Competition costs

[Biged92]

This was our first year of competing, and we expected to be in the red at the end of the year. We limited ourselves to 4 contests so we could get a feeling of what it would cost us per event. After our 4th event we found that for local events (3 hours or less in distance), we could do a comp for about $900. This would include entrance fee, Comp meat(2 briskets, 4 butts, 6 racks of spares, and 18 thighs), fuel, and supplies. If we wanted to do PC, it cost us an extra $200 for the extra meat and serving supplies. But even with the PC, we were still in the red this year. For us this is a hobby, so it's really not a money making venture. Next year our goal is to up the number of events to 10, but even if we participated in PC we'll be lucky to to break even.

 

[Gowan]

Catering and vending doesn't count, that is no different than working at your day job to finance the team.

I think a lot of teams don't remember to include the cost of their fuel, lodging, cook rig, RV, wear and tear on the tow vehicle, etc. in their calculations. Especially when this is considered, I would guess only around 20% of teams have positive cash flow, and maybe half of those can keep it going multiple years in a row. Obviously sponsors make it easier, but at the end of the day it's a hobby for most of us, and hobbies are expensive.

New thought - if KCBS has somewhere over 2,000 active cook teams competing, that would mean 400 teams are making money by my above estimate. My gut tells me the real number is WAY less than that, so now I'm thinking the percentage of money making teams must be something in the single digits.

 

[DawgPhan]

Catering and vending doesn't count, that is no different than working at your day job to finance the team.

I think a lot of teams don't remember to include the cost of their fuel, lodging, cook rig, RV, wear and tear on the tow vehicle, etc. in their calculations. Especially when this is considered, I would guess only around 20% of teams have positive cash flow, and maybe half of those can keep it going multiple years in a row. Obviously sponsors make it easier, but at the end of the day it's a hobby for most of us, and hobbies are expensive.

New thought - if KCBS has somewhere over 2,000 active cook teams competing, that would mean 400 teams are making money by my above estimate. My gut tells me the real number is WAY less than that, so now I'm thinking the percentage of money making teams must be something in the single digits.

Dont remember the exact percentage, but when talking positive cash flow you have to be talking about teams cooking 5 or more contests per year. Anything less and it is just going to be really tough to make it work.

So really there are only a couple 100 teams that can reasonable be managing their cash flow.

Of course we have set the bar much lower and are happy with the great sponsors that we have and having entry fees paid from winnings. The only way this works are big calls though. Top 3 in a category and top 2 overall. Unless the organizer is smart and good looking enough to pay top 5-10 overall as well.

 

[DawgPhan]

Here is my advice though if you want to manage the money side.

Create a spreadsheet that tracks the cost of everything you need for a competition. It will serve as a checklist for packing/shopping and track your expenses.

Find 2-3 other guys that really want to cook bbq. That way it isnt all coming out of your pocket.

Get really good at cooking bbq.

Dont get involved in the BBQ arms race.

 

[kenthanson]

We are real lucky where I live to have 3 contests within a two hour drive of my house, with one being about a ten minute drive. A lot of teams that compete in the same three contests drive 4-6 hours to come compete with us, so the limiting of travel helps us keeps costs down.

We get our meats at cost from our local butcher shop, free charcoal from the local Weber store, don't use power at comps all save us money. $150 entry fees, $150 in meat, $100 extras=$400 minimum each contest, in three contests we walked away with $0, $275, $250. $1200 total minimum for three with $525 back in our pockets= $675 in the red divided by three guys, so it costed me $275 out of my pocket to compete in three contests.:shocked::shocked::shocked:

 

[EMTTLC]

I started playing in comps back in 04 and have never been in the black. 2012 was our best year with $6600 in prize money, and we were still in the red around $4000. I look at it as an expensive hobby. I have a number of friends who drop that much or more a year playing golf or boating.

 

[TooSaucedToPork]

With 10,000 BBQ teams out there, 10% in the black is a little high IMHO.

I would say probably 4-5% of teams are black or green. We always are in the red. Is it the $13,000 we spend every year at Memphis in May...yeah it is. But this sport isn't supposed to be about money. It is about fame and glory. It is about bragging rights. It is about the brother and sisterhoods cemented over beers on Friday night. It is about the cheer you get on your first walk. It is about trophies with little plastic pigs on top, and those elusive GC trophies made out of all different kinds of cool chit.

This sport is a money pit. We brave time, weather, burns, bugs, and booze. We chase glory every weekend, hoping our name is called last...that is worth its weight in gold!

Neil

 

[DUBBAGA]

Catering and vending doesn't count, that is no different than working at your day job to finance the team.

How does it not count? Their catering/vending/etc is typically a direct result of their performance at competitions, otherwise, they wouldn't be lugging around their trophies and awards to show how good they are. Maybe that argument would work if Rod Gray was using his competition success into building a name as a building contractor, but no, he is doing classes and selling product. Those wouldn't be taking place without his competition results.

.... having said that, I agree that a large majority of the teams are operating at a loss as it is a hobby. But I do not believe that is the case for most of the teams who competed at the King of the Smoker when you count all of their combined revenue sources (bbq related) on an annual basis

 

[ArnieTex]

With 10,000 BBQ teams out there, 10% in the black is a little high IMHO.

I would say probably 4-5% of teams are black or green. We always are in the red. Is it the $13,000 we spend every year at Memphis in May...yeah it is. But this sport isn't supposed to be about money. It is about fame and glory. It is about bragging rights. It is about trophies with little plastic pigs on top, and those elusive GC trophies made out of all different kinds of cool chit.

This sport is a money pit. We brave time, weather, burns, bugs, and booze. We chase glory every weekend, hoping our name is called last...that is worth its weight in gold!

Neil

Someone finally pointed out it is what it is.

 

[Hawg Father of Seoul]

How does it not count? Their catering/vending/etc is typically a direct result of their performance at competitions, otherwise, they wouldn't be lugging around their trophies and awards to show how good they are. Maybe that argument would work if Rod Gray was using his competition success into building a name as a building contractor, but no, he is doing classes and selling product. Those wouldn't be taking place without his competition results.

.... having said that, I agree that a large majority of the teams are operating at a loss as it is a hobby. But I do not believe that is the case for most of the teams who competed at the King of the Smoker when you count all of their combined revenue sources (bbq related) on an annual basis

Because that is work.

 

[TheJackal]

It is about trophies with little plastic pigs on top,
Neil

Including our brisket trophy we got this weekend! That's the secret to winning, guys. Cook pig briskets.

 

[gettinbasted]

Competition bbq is about making new friends on friday night and then beating them on Saturday. If you are doing it to make money, you will only be disappointed.

Someone mentioned this earlier, but I think it is a great point, I will spend the money somewhere. If I wasn't out cooking I would be golfing, going to a ball game, or out boating.

 

[DUBBAGA]

Because that is work.

Agreed, there is a lot of work involved in those ventures. But my point is that work wouldn't be possible without the competitions. So although there might be a net loss doing competitions, it is likely more than covered by the profits with the other ventures. It is no different than Pepsi paying for Super Bowl commercials... the commercials cost money, but they do it to get a net return in sales.

Maybe it would be better to use Harry Soo from Slap Yo Daddy as an example. He has a day job as an IT Mgr for a major company. There is no connection between his 9-5 job and his "hobby", he will not get paid more because he won a GC the previous Saturday. He does offer BBQ classes and has products for sale, but that is a secondary venture. How many of the teams invited by Big Poppa Smokers really consider competition bbq as a hobby, or is it their OCCUPATION? If it is the later, then they are most likely operating in the black (or recently won the Powerball and are independently wealthy)

 

[Scottie]

thats all part of the season....

So in reality, if they want to make more, they need to cook less. Or hit it big at the end of year TOY... Maybe BPS needs to pay more in sponsorship?


I sure can't argue though. I don't talk finances with folks. None of my business. I can only worry about mine.

 

[TooSaucedToPork]

Teams go into the black and green with sponsors, vending, classes, products, and of course winnings. They are all related.

The lucky few teams that have made a name for themselves winning, have then gotten sponsored, then could make more appearances at contests, and this leads to classes.

Then you have teams that vend, they make money vending, they supplement or even make profit going to contests...

Then you get the lucky guys that win the royal, or jack, or Memphis in may, and sponsors are way easier to get.

There are a bunch of ways to make money and pay for stuff in BBQ...counting on winnings ain't one of em.

 

[Candy Sue]

I am 2 weekends away from my 10th anniversary doing this thing we do.

Contest winnings go back into the contest pot for me. I have no sponsors, unless you count broken pellet bags. At one time, my co-owners (of BBQr's Delight) offered to pay the contest bills. I refused the offer, mainly because I want this to be my efforts and I didn't want the distraction of accounting for company funds. And I didn't want my winnings to go back to the company. This is my deal, if there isn't money to cook, I don't. For me it's a hobby. Company benefits from my marketing presence at events and there's a small tax benefit from certain expenditures.

I've been barely in the black one year out of 10 (then I got on the board and that's a whole nuther tale). I am very proud of that $40 actually. Cooked 17 contests that year. From 10 to 20 is about normal for me to cook. I have been told by much better (results wise) cooks that I should cook more. I can't disagree with that statement. Practice improves performance. Every time.

 

[AZScott]

I'd be in the black if I didn't dump all my winnings back into new equipment. I think the top teams aren't in the black because it's dumb to do so for tax purposes and barbecue toys are freaking cool. It only takes two top calls at most contests to leave with money, throw in a RGC or GC and your next comp or two are paid for. I know in the SW that when you decide to chase points and do 20+ contests out here your travel costs go through the roof. I'd actually expect teams that travel a lot to lose more than the guys that do 5-10 comps and do well.

 

[Gowan]

Agreed, there is a lot of work involved in those ventures... He does offer BBQ classes and has products for sale, but that is a secondary venture.

I'll grant that classes may be considered part of competition funding, at least to the extent that attendees are paying purely for knowledge transfer and not for food.

If you're selling any sort of physical product where there is substantial COGS (Cost of Goods Sold) then the fact that you are a comp cook is simply an endorsement. You're still putting in a separate investment in time and money to bring the product to market. Being a successful competitor may make it easier to sell the product, but it does not affect what it takes to create, produce, market and deliver that product in any significant way.

What I'm trying to express is that all the ways people expend their energy to fund a BBQ team outside of cooking competitions are essentially equal. It doesn't matter if you are working as dentist or as a caterer, selling tshirts on Ebay or BBQ sauce at festivals. In all these cases you are doing something above and beyond just cooking comps to raise funds for your team.

Sponsorships are different. There you are ostensibly doing nothing more that cooking comps and being paid to "wear the sponsor's hat" a la NASCAR. Of course the bigger the sponsorship, the more demands tend to come with it, but that is a whole different topic...