KCBS BoD's Meeting Re: Judges Scores

[midwest_kc]

The low scoring judge is tossed out anyway, so why were they upset over the celebrity judge? Honest question, not being argumentative.

It matters in the case of tie breakers, which depending on the size of the field, sometimes there are quite a few of them. Others, not so much.

 

[Bob in Corona]

I quit competing in KCBS contests in 2012. That was the same year I received a 5 and 9....on the same meat, at the same table and not a single comment card was issued.

With that kind of inconsistency with scoring, it was not much more than a crap shoot, so why bother?

Have reiterated this before and will continue to do so...
(Disclaimer : It was NOT SirPorkaLot's box !)

I knowingly given a team's rib sample a 5 in Texture while the rest of the table gave 8s and 9s. (I also issued a comment card)

Does this make me one of 'THOSE' judges ? Maybe.

Then again... Maybe Not !

You be the judge...

As I was removing the sample from the 9x9 box, the meat fell off the bone. The texture score of 5 represented my honest critique of the rib I received.

Was I one of 'THOSE' judges.... ???

It is possible to have such a variance from a single box... Thankfully, Cooks spend the time to test each and every sample within their box to reduce that possibility.

 

[pharp]

Disclaimer: I like KCBS and feel like when I sign up to compete the rules and expectations, good or bad, are what I am signing up for. With that being said, as a relatively new competitor can anyone tell me what downsides there would be to having a diagnostic scoring system? I don't want to spend a long post explaining the methodology, but if the scoring system could remain essentially the same but build it so there is a diagnostic component wouldn't that be helpful to cooks? Using tenderness as an example, if 1 is undercooked, 5 is perfect, 9 is overdone, and the scores are calculated based on the variance from 5...wouldn't that solve the lack of comment card issue and help the cooks know how to improve? If I got 3 9's and 3 1's I would be scratching my head like I am now...but if you got 3 5's and 3 7's you would know that you turned in an entry that was too done for some or had some too done pieces.

 

[Bob in Corona]

I am NOT in favor of using ONLY a judge's scores to determine seating.

I would be in favor IF and ONLY IF a calculated numerical value was used representing how I scored relative to the table average.

 

[DUBBAGA]

I am NOT in favor of using ONLY a judge's scores to determine seating.

I would be in favor IF and ONLY IF a calculated numerical value was used representing how I scored relative to the table average.

bing bing bing, we have a winner ... what's your prize you ask, behind door #1 is a lifetime BOD seat with the CBBQA, and behind door #2 is an unfed great white shark... what will it be??? :mrgreen:

 

[SirPorkaLot]

No chance in hell that the 5 might have been the cookers fault?

Every piece of meat in that box was EXACTLY equal to the rest?

Did you find a judge that scored correctly and the other five were high scorers?

A certain spice or flavor that judge really dislikes (perfectly fair on their part)?



Sounds like "I wasn't treated exactly as I felt I should have so I'm not going to play anymore".

Your prerogative I guess, just don't damn the judge without knowing all the facts.

Not giving you a comment card? Judges prerogative, not his job to teach you competition BBQ cooking.

Ed

Not blaming the judges..blaming the system.
I believe the 5 was an aberration (and I should have had a comment card telling me why) the rest of the scores were all above 7.

I can't change the system, but I can always make the choice to change what I am doing, and I did.

I still compete, but I'd rather take my chances with smaller non-sanctioned events.
I still get to do what I enjoy and not worry too much about why the results are so inconsistent. I expect them to be, as there's not a whole bunch of CBJs involved.
Funny how that works isn't?

 

[Okie Sawbones]

It matters in the case of tie breakers, which depending on the size of the field, sometimes there are quite a few of them. Others, not so much.

Thanks. I found it on page 12 of the manual.

 

[Funtimebbq]

Crawled back out of the hole to say, KCBS has spoken and they will only go with two types of seating and some kind of 3 strikes deal regarding judges. Don't know if that is scoring related or no-show related, maybe both.

There were some posts here, such as how using average scoring to seat would not work due to the huge number of no-shows at some contests. This is something I discussed with the two KCBS Board members during my advocating for average scoring. The use of the Judge sign up program or Judge BBQ would take care of judges signing up for multiple events on the same weekend and waiting for organizers to say they are in/out. Organizers can ask for a fixed number of judges and the system will not allow for more than that. The judges will know at the time they use the system if they are in, thus having no need to sign up for multiple contests and then backing out of all but one. The system could also prevent judges from signing up for more than one contest per weekend by tracking their membership number. KCBS needs to do a better job of encouraging organizers to use the judge sign up program. It is a benefit for the judges and relieves organizers of having to sign up so many judges to make sure they have enough on their contest weekend. For cooks, it helps prevent those contests where tables only get 4 to 5 samples because so many extra judges are seated.

One final thought about using average scores (not going to happen, I know). Think of each contest as an individual game during an entire season. Yes, judges like baseball players will have good/bad outings based on the team's offerings (or which pitchers a batter faces that day). But it is the season average that ball players are judges on. I truly believe judges' overall scoring averages are like that. Over the long haul the average (batting or judging) doesn't lie.

I promise this is the last post regarding average scoring from me.

 

[Funtimebbq]

Sorry for resurrecting this thread.
KCBS ran a pilot program at various contests across the country where seating of judges was done using each judges average scores. The pilot program even took into consideration no-show judges by having a new list of table assignments after the judge check-in process was completed.
Anyway, the program was so successful, teams (including Funtime BBQ) in Las Vegas this past weekend were told table assignments at all KCBS events beginning in 2018 would be done via computer using judges average scores. Las Vegas did use that system as well. Thanks KCBS for ending the TOD and TOA complaints.

 

[djqualls]

Sorry for resurrecting this thread.
KCBS ran a pilot program at various contests across the country where seating of judges was done using each judges average scores. The pilot program even took into consideration no-show judges by having a new list of table assignments after the judge check-in process was completed.
Anyway, the program was so successful, teams (including Funtime BBQ) in Las Vegas this past weekend were told table assignments at all KCBS events beginning in 2018 would be done via computer using judges average scores. Las Vegas did use that system as well. Thanks KCBS for ending the TOD and TOA complaints.

This system won't fix anything.......... Mark My Words...........

 

[CBQ]

This system won't fix anything.......... Mark My Words...........

From what I've seen (and the contests I've been it that used it) it seems to work pretty well.

 

[Pappy Q]

Sorry for resurrecting this thread.
KCBS ran a pilot program at various contests across the country where seating of judges was done using each judges average scores. The pilot program even took into consideration no-show judges by having a new list of table assignments after the judge check-in process was completed.
Anyway, the program was so successful, teams (including Funtime BBQ) in Las Vegas this past weekend were told table assignments at all KCBS events beginning in 2018 would be done via computer using judges average scores. Las Vegas did use that system as well. Thanks KCBS for ending the TOD and TOA complaints.

No way this puts an end to TOD & TOA. Probably helps but doesn’t end it as I’ve seen TOD at comps that used the system this year.

 

[gettinbasted]

Normalize the scores. Lower highs, higher lows. Ignore the problem, ignore food quality. This is the most ridiculous and Ill thougt out “solution” to a problem that I’ve ever encountered.

The worst outcome possible is that this “works”. The cure is worse than the disease.

 

[gettinbasted]

FYI, the top 3 brisket scores in Vegas this weekend (including mine that was absolutely doused in Blues Hog) were off of the same table. It gives me hope that this will pass and we can move on to a solution that attempts to solve the problem instead of masking it.

 

[jaestar]

It looked like the top three chicken scores were also from the same table.