Need help asap!!!

[Pyle's BBQ]

The reason I ask, is that I was trying to determine how long the fire had been out. If you knew the temps we could get an estimate as to how long the fire had been out. Your next cook I would try to find this out. That way you will have some idea on how far behind you are in a cook.

 

[Dex]

The reason I ask, is that I was trying to determine how long the fire had been out. If you knew the temps we could get an estimate as to how long the fire had been out. Your next cook I would try to find this out. That way you will have some idea on how far behind you are in a cook.

The more I think about it, I dont think it could have been out too long.

The FEC has a internal temp probe that detects the cooking temp. When it is low, the auger feeds pellets quicker to fuel the fire.

The reason I say I don't think it could have been long is because the fire pot was just over half full (and the pot isnt that big.) I would assume as the temp dropped the auger would have been spitting out pellets quicker trying to feed the fire.... meaning it wouldnt have taken long at all to fill it half way up.

Just checked the meats with my thermapen. Pork butts in the upper 150s and brikets in the mid 160s

 

[Pyle's BBQ]

Well good luck. I don't believe you will have any quality issues. Post picture in the morning.

 

[daedalus]

I would be fairly concerned. While It is true that getting the meat up over 165 will kill any living bacteria that may have developed, but that is not the entire issue. Part of what causes food poisoning is what the bacteria leaves behind while it is active. That does not go away once the temp comes up. If it did, then no one would ever get food poisoning from fully cooked meat, and that is not the case. That is why there are time related guidelines for the danger zone. If it is in the zone for only a little while(under 2 hours...ish) any nasty bacteria will not typically have had time to do enough damage to be a huge issue. Once you kill off the live stuff, you are ok. If is longer than that though, it becomes a major concern because there may be too much residual damage.
I hate to tell you to throw it all out and start over, but I think you have to ask yourself an important question. Which way do you want to be wrong? If you start over, you are out money and time. If you roll the dice and there is a problem, you make a bunch of people sick...maybe even really sick.
I don't envy your position. Good Luck!

 

[Pyle's BBQ]

I would be fairly concerned. While It is true that getting the meat up over 165 will kill any living bacteria that may have developed, but that is not the entire issue. Part of what causes food poisoning is what the bacteria leaves behind while it is active. That does not go away once the temp comes up. If it did, then no one would ever get food poisoning from fully cooked meat, and that is not the case. That is why there are time related guidelines for the danger zone. If it is in the zone for only a little while(under 2 hours...ish) any nasty bacteria will not typically have had time to do enough damage to be a huge issue. Once you kill off the live stuff, you are ok. If is longer than that though, it becomes a major concern because there may be too much residual damage.
I hate to tell you to throw it all out and start over, but I think you have to ask yourself an important question. Which way do you want to be wrong? If you start over, you are out money and time. If you roll the dice and there is a problem, you make a bunch of people sick...maybe even really sick.
I don't envy your position. Good Luck!

How long do you think the brisket and pork butts sit in the danger zone while cooking on a regular smoker. If I am cooking a butt for 10 hours and it takes 4 of those hours to get it to 160*, don't you think that the butt is in the danger zone for more than 2 hours?

 

[Dex]

I honestly think my fire was out for only 10 minutes. When I went out to check on it, the controller said it had been in "hold mode" for 10 minutes.

If you arent familiar with the FEC-100, you can set it to cook for a certain amount of time at a certain temp, then it will hold at a temp you have programmed... which mine was 250.

I must have done something wrong while setting the hold temp, or thats when the fire went out is when it started to dump more pellets to raise the temp. The reason I am thinking it had only been ten minutes is because like I mentioned before, thats how long ago the temp was supposed to change, and the fire pot isnt that big and was only half full.

 

[daedalus]

How long do you think the brisket and pork butts sit in the danger zone while cooking on a regular smoker. If I am cooking a butt for 10 hours and it takes 4 of those hours to get it to 160*, don't you think that the butt is in the danger zone for more than 2 hours?

That is an excellent point. I will have to think about that one. But how do you explain the fact that it is possible to get food poisoning from meat that has been fully cooked. If all you have to do to avoid that is get meat up over a certain temp, then I would think that getting sick from food would be a lot less prevalent. I am not trying to be argumentative...I seriously want your opinion.

 

[rondini]

If it was me I'd keep cooking. Then again thats why I have a UDS so I don't have to mess with timers and augers and electricity and stuff.

daedalus, from everything I've heard and read it's not the cooked meat as much as how it was handeled, by whom, with what, where placed etc.

 

[Pyle's BBQ]

That is an excellent point. I will have to think about that one. But how do you explain the fact that it is possible to get food poisoning from meat that has been fully cooked. If all you have to do to avoid that is get meat up over a certain temp, then I would think that getting sick from food would be a lot less prevalent. I am not trying to be argumentative...I seriously want your opinion.

That would come from improper handling after cooking. In the cooling or the reheating process is when that is most likely to occur.

 

[daedalus]

That would come from improper handling after cooking. In the cooling or the reheating process is when that is most likely to occur.

Agreed, but then why are there health regulations relating to raw meat. Most of the information that I have read says that you should not leave meat out at room temperature for over 2 hours. By following your logic, it sounds like you are saying that doesn't matter how long you leave out raw meat as long as you plan to cook it to 160 degrees, and then make sure you handle it properly after it is cooked?

Dex,
I am glad that you only lost fire for a few minutes brother! :thumb:

 

[SmokinAussie]

Thanks Bill. Do you think the quality of my end product will be just as good as it would have been if I didn't have the fire go out?

I don't see any reason why not!

 

[Johnny_Crunch]

Anyone vomiting or dead yet?

 

[El Ropo]

I don't care for the temps you were shooting for with that much food in the cooker. If it were me, I would of started out at around 250 for first hour, then ramped up the heat to 300ish to finish. Low and slow isn't the holy grail.

I like to sleep. Smoking low and slow is a waste of valuable sleeping hours. Smoking at a higher temp makes the end result more moist, with less time hanging around the smoker.

IMO low and slow creates an opportunity to dry out the meat. Hot and fast is the ticket for me. It will also get the meat into the "safe range" faster.

 

[VaGriller]

In the 130s after 8 hours? It probably didn't get out of the danger zone for 10+ total hours. I would have tossed it, especially with you vending it. Not worth the chance of making customers sick first time out.

 

[Pyle's BBQ]

In the 130s after 8 hours? It probably didn't get out of the danger zone for 10+ total hours. I would have tossed it, especially with you vending it. Not worth the chance of making customers sick first time out.

He said this is the way he always cooks this way. He didn't know what his temp of the meat is after 8 hours.

Just for reference, here is a thread that a Stoker was used to track the meat temp. As you can see the meat was in the danger zone for more than three hours.

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=100668&highlight=stoker

 

[VaGriller]

He said this is the way he always cooks this way. He didn't know what his temp of the meat is after 8 hours.

Just for reference, here is a thread that a Stoker was used to track the meat temp. As you can see the meat was in the danger zone for more than three hours.

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=100668&highlight=stoker

He said above that the meat temp was in the 130s after 8 hours. So it sat in the danger zone for at least 9 hours.

 

[SmokinAussie]

This "DANGER ZONE" rubbish is indeed that. A load of rubbish.

It refers to the SURFACE of the meat... Not the IT. If you are cooking a large cut of meat like this, you will ALWAYS have the IT in the "DANGER ZONE" for over 2 hours.

Please make more of an effort to understand the intent of the proper regulations on this. The INSIDE of the meat is STERILE, so there is no issue. If there was, you'd never be able to cook ANYTHING low and slow.

The external surface of the meat is the ONLY place where bacteria could grow, and they are killed by the smoker temperature.

The ONLY other way you can introduce a bacteria during a stall is to OPEN the cooker and introduce a bacterial strain. That is called "THE VECTOR".

If there is no VECTOR, then there can be no contamination.

Honestly people.... Spontaneous Generation does NOT EXIST!..

Please do not tell people to throw out perfectly good meat after a 10 minute stall...

Please do some further research before quoting this "DANGER ZONE" tripe....

Even a 2 hour stall, or a 4 hour stall... is STILL FINE.

Cheers!

Bill

 

[SmokinAussie]

And DON'T get me going about bloody Botulism.....:mad2:

 

[El Ropo]

He said above that the meat temp was in the 130s after 8 hours. So it sat in the danger zone for at least 9 hours.

That is what scares me. That just seems like an awfully long time between 40 and 140. Maybe 180 for one hour, then bump it up, but 8 hours?

Also, I was under the impression that meat never stops accepting smoke, but the smoke ring stops forming at around 140.

 

[VaGriller]

And DON'T get me going about bloody Botulism.....:mad2:

I'll keep it simple since you told me to research it before I spread wrong info. Please cite your scientific research and case studies to settle this debate once and for all. Then the mods can sticky this thread and we'll never have to see this question again!

Thanks!