Judge the Rib box.

[ihbobry]

No I dont.

Where are we instructed to do this? Is it a personal prefference he is bring to his judging? Why they am I wrong to bring my interpretation.

What would you give your box based on the picture? Based on your impression turning it in? Why for both?

 

[Jorge]

Your right its not. I was refering to how judges are to judge the meat. And they dont say anything about taking the cut, the color or how the fricken sauce is brushed on the meat either. I may be wrong? If I am someone please show me where it shows this so the next time I judge I can apply these rules!

It's about attention to detail. If my ribs taste like yours, and are as tender as yours, but my knife isn't as sharp, or my cut isn't as straight, and a judge notices it...it SHOULD make a difference.

Results are available on the KCBS website. Take a look at how close many/most contests are at the top. It's the attention to detail that separates the winners.

If you want to be judged at that level, you will take the advice given to heart.

 

[Scottie]

Spot on right Jorge... I've lost a championship this year by a .5.. I know others have lost it by .0008... Details win or lose a contest for you...

 

[Papa Hogg]

You didn't answer my question. If you don't take color, cut, amount of sauce, and how it looks on the ribs into consideration, what are you looking for to differenciate one box from the next? What criteria make up your personal judgement?

If you don't judge appearence on these things then what are you judging the appearence on???

 

[Bentley]

Perhaps you might consider taking a KCBS judging class. Or a class taught by one of the best KCBS cooks. You can find that info on the KCBS website and in the Bullsheet.

I did, in KC in 2003 from Ed! Good idea for any team, I agree!

 

[Bentley]

You didn't answer my question. If you don't take color, cut, amount of sauce, and how it looks on the ribs into consideration, what are you looking for to differenciate one box from the next? What criteria make up your personal judgement?

It is overall apperance, I just dont think a wrong brush strok or a rib that is not perfectly symetrical makes a difference. Do I want to eat it, that is my primary mode of distinction. If the sauce stroke is wrong or the cut is not right does not make it look less appitizing to me, to some of you it may make a difference!

 

[Bentley]

What would you give your box based on the picture? Based on your impression turning it in? Why for both?

Look at my post with the scores.

 

[jbrink01]

I hate to see comments like your cuts are off, sauce is to thick, the greens are to busy, color is uneven...I think that is just BS, but you are just like the average judge, it should not matter but it does. Its a Farken meat contest, what the hell does it matter how the fricken rib is cut, or the color is off (I have been competing 6 years & I don't know what that means), or if the sauce is even!

As I cut the farken ribs I knew they were gonna look bad it the box. Wanted to Hollywood them, but a BB does not lend itself well to this cut! Did it anyway! As I look back at the box I think I would have given it a 7 if I was judging it.

I think you that gave a 6 are a little low, if you think that is an "average" rib turn in I would very much like to see what you think a 9 is? Is a 9 possible in your mind?

Your scores 77677766677776.

The judges scores 6 8 9 9 9 7...Go figure!

Thanks again for the input.

Been following along, and this is the post that bothers me. I give this box a 6. When I took my CBJ class, the samples were pathetic, albeit intentionaly so. The rep's were trying to make the point, and did it with me several times, that the 4's and 5's I was handing out were unwarranted. That the teams had worked hard, and that a 4 was harsh.

I disagree, if you want to play in the big leagues, be ready to take a few hits. EVRYTHING matters. It's a BBQ contest, not just a meat contest. All of the little things combine to provide a presence, a "how much do I want to eat this" feeling. These leave me way short of perfection.

You suggest above that perfection may only exist in my mind. You are wrong. I have seen it, and I have on the rare occassion felt I produced it. To me, perfection in ribs vs. these is; darker, "stickier", more even, and a little less flamboyant garnish.

In my mind, 4 issues = 4 points lost.

 

[jbrink01]

It is overall apperance, I just dont think a wrong brush strok or a rib that is not perfectly symetrical makes a difference. Do I want to eat it, that is my primary mode of distinction. If the sauce stroke is wrong or the cut is not right does not make it look less appitizing to me, to some of you it may make a difference!

I believe sir, that you are wrong. Everything conspires to create a pleasing pallete. Just as artists work in canvas and oil, some of the guys on this forum use the styrofoam box and meat as their canvas, and they are good at it!

 

[DMDon]

It is overall apperance, I just dont think a wrong brush strok or a rib that is not perfectly symetrical makes a difference. Do I want to eat it, that is my primary mode of distinction. If the sauce stroke is wrong or the cut is not right does not make it look less appitizing to me, to some of you it may make a difference!

Ok, let me ask this another way. Without knowing what they will taste like, what makes you want to eat one box more than another? What are the factors that help you make that decision?

 

[Scottie]

It is overall apperance, I just dont think a wrong brush strok or a rib that is not perfectly symetrical makes a difference. Do I want to eat it, that is my primary mode of distinction. If the sauce stroke is wrong or the cut is not right does not make it look less appitizing to me, to some of you it may make a difference!

so how do you lose points? As it sounds like your scale is either 9 or 5.... No in between. A bad cut, minus a point? A bad sauce, minus a point? et al.

 

[ihbobry]

Look at my post with the scores.

Trying to avoid the bad Karma so I repose the question...

What's does an Average rib look like to you? Frayed edges.. bare spots? Boiled looking? Piled like a fist full of whatever dropped on a plate?

Your driving a conversation and being given a lot of room because people on this board may just be the politest on the internet. Please stop being so coy and answer the questions before I assign you get the ignore user designation Sled used to occupy. :twisted:

 

[Jorge]

It is overall apperance, I just dont think a wrong brush strok or a rib that is not perfectly symetrical makes a difference. Do I want to eat it, that is my primary mode of distinction. If the sauce stroke is wrong or the cut is not right does not make it look less appitizing to me, to some of you it may make a difference!

See my post above. I can look at individual entries and score them seperately, and apply the same standard.

If your cut isn't clean, it will cost you. If your cut isn't straight, it will cost you. If your sauce/glaze isn't even, it will cost you. If your sauce is just a little too strong to really taste the meat, it will cost you. If your meat is so salty that it overpowers the sauce and forces me to guzzle water, it will cost you.

Some people might call that arbitrary, but I call it subjective. The fact of the matter is that judging is subjective. You asked for input on your box, and you got it. The judges at your event, according to your post were more generous than the cooks and judges here.

What point are you trying to make, or what is it that you are trying to learn or understand? Reading the entire thread I'm not sure what else you want to gain from this.

 

[ihbobry]

EVRYTHING matters.

Bentley...That's why there is an appearance score, may not be defined, but a ragged edges uneven cut because you need to save your rack, or don't care presentation with sauce applied just like Mr. Kraft would have done is what you want... I'd say you got it... and need to stop laughing and pointing @ the judges that scored you too high. (by your own admission)

 

[Bentley]

Been following along, and this is the post that bothers me. I give this box a 6. When I took my CBJ class, the samples were pathetic, albeit intentionaly so. The rep's were trying to make the point, and did it with me several times, that the 4's and 5's I was handing out were unwarranted. That the teams had worked hard, and that a 4 was harsh.

I disagree, if you want to play in the big leagues, be ready to take a few hits. EVRYTHING matters. It's a BBQ contest, not just a meat contest. All of the little things combine to provide a presence, a "how much do I want to eat this" feeling. These leave me way short of perfection.

You suggest above that perfection may only exist in my mind. You are wrong. I have seen it, and I have on the rare occassion felt I produced it. To me, perfection in ribs vs. these is; darker, "stickier", more even, and a little less flamboyant garnish.

In my mind, 4 issues = 4 points lost.

Should be a 5 then, not a 6!

 

[Bentley]

Ok, let me ask this another way. Without knowing what they will taste like, what makes you want to eat one box more than another? What are the factors that help you make that decision?

Dont know till I see the box.

 

[Bentley]

Please stop being so coy and answer the questions before I assign you get the ignore user designation Sled used to occupy. :twisted:

No one is making you read this thread! LOL

 

[DMDon]

No one is making you read this thread! LOL

Good point!! Makes my decision on how to proceed much easier. See YA

 

[Bentley]

What point are you trying to make, or what is it that you are trying to learn or understand? Reading the entire thread I'm not sure what else you want to gain from this.

At first to see if the judging at Clovis would be roughly the same as here. I thought there would be enough of a cross section of Brethren who cook on teams, CBJ’s who don’t and people who have done neither.

After seeing some of the post regarding why people were scoring down, I tried to figure out why. I took the CBJ class from Ed Roith at The Royal in 2003 before we competed. Granted I was an Oiler then and do not remember everything from that weekend, but I do remember most of that class. I do not remember any instruction for grading the meats based on, how it was cut, or how the sauce was applied, or what color the ribs were. I am serious with these next comments…Maybe things have changed? I am guilty of it myself; I just told the one Brethren that I gave his brisket a 7 because the slices were “wavy”. It appears to me, the some of the people judging this box, judged it based on the way the color of the ribs looked, the cut or some other factor. Where were you taught this? That is now my main concern. Have I been out of the loop? Did I miss something that has changed in judging? We do not have continuing ED. Hell for that matter, I got feed up with KCBS an am no longer a member, so I am an ex-CBJ I guess.

It seems to me I am made to feel my judging is wrong if I do not score down for these issues, but you are right for taking points off. Why is my personal interpretation less valid then yours? Where is the consistency in the training of judges?


Like I said in an earlier post, maybe I am suppose to be judging off for this stuff, but I have not seen anyone show we where it is written!

Thanks for asking Jorge.

 

[TOPS BBQ]

Bentley,

I was there and I ended up placing 30th in ribs. I know my ribs are not the best, but it's something I have been working on. After reading this thread, I agree with most of what's been said. I have judged a couple of comps myself and when I see angled ribs or miscut meat, I will not score them as high. We are supposed to or are striving to be the best, so why should we get upset when our scores reflect what we turned in? Albeit, there are instances that don't warrant bad scores, but those are not as common. Since you shared, this is my turn-in. I too cut "Hollywood Style" and had some angled pieces. After looking at the pic, I saw uneven garnish and muddied sauce on the rib.