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Need to vent

Jeff S.

Jeff S.

Full Fledged Farker
Joined
Apr 20, 2010
Location
Coeur d alene, Idaho
Im sure this happens all the time.

A guy comes to me 10 minutes before Brisket turn in, freaking out, his Brisket is at 150 deg. and he has been cooking it at 200 degrees for around 10 hours.

"Any Ideas" he ask. I tell him, pour your juices into a pan, get it as hot as you can, slice your Brisket and put the slices in it, get the meat turned in and at least get some points.

He does it, turns it in and gets 4th place. I tried a piece that he cooked, minus the boil after turn in and you had to bite and pull to seperate it. Rare at best.

How do you get a peice of brisket from 150 to done in 5-10 minutes?

How do certified Judges rate a boiled piece of Brisket high enough to get a forth place finish?

I was happy that the guy did well and won $100 bucks for his Brisket, I am extremly disappointed in the quality of the Judges.

I am even more concerned about a system that doesnt verify that the team turning in a box has actually any connection to that box.

Maybe that didnt make sense. You hand in a box, the computer goes ding, they say thank you. Maybe ask, "what team"? and verify that the team on the screen is actually the same as the team handing you the box?

It seems and I am certain that I am mistaken, but computers can make mistakes. I cant believe that a half done peice of boiled meat beat out 25 other teams...
 
I hate it when that happens! What event if you dont mind me asking?
 
I dont mind, it was Smokin the Coeur D Alenes. It was a great event, 29 teams, Fantastic bunch of people, awesome storm in the middle of the night, lightning, high winds, drivin rain, BARBEQUE!

It just puzzles the sh&# out of me that anyone can take a 4th place with boiled meat.

I am having a very hard time with that...

And dont get me wrong, a computerized system is a huge time saver, but it seems there is much more room for error. I have been building and configuring computers for 15 years, hardware, software, and I know that the things arent perfect. I am in no way knocking anyones system, just wondering what the chances are that possibly the computer might have made a mistake.
 
Daddy's Butt Rub said:
I

It just puzzles the sh&# out of me that anyone can take a 4th place with boiled meat.

I am having a very hard time with that...
Click to expand...

look at it the other way... He gave it 10 hours of smoke @ 200 deg (not sure why he cooks at 200 though) and then he gave it some form of a supercharged boil that might have made it really tender and moist. Not that much different than someone using foil to speed the cooking process in a steam-like environment or the restaurants that boil and then grill. This is kinda like a reverse sear that's become popular.

Might start a trend on the comp scene after people read this !!!
 
MilitantSquatter said:
look at it the other way... He gave it 10 hours of smoke @ 200 deg (not sure why he cooks at 200 though) and then he gave it some form of a supercharged boil that might have made it really tender and moist. Not that much different than someone using foil to speed the cooking process in a steam-like environment or the restaurants that boil and then grill. This is kinda like a reverse sear that's become popular.

Might start a trend on the comp scene after people read this !!!
Click to expand...

Not to sound like a smart ass here but wouldn't that be considered broiling?
 
Whatever it takes, within the legal limits. Do you know what kind of brisket he was cooking? Maybe it was a thin flat. Maybe it was like a brisket Club Joe cooked that was DONE at about 170. You just don't know. Sounds like you gave him good advice.
 
bbqbull said:
Not to sound like a smart ass here but wouldn't that be considered broiling?
Click to expand...

Not as long as the heat source that boiled the juices was absent before the meat was added. And then if it was a big ass fire (and not electric or gas), even that doesn't matter.
 
There is no rule against sliceing a raw brisket, placing it on a charcoal, pellet or wood grill and cooking it. This should only take a few minutes, depending on the thickness. WHY stay up all night? Inquiring minds want to know!
:doh::boxing:
 
That was great advice you gave him. If you take a sliced flat and boil it in broth and other flavorings, you would be surprised at the turnout. I know this first hand.
 
It was a small flat, very thin, very small, I tried a peice of the non boiled meat, it was very tough, stretched instead of seperating when you tried to bite it.

Im talking 5-10 minutes here, not 30. No way in hell unless you boiled it at 200 degrees kelvin it could have gotten done, or tender.
 
Daddy's Butt Rub said:
It was a small flat, very thin, very small, I tried a peice of the non boiled meat, it was very tough, stretched instead of seperating when you tried to bite it.

Im talking 5-10 minutes here, not 30. No way in hell unless you boiled it at 200 degrees kelvin it could have gotten done, or tender.
Click to expand...

Then why did you give him that advice if you didn't think it would work?
 
"Then why did you give him that advice if you didn't think it would work?"

read!

"Any Ideas" he ask. I tell him, pour your juices into a pan, get it as hot as you can, slice your Brisket and put the slices in it, get the meat turned in and at least get some points.



Actually I just realized that I gave him bad advice.

He pulled the meat out of the cooker, placed a pan with au jus back in the same cooker, seperated his meat then put it back on the same fire. In the juice.
I believe, correct me if I am wrong, but he seperated his meat, and continued cooking it on the same fire.

I really wasnt very clear in my advice, I was in the middle of preparing my turn in box.

Damn, trying to help a brother out....
 
Daddy's Butt Rub said:
"Actually I just realized that I gave him bad advice.

He pulled the meat out of the cooker, placed a pan with au jus back in the same cooker, seperated his meat then put it back on the same fire. In the juice.
I believe, correct me if I am wrong, but he seperated his meat, and continued cooking it on the same fire.

I really wasnt very clear in my advice, I was in the middle of preparing my turn in box.

Damn, trying to help a brother out....
Click to expand...

Brisket - completely legal. Pork, not. Although that is the most ignorant, ridiculous rule in KCBS barbecue. Another time and place though...
 
monty3777 said:
From what I can gather Smokin the Coeur D Alenes is a first year non KCBS sanctioned event. What kind of judging were you expecting? I'm not trying to be a jerk (just sounding like one)....
Click to expand...

OUCH,

Cant see how there should be any difference. Judges are trained, and should be knowledgable.

If I go get a certification to work on your car, and you bring it in for brakes, you want them to work right?
 
Daddy's Butt Rub said:
OUCH,

Cant see how there should be any difference. Judges are trained, and should be knowledgable.

If I go get a certification to work on your car, and you bring it in for brakes, you want them to work right?
Click to expand...

So just who trained these "judges"?

Judges may be trained in any manner the organizer wishes them to judge or however they personally feel about the entries in a non-sanctioned contest. In a KCBS contest, there are pre-determined standards at any contest across the country. I know I am going to have judges judging my entries to a set of guidelines when I go to a KCBS event, whether that's in Missouri, South Dakota, New York, Georgia, California or anywhere. Monty's point is that you just don't know what to expect when you go to such an event. A perfect example of why KCBS sanctioning (or any sanctioning body) is important.
 
You've got a few different issues here. First, the box:

Daddy's Butt Rub said:
I am even more concerned about a system that doesnt verify that the team turning in a box has actually any connection to that box.

Maybe that didnt make sense. You hand in a box, the computer goes ding, they say thank you. Maybe ask, "what team"? and verify that the team on the screen is actually the same as the team handing you the box?
Click to expand...

At the contests we go to, the rep gives us our numbered boxes and asks us to verify that their master sheet shows our correct team name and that box number, and WE check to make sure that all four boxes show that same number.

How would anybody else have that number or those boxes unless we let them out of our hands? The onus is on us to keep them safe, and to request a properly numbered replacement if we bash or crack one. Why would anyone else want to submit an entry with our number on it? I'm not quite following here.

Next, the judging:
Even at KCBS contests with trained, certified judges and the judging criteria spelled out on the CD, judging is subjective and can be wildly variable. That's just the nature of the beast, heartbreaking as it can be sometimes.

In the absence of sanctioning, or if you add local celebs/VIPs/members of the public to the judging mix, it gets even crazier. I have to have a really, really good reason to go to a contest under those circumstances.

Maybe it was one of "those" tables. Maybe he really, really rocked them on flavor. Almost certainly, the untreated slice you tried was nothing like what made it into the box. Don't let it make you nuts.
 
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