What is average?

[watertowerbbq]

If I saw them in person I expect I would say to myself they look way above average for bbq from the back yard but they look average for a turn in.

If they looked way above average, then they are an 8 or a 9. Either they look good or they don't. The example I heard in the class was that the bbq looked so good you just wanted to jump in and eat it, not it looked so good that you want to jump in but you should expect that since this is a turn-in. IMHO.

I think the same would translate to the taste and texture.

same as above

another way to look at it is that if you are saying that it is great by backyard standards, but not up to contest standards, then by default you are comparing the entry to something else. you, as a judge, are instructed not to compare to any other bbq you have tasted, whether that be at the contest or in the backyard.

it is hard to not compare one entry to another. it happens. you're human.

remember you're not supposed to try and find fault with the cooks entry, but rather judge it fairly. one way to judge how you score with others is to discuss your scores AFTER all of the cards have been turned into the table captain.

 

[Mutha Chicken BBQ]

But let me ask this, And not to hijack the thread.
Having a word associated with the number now makes it subjective and makes you naturally associate the past experience of eating any food with the corresponding number. In other words a judge is now going to compare all food to each other. Weather intended or not.

Just my 2 cents, And great topic BTW

 

[KC_Bobby]

So a 7 is average based on what your saying here in the first part, the part about taking away someones chance at winning I don't understand. ( I do but I don't )

Maybe it goes back to what you are saying about backyard average vs competition average. I believe scores should be based on average BBQ - which would include backyard, thus I feel a 6 at the competition level is a little below average for most competitors. Without doing the math, I'd guess that most competitors finish above an average 6-6-6 total score.

If a judge gives someone a 6, either one of two things generally happened:
1) that competitor didn't do well with that turn in
2) if the competitor did do well, the judge that gave them the 6 most-likely didn't do well (see below)- cause the other judges must have viewed it differently

Of course if I received six 6-9-9's, I wouldn't complain much. Would that be about a 174?

 

[StLouQue]

I've also noticed listening to my fellow judges that most of them are not happy with everything being sauced so heavily and many have mentioned that they wish that KCBS would do away with the garnish.

Parsley sticking to a heavily-sauced entry is obnoxious. It's a good thing I am required to judge appearance before having to pick off the bits of garnish.

 

[lunchlady]

just another thought...

I think that maybe some judges are getting used to seeing 'above average' boxes all the time... wouldn't that then become their own personal standard? With the quality of competition nowadays, which I enjoy immensely BTW, even great looking boxes can become somewhat average

So when a team does everything 'right' and then still comes up with 6's in appearance... it's very hard to figure out why, to yourself - as that team.

So... how do you get stars to shoot out of the damn box when it is opened in order to get yourself an 8 or a 9 in appearance? :>

 

[Smokin Gator]

Florida BBQ uses a different scale but when I took the class the instructor told us two things that have stuck with me and given me a baseline to work from. He told us that "average" BBQ is Sonny's BBQ (anyone from down here knows Sonny's well). He said that would be a 7. If it is better than that then mark it up. If it is worse mark it down.

He also said that if it makes it to the table you should start at 7. Only mark up or down from there if it merits the movement.

 

[butts a fire]

just another thought...

I think that maybe some judges are getting used to seeing 'above average' boxes all the time... wouldn't that then become their own personal standard? With the quality of competition nowadays, which I enjoy immensely BTW, even great looking boxes can become somewhat average

So when a team does everything 'right' and then still comes up with 6's in appearance... it's very hard to figure out why, to yourself - as that team.

So... how do you get stars to shoot out of the damn box when it is opened in order to get yourself an 8 or a 9 in appearance? :>

I agree with you here it seems that the competition is getting better and the appearance of boxes is getting better along with it. If I see a great looking box it will get an 8 or 9 if every box I see that day looks great they will all get 8's or 9's even if every box I see is above average I will not adjust what average is to me and I think this is the issue does average change with the more boxes you see?