KCBS non member fees

[Jeff Hughes]

Im not sure if I got this right. But I understood it as the 25$ fee was not going to KCBS, but to the organizer.

so, as an example. An organzier needs $175 per team. Thats his price.

His contest gets promoted as $200 for non KCBS, $175 for KCBS members.

Organizer gets $175 for some teams and $200 for others. He will come out on his mark if he has 100% KCBS teams, or over by some percentage.

KCBS is not changing the sanctioning fee, or the per team fee, so they do not see any increased revenue.

Teams that foresee multiple contests in a season will most likley join to reap the benefits anyway, thats where KCBS may see an increase in memberships or revenue.

Nicely stated, that is my understanding as well...

 

[HoDeDo]

I think a non-KCBS team should have to pay more for the benefits that I get by being a member of KCBS.

Merle - I don't agree with your analogy. KCBS doesn't own the club the event organizer does and just pays KCBS to mange it.

This is the crux of my issue... I think each event has to look at the goals/needs of that event. If KCBS was ponying up for all the events, they could do whatever they want.

I am all for non-KCBS teams not getting KCBS additional benefits. Let me define that. The Organizer pays for sanctioning, and sanctioning is typically reflected in the entry fee. So ALL entrants should get the benefits of a well run event. Now, lets say a team is non-KCBS -- IF that is the case, then they do not get on the KCBS site "team list", and they are not allowed into the running for ToY points.

If KCBS really wanted to make some benefits for members only -- put the BBQ contest schedule, and scoring/results behind a walled garden. Then KCBS members only see it on the KCBS site. Anyone else attending must get thier info at the event when they are handed out. KCBS should focus on pushing the value of joining and the additional benefits you get as a member. The right to a well run contest is already earned when the sanctioning is paid for.

Also - lets remember that KCBS has talked about expanding that sanctioning to all kinds of other events. Chili cook-offs, bake-offs, etc. KCBS will likely not push for membership or "discounts" to cake decorators just because the KCBS sanctions/reps thier event.

The sanctioning is a service - paid for by organizers (and ultimately teams) We should keep that issue separate from finding other ways to bring non-KCBS members into the fold. Add other value... like ToY tracking, schedule access etc. and go from there.

I'm all for driving membership... but lets find a way to do it that benefits all

 

[NotleyQue]

I dont see what the big deal is. Its 25 dollars more for a year. Like 25 bucks is gonna hurt anyone financially.

If you want to compeat in a KCBS event you should have to be a member. Thats the way it is in most organizations.

It should be tacked on when you sign up for an event. $200.00 for KCBS members 225.00 for non members (which includes a 1 year membership to the KCBS and a year of the KCBS Bullsheet) That way there is no way out. I dont agree with offering less prize money for a non member.

 

[big blue bbq]

So if I follow this correctly, a member of the USGA pro golfer say Tiger Woods for instance, could not compete in the British Open without paying more money than all the brits. Lets see Big 12 can't play against Big 10, and AFC can't play against NFC! I think that covers it.
I am planning to join the KCBS so I can get points in the TOY, but if I get points without joining I may not.

All said in jest.

I really don't see the big problem. As many have said I thought it was to spread the art of BBQ and I didn't know you needed to join a club to do that.

 

[Rub-A-Dub]

What are the true benefits of the KCBS? What do they do for there members? I get a newsletter and a $25 discount at each event I cook at. Is there a ranking for the year? Cash or check for the #1 team. Is there discounts at stores? Just looking for some good info other than the website. Wanted to here what the KCBS has done for it members.

 

[Plowboy]

Good presentation of your opinions, Andy. :eusa_clap You made a lot of sense there.

Also - lets remember that KCBS has talked about expanding that sanctioning to all kinds of other events. Chili cook-offs, bake-offs, etc. KCBS will likely not push for membership or "discounts" to cake decorators just because the KCBS sanctions/reps thier event.

I'm setting up and All Crock Pot contest called "Low and Slow".

 

[ssbbqguy]

Hello, On above question, I see an entry fee as right to the purse, providing all other criteria being met. If this would be different treatment for non-member versus member, then get ready for more discord and unhappiness. The fee is like the contract, so must be diclosed accordingly. Just my opinion, ssbbqguy

 

[tonto1117]

Im not sure if I got this right. But I understood it as the 25$ fee was not going to KCBS, but to the organizer.

so, as an example. An organzier needs $175 per team. Thats his price.

His contest gets promoted as $200 for non KCBS, $175 for KCBS members.

Organizer gets $175 for some teams and $200 for others. He will come out on his mark if he has 100% KCBS teams, or over by some percentage.

KCBS is not changing the sanctioning fee, or the per team fee, so they do not see any increased revenue.

Teams that foresee multiple contests in a season will most likley join to reap the benefits anyway, thats where KCBS may see an increase in memberships or revenue.

Exactly. Either you perceive the KCBS is a "value Add" to a comp (i.e., standardized judging; sanctioned for national ratings; points for key events like the Daniels, etc) or you don't. Whether you are a serious hobbyist or competitior for bigger bucks, you have to make a decision regarding sanctioning.....backyard/neghborhood pass time or serious, head to head with the best. Promoters can choose to sanction via KCBS or not. I think KCBS membership should be optional but we seek out KCBS sanctioned events and, because we perceive a 'value add', may not beef as much at the entry fees.

just my 2 cents..........

 

[kcpellethead]

how about changing the wording to

Should KCBS members receive a discount at Sanctioned contests.

Thank you Phil. I was hoping someone would suggest that language.

Rod

 

[River City Smokehouse]

how about changing the wording to

Should KCBS members receive a discount at Sanctioned contests.

I see your point Phil, but it's too late now. People have already jumped because of how it was proposed and now it can't be viewed as a discount.

 

[smoke-n-my-i's]

Let's see if I have this right...

As a member, then a non-member, and now a member again.

As a member, I competed in a single competition my first year.
As a non-member, I competed in two competitions last year.
Now as a member again, I want to compete more, but will see how my work schedule goes, the price of gas etc.....

KCBS wants the organizers of the competition to penalize a non-member to KCBS an extra $25 to compete. Now the organizer has the black eye for penalizing the non-member. KCBS is saying that the organizer is charging it, not us.

Now if you want to save that $25, you can join, (pay us $35 a yr) and it will save you money starting your second comp. And we get an extra $35 a year from you. And you get a pile of advertisement we call the BullSheet.

So, in order to compete beginning 2009, if you are not a member, you will have to go somewhere else than a KCBS competition, because from what I read, you will not be allowed to compete. It looks like KCBS is trying to be the dictator here.

What is next, if you don't have the right membership with the right BBQ Society, you will be banned from going from state to state to compete because you cross the boundary into another societies area?

I agree, why not just unite, make it the USBS and all be happy. USBS is United States Barbecue Society.

Let's drop the territory, we are a bigger society than you, and if you don't play by our rules you can't play. Are we in this for the sport, or for the money making business? And yes, I agree, what other benefits do we have as being a member than a monthly paper full of advertisements that collect dust and fill up our landfills?

My $0.02 worth. Maybe I should have waited awhile before rejoining again. Is it really going to be worth it to only compete a couple of times a year, not likely.

 

[BBQchef33]

So, in order to compete beginning 2009, if you are not a member, you will have to go somewhere else than a KCBS competition, because from what I read, you will not be allowed to compete.

im too tired to read all this stuff now, but on first read, I don't think thats an accurate interpertation. Anyone can compete, it will just be a higher fee for non memebrs.

 

[BBQchef33]

Rod, Merl.. someoene on BOD..

Just curious... is this a proposal? An inquiry?? testing the waters?? or already set in stone?

 

[ThomEmery]

Well you could always join the KCBS

Jeez Boys this isn't that big a deal
Just join or if you only cook once a year
give me the extra $25
I promise to spend it wisely

 

[Sawdustguy]

Let's see if I have this right...

As a member, then a non-member, and now a member again.

As a member, I competed in a single competition my first year.
As a non-member, I competed in two competitions last year.
Now as a member again, I want to compete more, but will see how my work schedule goes, the price of gas etc.....

KCBS wants the organizers of the competition to penalize a non-member to KCBS an extra $25 to compete. Now the organizer has the black eye for penalizing the non-member. KCBS is saying that the organizer is charging it, not us.

Now if you want to save that $25, you can join, (pay us $35 a yr) and it will save you money starting your second comp. And we get an extra $35 a year from you. And you get a pile of advertisement we call the BullSheet.

So, in order to compete beginning 2009, if you are not a member, you will have to go somewhere else than a KCBS competition, because from what I read, you will not be allowed to compete. It looks like KCBS is trying to be the dictator here.

What is next, if you don't have the right membership with the right BBQ Society, you will be banned from going from state to state to compete because you cross the boundary into another societies area?

I agree, why not just unite, make it the USBS and all be happy. USBS is United States Barbecue Society.

Let's drop the territory, we are a bigger society than you, and if you don't play by our rules you can't play. Are we in this for the sport, or for the money making business? And yes, I agree, what other benefits do we have as being a member than a monthly paper full of advertisements that collect dust and fill up our landfills?

My $0.02 worth. Maybe I should have waited awhile before rejoining again. Is it really going to be worth it to only compete a couple of times a year, not likely.

How the hell did you come to those comclusions. I think you are just trying to make trouble. If you really feel like that I think it's time for you to get a different hobby.

 

[Rub-A-Dub]

ok before I get flamed. I just wanted to know what the benefits were to being a member.

 

[LostNation]

Im not sure if I got this right. But I understood it as the 25$ fee was not going to KCBS, but to the organizer.

so, as an example. An organzier needs $175 per team. Thats his price.

His contest gets promoted as $200 for non KCBS, $175 for KCBS members.

Organizer gets $175 for some teams and $200 for others. He will come out on his mark if he has 100% KCBS teams, or over by some percentage.

KCBS is not changing the sanctioning fee, or the per team fee, so they do not see any increased revenue.

Teams that foresee multiple contests in a season will most likley join to reap the benefits anyway, thats where KCBS may see an increase in memberships or revenue.

Phil, your 100% accurate.This is a way for KCBS to add some value to your membership. KCBS gets no money from this other then some added members. It's up to the contest organizer to decide how much effort they want to put into checking into members status. If cooks don't want to join then the organizer gets a little extra cash that they can use to their discretion. I don't think this conflicts with other cooking society's throughout the country.

 

[ThomEmery]

Rub out here we have CBBQA KCBS and IBCA asking you to sign up
Belonging is up to you
The CBBQA Children's Charities, subscription to National BBQ News
support for the contests you want to cook, CBBQA Team of the Year
It is a deal at $36
KCBS Sanctions our large events fine group of folks You get a newsletter
with info you can find on the web (should just shift to National BBQ News)
Mostly you are supporting the group so they will be there
IBCA Sanctions our smaller events The Western States Pit of the IBCA
Has sponsored and gotten two Head Judges for these small contests
So a group that has a tight budget can still do a sanctioned cook off
Joining supports the efforts of guys like me Who spend more than our wives know
keeping BBQ Growing out here

 

[Roo-B-Q'N]

I have already stated why I believe it is appropriate. But I want to ask a very serious question. Please accept that I do want to see the other side.

If I want to play tennis or golf and I am not a member of a club, I can usually purchase a visitors pass. If I want to attend a function at an Elks or Moose lodge and I am not a member I may attend as a guest, but pay a visitors fee. There are many places where non members are charged a temporary fee for use. This helps offset the cost of use and running the place or organization.

My questions is Why would a non KCBS member object to a use fee and second, why would a KCBS member want to pay the load for a non member to utilize the services of KCBS?

Please don't flame this. I really am trying to understand the issue.
Thank you
Merl

Merl,

According to this poll, and the other thread regarding this issue nobody has a problem with non kcbs members paying more.

What the organizers are saying is to not put this on them and do not make them look like the bad guys. If KCBS feels so strongly about this, have the reps check membership cards at each event and collect AND keep the the extra $25.00 or $35.00 dollars.

It is not worth it to me to have our event bashed by the few because they had to pay more or be forced to join something they obviously do not want to join.

 

[lunchlady]

I just wanted to know what the benefits were to being a member.

well, there is the Bullsheet, the brotherly love, the discounted entry fees, also they have added in a hotel discount, I believe the Clarion chain. There are more benefits, but I haven't checked in a while.

For example, we were going to get two to three hotel rooms on the way down (and back) to the Jack. That KCBS discounted rate (for members ONLY) ALONE would have practically paid for my membership.

I agree this probably could have been worded differently, it would have made a big difference in the way it hit people.

I also believe that ALL BBQ societies should work together for the betterment of our SPORT. We are all in this together. One issue is that this is growing so quickly that there are things that our predecessors NEVER had to think about, and now, everything has to be resolved in REAL TIME... with the advancement of technology everything has to be RIGHT NOW... by the time the meetings happen, people have already gnawed on the subject for a while and made their own, strong opinions about everything.

Send your opinions to your BoD members!!!!! That is the only way to get things accomplished. Bashing it out on any forum , while fun and an interlude from this long winter, it isn't doing much of anything in the way of progress.

Send your thoughts to your BoD, and vote for the people who you think will represent!

can't we all just get along?