KCBS - How are we doing ?

[LostNation]

Ban coolers and removal of BBQ from the judging area!

Jeff,
I agree with most you have posted but I dis-agree with the ban of coolers. I spend a bunch of money on a contest, I'd hate to see my food thrown away because no one could bring it home. Maybe just use a turn in box for the leftovers from their judging plate, then the coolers outside the judging tent?

 

[Jeff_in_KC]

Jeff,
I agree with most you have posted but I dis-agree with the ban of coolers. I spend a bunch of money on a contest, I'd hate to see my food thrown away because no one could bring it home. Maybe just use a turn in box for the leftovers from their judging plate, then the coolers outside the judging tent?

Rich, what we turn in is such a small amount compared to what we're cooking. I don't have a problem with small samples being tossed. I think that until the emphasis is on scoring correctly and not seeing what you can take home to the family, no BBQ should be allowed to be taken out of the judging area. If I get a fair score on my entries, I don't care if they trash samples or not. :wink:

 

[cmcadams]

I don't mind coolers outside.... but during judging, I hate seeing judges get as much into their cooler as they can. I think some have too much focus on taking home food vs. judging fairly.

 

[Mooner]

I'm not sure what this means. I've read it twice.

I think what Greendriver was trying to say is the cooks should get to choose whether or not a contest runs Sat/Sun instead of Fri/Sat. Like if they had to work Friday or something it might be easier to check in on Saturday.

 

[Mooner]

Jeff,
I agree with most you have posted but I dis-agree with the ban of coolers. I spend a bunch of money on a contest, I'd hate to see my food thrown away because no one could bring it home. Maybe just use a turn in box for the leftovers from their judging plate, then the coolers outside the judging tent?

I think Jeff is probably saying that he has seen bbq judges take itsy bitsy bites out of a sample, then put it in a styrofoam cooler to take home to family or for themselves or whatever. These samples are meant to be eaten, there shouldn't be any leftovers. Take a proper bite, and throw the damn thing away.

 

[Bill-Chicago]

Tim had a great post about judging and cooler usage a few years back.

It still rings true today.

Post #9 in this scrubbed thread:

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13679

And Jims post at the end of this thread is just plain funny

 

[LostNation]

Rich, what we turn in is such a small amount compared to what we're cooking. I don't have a problem with small samples being tossed. I think that until the emphasis is on scoring correctly and not seeing what you can take home to the family, no BBQ should be allowed to be taken out of the judging area. If I get a fair score on my entries, I don't care if they trash samples or not. :wink:

I agree with cooking a bunch at a contest, I've cooked 18 slabs of ribs to get the best ones for the turn in box. That said, the samples I turn in are the best that I could cook on that given day, I don't want to see anyone throw my food out.

Judging is a very important component of our thing. I spend a weekend every year in the tent with the judges being a table captain. If the judges take a reasonable sample of the entry and score it against the standards we are cooking to then I have no problem with taking the samples home. I think the table captain plays an important part in this.

If you restrict them from having the leftovers from their plates, Do you think it will get harder to get judges at a contest?

 

[MoKanMeathead]

Merl - Aside from all of the judging comments I think we need more and better communication from the KCBS board. There have been a lot of moves in the right direction - Rod's meeting minutes in the BullSheet are great - why not put those on the web page? Also I have never seen a financial statement from the KCBS but I have heard that "The KCBS has a ton of money" Thjis is our group - why not post the financials in the BullSheet or the web page?

As far as removing food from the judging area, I guess I am on Rich's side (sorry Jeff). so long as they judge the product fairly - let them take the rest home.

 

[Bigdog]

First of all, let me say that I really respect what you are doing Merl by asking up our opinions. This is really a great way to get some input for the board. I have served on several boards, and all too often we are so wrapped up in what we are doing that we can not see the forrest from the trees. It is always refreshing and scary to get imput from the masses. Many times they can really help us to fix things that we had no idea needed fixing.

Secondly, on the topic of judging, I agree with Bro. Wayne. I agree that a judge should be allowed to take samples as long as he or she is doing a good job. If you need extra food for others, then just have the competitors put in some extra food.

Finally, remember that no matter what you do, some people will like it and others will not.

 

[QansasjayhawQ]

Nothing about KCBS is about a particular style of BBQ. It makes sense that BBQ will be judged differently in different regions of the country, but nothing in the rules, bylaws or structure implies that it should be judged "KC style".

Is your point that it should be called something other than KC BBQ Society?

Just a point of interest - probably should be a whole other thread . . .

 

[PigBoy]

Merl- the fact that you asked for opinions and are getting honest and sincere responses is a credit to your character and I applaud the job you and the board try to do. Some cooks talk about judges almost with hatred. I don't understand or condone this type of talk. Have I been disappointed with some scores- Absolutely! Maybe I haven't seen what some others have seen, but as far as coolers go I don't see a problem. A lot of these people just love BBQ. We had an older couple come by our site at Blue Springs contest and wanted to purchase some que. I noticed their judging badges and told them we didn't have any ready yet. (We were vending at this contest.) They looked really disappointed and said by the time we get done judging nobody has any left. I assured them we would and sure enough after they were done, there they were to buy some. They were so grateful! Just another side of the coin.

I really have a hard time when contests don't have a high % of CBJs. There are judging classes all the time. I think contest organizers need to be pushed harder to solicit certified judges. In some areas this could be a challenge, but in the KC area I don't understand why not.

 

[Plowboy]

Merl - What about a team database on the KCBS site? Like here, teams could add their own optional profiles with team members, locations, logos, web sites, emails, phone numbers. All optional of course, but what a great resource!!!

 

[Arlin_MacRae]

Merl,

I'm not a competitor but asking for honest feedback is a GREAT way to do things.

Back to the way beer judges do things (OK, it's what I know...) - after each judge is finished scoring the entry, the judges actually talk through the round and compare scores. Scores that are "too high" or "too low" are discussed and usually adjusted to provide more uniform scoring. This gives the inexperienced judges a chance to learn from the experienced ones and the folks that enter their meat don't have to scratch their heads and wonder what the hell so-and-so could have been thinking.

My two cents.

Arlin

 

[Bigdog]

Merl,

I'm not a competitor but asking for honest feedback is a GREAT way to do things.

Back to the way beer judges do things (OK, it's what I know...) - after each judge is finished scoring the entry, the judges actually talk through the round and compare scores. Scores that are "too high" or "too low" are discussed and usually adjusted to provide more uniform scoring. This gives the inexperienced judges a chance to learn from the experienced ones and the folks that enter their meat don't have to scratch their heads and wonder what the hell so-and-so could have been thinking.

My two cents.

Arlin

I fully agree with Arlin. I would even give the table captains the power to ignore any scores that were "out of line."

 

[Jeff_in_KC]

If you restrict them from having the leftovers from their plates, Do you think it will get harder to get judges at a contest?

Honestly, if the draw for them is getting to take BBQ home with them instead of fairly juding my entry, then I don't care. There won't be any contest cancelled because there are fewer judges. Somehow things will work out, even if a judge has to judge more than one entry from each category.

 

[CajunSmoker]

I am not a competitor or a judge. However, I would love to get certified as a CBJ. I have checked the KCBS site regularly looking for a class anywhere close to me to get certified. If you will check the closest class is either Oklahoma, Georgia or Missouri. I live in Louisiana, were talking a 12 hour drive minimum each way. Who judged the Hammond, La event? Who is going to judge the Pine Bluff, Ark event? Both events are within 3 hours of my home.

If you want better judges at the events, get some classes organized in different areas of the country and advertise the fact that they are going to be held in some of the local papers or radio stations.

 

[nmayeux]

The KCBS is doing great, and I am proud to be a member. Now I do wish there were more CBJ classes in my area, and I sure would like a new KCBS sticker for my pit... Keep up the good work.

 

[Pig Headed]

Merl, thanks for asking for feedback. I have to weigh in on the CBJ bashing that I see on this and other forums. I'm a CBJ and a competitor. I agree with Rich on this matter. No judge can eat all that's put on his/her plate and as long as a decent bite or two is taken, I see no reason to waste the food and throw what's left away. Why is it not possible to judge fairly and still not waste food? I believe that the vast majority of judges take their job just as seriously as us cooks do. Why alienate an integral part of our community.

 

[JohnMcD348]

Merl,

I'm not a competitor but asking for honest feedback is a GREAT way to do things.

Back to the way beer judges do things (OK, it's what I know...) - after each judge is finished scoring the entry, the judges actually talk through the round and compare scores. Scores that are "too high" or "too low" are discussed and usually adjusted to provide more uniform scoring. This gives the inexperienced judges a chance to learn from the experienced ones and the folks that enter their meat don't have to scratch their heads and wonder what the hell so-and-so could have been thinking.

My two cents.

Arlin

That's pretty much what I was trying to say in my post. I think that would help more than whether or not you took anything home with you. It could also be a point of table captians or even the officials themselves monitoring for those few who are not truly in it for the right reasons. Like Was said before, you know or have seen people who are outspoken and seem to only want to give the absolute lowest scores possible or even DQ sombeody. Then there are others who just do it becuase they just don't know any better. The only time I judged, I think I pretty much ate everything that was put in front of me. What didn't get eaten, got thrown away. Maybe if my palet were a little better tuned, I could judge with one bite, but I had to go back for more than one bite for nearly everything I judged.

 

[ModelMaker]

Merl,thanks for askin.
New logo? Ok, fine now leave it alone.
Electronic voting? Perfect, good job.
New judging slips ? Will see.
Cooks comment cards ? Great idea, many times wanted to explain my mark. Could be pretty sloppy looking card though, hard enough keeping score card clean.
Crappy judges, talking at the table before card turn in, too many first time judges grouped together, inattention during judges instuction... Put Mike Lake in charge of more events or have him train the reps. There is a noticeable difference between the way he runs a contest and others I have judged.
Last but not least the cooler debate. The first two contests I ever did I just sampled and pitched, honest to God each time I approached the garbage can I expected my mom to cuff me in the back of the head!! My wife was asking how it was, were there any real good ones or bad ones, this that and the other thing. So I decided to put some samples in the cooler and let her share in my hobby, that is all there is to it. I'm not tryint to put dinner on the table for the next week. Just sharing my fun and excitement for good BBQ.
ModelMaker