No judges "Doggie Bags" at Red, White, and BBQ

[jmoney7269]

I am fully in favor of banning coolers from the judging tent.

There was a contest not too long ago where judges canceled at the last minute because coolers would not be allowed. That alone says to me that a cooler ban will flush out some who shouldn't be in the tent.

Yeah their called eaters! And good riddance!

 

[BRBBQ]

"No judges "Doggie Bags" . Seems like his comment pertains to judges, not donating to homeless people. I cant see any judge figuring out what team cooked unless there's only 5 teams compeating every week :shock: If I took some food home it was beacuse I didnt want to waste it plain and simple. :thumb:

 

[accuseal]

Right up there with dumpster diving and blue hairs going to restaurants with a baggie in their purse.

 

[Sawdustguy]

I actually think this whole thing is bullchit. I think very few judges eat less on purpose to take food home. I think this whole thing has been blown out of proportion by some cooks that needed an excuse for not winning. Give me a break.......:tape::evil:

 

[Alexa RnQ]

I think this whole thing has been blown out of proportion by some cooks that needed an excuse for not winning.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I'll stand on our record and disagree.

 

[Funtimebbq]

I think it is important to include no grazing either if in fact part of the reason is health and safety. It's important to be consistent in your beliefs. That excess food just sits for a couple of hours. Most judges who are taking their food home at least have some sort of ice/cooler.

 

[Scottie]

I pushed for it and will stand with my record and need no excuses... it is about being judges fairly. Do all judges do this? Absolutely not. But it is like anything else that one bad apple can ruin the whole bunch.

 

[daedalus]

First, a couple of points so you know where I am coming from.

1. I don't take food home. I have taken the occasional baggie of brisket or pork in the past if I intended on making chili the next day or something, but for the most part, If I like it, I eat it right then and there. For me, it is typically just not worth the hassle.

2. I have judged nearly 100 contests, and have literally never, not one single time, noticed another judge sitting at my table not sampling or barely sampling an entry.

3.I also compete. Not often as I would like too, but I am out there when I can.

4.It is my opinion that Wasting food unless there is a truly compelling reason is wrong. Plain and simple.

Now having said that, my first question is where this issue is really coming from in the first place? Are there any reliable sources with first hand knowledge of this going on in great enough numbers to warrant this sort of all-encompassing ban? I realize that just because I have not encountered such behavior doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but I would think that if it was this pervasive an issue, I would have run across it happening at least once.

As to the apparent concession by some to the idea that wasting food is perfectly acceptable, it is my opinion that If someone will eat it, then they should be allowed to do so. The fact that it sounds like many of my fellow competitors would condone, much less demand, this sort of gross wastefulness is frankly a bit distasteful to me.

I understand the food safety argument, and I can see where the HD's are coming from, but I think that banning coolers is the least elegant solution possible. I think that a simple waiver would eliminate any real liability. If a judge wants to take food home, it should be entirely at their risk. If they are too stupid to care for the food properly, they deserve to get sick.

The suggestion that if the judges wanted food to take home, they should just go to some of the teams after the judging and ask for some is just silly. In typical contest, the judges will not really start coming out of the judging area for nearly 30 minutes after last turn in. By then, most of the teams are either packing up, or sitting around in half-a-coma because of what they just went through. Either way, you have to be pretty good friends with a team to feel comfortable popping into their area and asking for food.

Please understand that I do not believe that the judges are necessarily "entitled" to take food home. It should be up to the governing body, in this case the organizer(or HD), to decide whether or not take-home food is allowed. It should be known up front, and then a particular judge can decide if they want to participate in that contest or not. It would just be another factor in deciding where to judge...no different than indoor vs. outdoor judging, swag from a particular event, or how close the contest is. It would also give teams the same chance. If a team really feels that they won't get a fair shake if the judges are allowed to take food home, they can just not cook that contest. I wonder if the numbers of teams or judges would really change very much. It would be an interesting study.

 

[MWRobison]

No judge doggie bags

Having only judged 26 contests in the past three years, I don't have the full range of experience as some of the other posters, but I can also say that I have not seen judges only taking small bites so as to have more to save for taking home.
I'm also a certified KCBS table captain and I have never seen any judge nibble an entry. My wife, who is also a judge, has only seen it once.
Also, keep in mind that that you don't need to take 3-4 bites to know what something tastes like- do you take 3 big bites of undercooked chicken/pork before you decide it's bad? I think not.
As someone else noted, if you eat all 24 entries in a contest, you will be too full to do a good job, so all the judges I know pace themselves to be able to focus on judging accurately.
Finally, to those who expressed the idea that no one would want to eat leftover BBQ entries, how many of you just throw away all the remaining meat, once you've built your boxes? After all, it's now "leftovers".
BTW, I would say that about 50% of the judges take food home- the rest just toss the food.
Both cook teams and judges put in time, effort and money to support competitions and for the judges,being able to take home some of the really good BBQ we get to judge is a benefit, I would be sad to see go away.

 

[Rich Parker]

Having only judged 26 contests in the past three years, I don't have the full range of experience as some of the other posters, but I can also say that I have not seen judges only taking small bites so as to have more to save for taking home.
I'm also a certified KCBS table captain and I have never seen any judge nibble an entry. My wife, who is also a judge, has only seen it once.
Also, keep in mind that that you don't need to take 3-4 bites to know what something tastes like- do you take 3 big bites of undercooked chicken/pork before you decide it's bad? I think not.
As someone else noted, if you eat all 24 entries in a contest, you will be too full to do a good job, so all the judges I know pace themselves to be able to focus on judging accurately.
Finally, to those who expressed the idea that no one would want to eat leftover BBQ entries, how many of you just throw away all the remaining meat, once you've built your boxes? After all, it's now "leftovers".
BTW, I would say that about 50% of the judges take food home- the rest just toss the food.
Both cook teams and judges put in time, effort and money to support competitions and for the judges,being able to take home some of the really good BBQ we get to judge is a benefit, I would be sad to see go away.

It is good to hear from seasoned judges that they don't see the "nibblers" in the tent as much as the cooks hear about it. Like Scottie mentioned above it is always a few bad apples that ruin it for the rest.

When I sample my bbq before or after putting it in the box, I always throw away the piece I sampled. For the bbq that didn't get sampled; chicken always gets tossed, ribs sometimes dependent upon how they turn out, pork goes home normally to sell, and brisket goes home for me to eat. At Westmont this year, I will bring a pan of chicken, ribs, and pork to the judges tent for the volunteers and judges.

 

[Alexa RnQ]

As many of you know, BBQTV posts videos on YouTube that include shots of the judging mats after judging, with audio of judges discussing the entries. These videos originate from all regions.

These still shots are taken from those completed judging mats. Can you indicate to me where a healthy bite has been taken from each sample to provide a fair basis for judging?

 

[EatonHoggBBQ]

I have judged over 60 contests and I see nibblers all the time. They take one little bite off of the end of their sample then quickly fill out their score card and turn it in. Then they stuff the remaining nearly pristine samples into their zip-loc bags and put them in their cooler. It's amazing. They have all of this accomplished buy the time I am on my third sample. Gheezzz!!!! :clap: I SUPPORT NO COOLERS IN THE JUDGES TENT :clap:

 

[Skip]

I have judged over 60 contests and I see nibblers all the time. They take one little bite off of the end of their sample then quickly fill out their score card and turn it in. Then they stuff the remaining nearly pristine samples into their zip-loc bags and put them in their cooler. It's amazing. They have all of this accomplished buy the time I am on my third sample. Gheezzz!!!! :clap: I SUPPORT NO COOLERS IN THE JUDGES TENT :clap:

If this is happening on a regular basis then I retract everything I said. I just hope your experience is the exception not the norm.

 

[Pappy Q]

I don't think taking home food should be allowed, for no other reason than it just seems tacky to me. And I don't buy the reasoning that someone doesn't want to see food wasted when the truth is they just want something to eat at home. I turn in a box to be fairly judged by "qualified" judges, not to be taken home for dinner, lunch or ingridents in someone's chili, soup, salad etc.

 

[carlyle]

Obviously a hot button issue here.

What I want to see from the organizers, committee people, teams, and judges who were there is a report after the event - how did this work out for you from your particular perspective???? Does banning coolers really make a difference in the contest for you when you are looking at it in the rear view mirror? If teams are giving away left overs, how do you work that and how is it received?? And how do you deal with a cook and judge coming face to face with competition entries where they can easily be noted and identified the next time a judge encounters them???

Our contest is only 5 years old - 6th in a couple of weeks. There have only been 2 judges I won't let come back due to cooler stuffing. It is something that I look out for as judging is going on.

And the left over table - that is for table captains and all those volunteers who are out there busting their behinds to put on our festival weekend.

 

[Bratenmeister]

Judging a BBQ contest seems to me to be an incredibly inefficient and silly way for anyone to spend a Saturday to aquire meat be taken home for dinner, lunch or ingridents in someone's chili, soup, salad etc.

People have witnessed nibbling judges. Are all the nibblers carrying coolers or do they have some other quirk or motivation for nibbling? Who knows. The pics from the bbq channel do not shed light on the judges' motivations, although they do seem to show entries that might not have been given a fair taste.

The most important thing happening in the judges tent is fair judging, and cooks should come away feeling that they had a fair shot. If eliminating coolers will also eliminate this issue and distraction, then perhaps a universal ban on coolers is the best option put this issue to bed. I suspect, however, that it would not end nibbling for the rare judges that do.

 

[kurtsara]

Finally, to those who expressed the idea that no one would want to eat leftover BBQ entries, how many of you just throw away all the remaining meat, once you've built your boxes? After all, it's now "leftovers".

the remaining meat is leftover but not leftover that has had a bite take out of, so there is no saliva sitting on the meat until you eat it again.

 

[Bourbon Barrel BBQ]

As someone said, most judges spend travel money and time (hours of driving), some also with hotel expenses, because they enjoy good BBQ and want to be a part of the process and judge fairly.

And how do you think that compares to the time, travel, work, and money the comp teams deal with? If this rule stops even a fraction of 1% it's worth it. A judge will lose nothing but some gross left overs. A team has a helluva lot more on the line and a lot more to lose. Have the event organizer ask the teams for left overs and you will find plenty that will step up and feed the eaters. God know's they deserve it for the huge sacrifice they make.

 

[Bratenmeister]

And how do you think that compares to the time, travel, work, and money the comp teams deal with? If this rule stops even a fraction of 1% it's worth it. A judge will lose nothing but some gross left overs. A team has a helluva lot more on the line and a lot more to lose. Have the event organizer ask the teams for left overs and you will find plenty that will step up and feed the eaters. God know's they deserve it for the huge sacrifice they make.

Nothing I wrote ever suggested that judges deserve to take home leftovers because they have expenses, time, etc.

 

[Gowan]

Judges are not allowed to take food from the judging tent at any contest I supervise. This policy is stated up front on the judges application - if it's a deal breaker for any CBJ, they simply need not apply and look for another event. We do make arrangements for those judges who wish to take home food to obtain it from teams in a safe manner that does not affect the judging process.

I've never had a problem getting all the judges needed.

As to the argument about wasting food: if this is a personal concern you should avoid competition cooking entirely. Large quantities of food are thrown away at every contest in every stage, from preparation and trimming to the grazing table. More than a few cooks simply discard cooked meat they have not used for turn-in. If you define waste as food that is not consumed, then the entire process is wasteful by definition. On the other hand all that meat, produce, spice and sauce is paid for and the producers benefit from the sale the same as if it were consumed, so by that measure there is no monetary waste.