

[musicmanryann]

OIC, sorry--I was previously not privy to that colloquialism. Thanks for the education.

 

[daedalus]

When you think about the times you judged, do you ever ask any at your table if they cook BBQ at home or even compete? The majority of them in MY area don't. And couldn't give a rats a$$ how much effort you put into the boxes. They are there for the "good BBQ" and have the balls to sit and pontificate. And if you call them on it they get all defensive and just scurry off with their ziplocks! I never see them at the awards and never had one stop by and introduce themselves to me after judging, I know who some of them are and cringe when I see them walking past my booth with their coolers. Professional Eaters! Judge Farked-I like that one!

But it wouldn't be a ballgame without an Umpire, and love or hate them its all their opinion.

Why would a judge be supposed to care about the effort that goes into the boxes. They aren't judging effort...only the end result. If effort was a criteria, they would put judges at your tent during turn-in time and score how hard you worked at it. Having said that, I do think that there are good judges and bad judges, just like there are good cooks and bad cooks. It is unfortunate when a bad judge ruins the effort of a good cook, like in this case.

 

[Bentley]

Why would a judge be supposed to care about the effort that goes into the boxes. They aren't judging effort...only the end result. If effort was a criteria, they would put judges at your tent during turn-in time and score how hard you worked at it. the effort of a good cook, like in this case.

Excellent point...!

 

[Pickin' Porkers]

We all fuss about judging and I even judge. I REALLY try to look at the product and not the other garbage. My limit was surpassed a few weeks ago when we got a comment card from a judge that said "sauce smears on the lid". Gave us a 5 on appearance. GEESSSSHHHH....LOOK at the MEAT not the presentaion for goodness sakes.....and yes..I showed the card to the rep.....not much thay can do but PLEASE reps....EXPLAIN to the judges that these types of comments are NOT what they are to look at.....it's as bad as star struck judges at an MBN cook-off......

 

[Gadragonfly]

Everytime I see a thread like this I want to ask the Admins to give us a "Judging" forum (CJT - Continuing Judges Training), perhaps a subforum of Competition BBQ where teams can post pictures and we can critique and discuss why we judge the way we do. Perhaps the person who gave 4s and 5s on these two entries would feel more comfortable if the thread was developed to discuss why one person would give a 5 and another a 9. I'd love to discuss ribs - the different type of ribs and how to judge the large shaggy looking ribs - are they supposed to look shaggy or are they cut wrong? What about brisket, what gives a brisket a score of 9? Not from the cooks point of view but from a judges pov. Maybe through discussion and debate we can find some common ground. I always hate hearing my table captain say "These teams have come from a long distance and spent a lot of money. They deserve honest judges and I like to see high scores for their efforts. This is all well and good provided all of the tables are getting this same lecture and all of the tables are going to score high for the time and money put into the weekend. I figure each team has similar amounts of money invested and we should all (every table) be judging on the meat....not how much it cost to get that large gas guzzling rig to the meet. So, would teams be willing to submit boxes to be "judged and judges scores critiqued in an honest manner?" I know there are other threads (such as this one) where pictures show up and questions are asked, but most of the time these threads break down to competitors saying their competition got hosed by the judges. Not exactly a constructive way to train our judges. Just my 0.02. What say those of you with more experience than me?

 

[Ford]

We all fuss about judging and I even judge. I REALLY try to look at the product and not the other garbage. My limit was surpassed a few weeks ago when we got a comment card from a judge that said "sauce smears on the lid". Gave us a 5 on appearance. GEESSSSHHHH....LOOK at the MEAT not the presentaion for goodness sakes.....and yes..I showed the card to the rep.....not much thay can do but PLEASE reps....EXPLAIN to the judges that these types of comments are NOT what they are to look at.....it's as bad as star struck judges at an MBN cook-off......

Now the Rep should have talked to that judge right then. The rules for judging were revised awhile back and you don't score sown for sauce on the lid.
However if the sauce on the lid came from the meat in the box then the comment really was the meat looks poor because the sauce was all smeared and messy because the lid rubbed. That is legit scoring. I know that's not what was written in this case but maybe the judge combined a number of thoughts and hoped you'd figure it out.

 

[BBQ_Mayor]

OIC, sorry--I was previously not privy to that colloquialism. Thanks for the education.

Ryan, you just can't use these big words here. me no understand.:shock:


Bottom line is, we have judges that look at a box and try to find the things that the cook did wrong. On the other side, we have judges that look at the box and try to find what the cook did right.
We can't change that, turn in your box and hope for the best.

I would question the 4 being a possiable 9 thought.

 

[bignburlyman]

Right or wrong I have heard judges comment that they gave a good apperance score because there was a lot of meat in the box. Earlier I commented on the rib box about too much green in the front and a following post was slightly critical comment regarding that observation. I felt maybe I should explain "MY" judging technique---I "TRY" not to look at the garnish, as after all it is a meat contest right? I don't look for sauce smears on the box, I don't care if you use lettuce or parsley, and usually I couldn't even tell if you used kale (which is a DQ). Some teams put extraordinary effort into their garnish and some seem not to care. Sometimes you see the same thing with the meat in the box. Part of my comment to STLGREG regarded the rib box looked unbalanced, another rib sideways across the front may have made a big difference to the eye. It is hard to judge from a picture, I always try to look at the box from each angle as the table captain is passing it by. I do take judging very seriously, and I appreciate all the effort everyone puts into their turn-ins.

I took 4 Legs Ups' cooking class last winter and after building my first box using parsley (and thinking this is a major pain in the rear!) I finished the rest of the boxes with flat leaf lettuce and only framed the meat in the box. We were judged by a group of certified judges that were brought in---and I placed 2nd overall. If only I wouldn't have overcooked my chicken and ribs, lol.

David Keyse
CBJ #5112

 

[motley que]

As a judge, when the box is opened, if I get a feeling of "man that looks great, cant wait to taste it", odds are it will get a 9. I dont care what the garnish is, I just want a nice looking box, but i focus more on the appearence of the meat. 7's & 8's are just below that standard.

 

[J Appledog]

As a CBJ and occasional competitor I find this a really disturbing thread. I was an art major; my turn-in boxes are always pretty. As a judge I judge ONLY the appearance of the MEAT in the appearance category. What's so hard about that?

I love FBA....

 

[stlgreg]

Right or wrong I have heard judges comment that they gave a good apperance score because there was a lot of meat in the box.

Once I was a table capatain and a rib box came through - appearance scores were 4 9s and 2 7s. I asked the two guys why the gave it 7s and one told me "the box was too full," then the other guy agreed.

Too full of ribs? I just shook my head and went onto the next category.

 

[Bentley]

Once I was a table capatain and a rib box came through - appearance scores were 4 9s and 2 7s. I asked the two guys why the gave it 7s and one told me "the box was too full," then the other guy agreed.

Too full of ribs? I just shook my head and went onto the next category.

Just like some of the comments I have read on this Forum that there was to little meat in the box.

As long as it has the required amount, should that matter?

And as an experienced CBJ, I have seen boxes that are too full for my prefrence. That is when you have to try and judge the meat and leave your personal prefference at the door. Problem is to many judges won't!