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Jaccard your butt?

THoey1963

somebody shut me the fark up.
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Terry
Later this evening I need to start getting my butts marinated for the wedding party. When I did the practice cook, they only got to marinate (injection and soak in bowl) for less than a day and while the flavor was there, it was barely there.

This time, I am going to give it a good 36 hour soak. A buddy also mentioned maybe using a Jaccard to poke a lot of holes in it to let the marinate soak in that way. Does this sound reasonable?

If it helps, the following is what I am using:

Pork Injection / Marinade (per butt)
1 TBS dark soy sauce
2 TBS Hoisin Sauce
4 TBS Worcestershire sauce
8 crushed garlic cloves
2 TBS fresh grated ginger root
1 large minced onion
1 cups pineapple juice
1 cups ginger ale

Any tweaks to that recipe are fine also...
 
Be careful soaking in pineapple for that long.....it contains bromelian, a substance that will break down proteins, used for digestive aids & such......could turn your pork to mush.......................


"If you left meat for a day or two covered with bromelain, it would be noticeably mushy, so much so that you wouldn't want to eat it."

With the juice, you're not using pure bromelain, but over a long period of time, could cause the same effect......here's all the amino / peptide monkey busness:

http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovations/pineapple-enzyme-tenderize-steak1.htm

Maybe add that inat a later time so it's less exposed so still gives you the flavor?
 
I use my jaccard on a lot of things, but never a pork shoulder. I'm not sure how much benefit it would add over just injecting, but I'd give it a shot as this is how we learn to get better!
 
I personally don't like to experiment on an important cook. If it's just the wife and kids then we can order a pizza if my experiment is a failure.
 
Just be careful......hate to see a bunch of good meat go haywire.......

Knock off a small corner & set it separate w/ the juice & see what happens..........

Papaya is another one.....contains papain, works like bromelain......
 
Good thinking y'all. I'll skip the Jaccard and hold the juice until late in the soak, like as I am lighting the smoker.
 
Good thinking y'all. I'll skip the Jaccard and hold the juice until late in the soak, like as I am lighting the smoker.

Or mix up your marinade as a cooked down sauce & use it for finishing, heated

Not tryin' to talk you in to or out of anything.....just an idea.........
 
Later this evening I need to start getting my butts marinated for the wedding party. When I did the practice cook, they only got to marinate (injection and soak in bowl) for less than a day and while the flavor was there, it was barely there.

This time, I am going to give it a good 36 hour soak. A buddy also mentioned maybe using a Jaccard to poke a lot of holes in it to let the marinate soak in that way. Does this sound reasonable?

If it helps, the following is what I am using:

Pork Injection / Marinade (per butt)
1 TBS dark soy sauce
2 TBS Hoisin Sauce
4 TBS Worcestershire sauce
8 crushed garlic cloves
2 TBS fresh grated ginger root
1 large minced onion
1 cups pineapple juice
1 cups ginger ale

Any tweaks to that recipe are fine also...

Don't confuse a brine with a marinade; they are two different things.

Brines contain salt, sugar, spices, and water sometimes with fruit juices. Because the solution is water with salt, the molecules are small and can penetrate the cell structure of the meat by the principals of equalization and absorbtion.

Marinades usually have a number of ingredients such as salt, oil, flavorings, and acids. The molecules of each are different sizes and some are attracted to the chemicals in meats while some are repelled by them. Some can flow easily into the microscopic voids between muscle fibers, but most are too large.

Marinades, unless they are heavy with salt, in which case they are properly called brines, do not penetrate meats very far, rarely more than 1/8", even after many hours of soaking. Marinades do most of their work on the surface, within 1/16" of the surface, or in cuts in the surface, whereas brines can penetrate deep into the cell structure.

Marinades are meant for flavoring and will only absorb into the outer layer of the meat. Smaller and thinner pieces marinate faster, so consider cutting some meats into serving sizes. If injected, they will not be absorbed, but merely slowly leak out of the injection hole.

This means that marinades are best on thin cuts of meat. Gashing the surface with a knife or stabbing it with a fork will help the marinade to get in a little deeper, but it also pushes bacteria down in. If you cook to safe temp with the aid of a quality digital thermometer, this is not a problem. The marinade will only flavor the cells they touch so even if jaccarding, minimal contact and absorption is achieved.

.
 
Thanks MM. So are you saying that the marinade is not really even worth it and I should just use it as a finishing sauce and something to mix into the already pulled pork?

Hopefully I can get some more insight soon as I did plan on starting tonight.
 
Jiccard will work well. It will allow the marinade to penetrate. Depending on your ingredients, allow fo the better penetration into the meat.
 
Yeah, they are, I am just trying to get a different flavor profile in them.
 
Don't confuse a brine with a marinade; they are two different things.

Brines contain salt, sugar, spices, and water sometimes with fruit juices. Because the solution is water with salt, the molecules are small and can penetrate the cell structure of the meat by the principals of equalization and absorbtion.

Marinades usually have a number of ingredients such as salt, oil, flavorings, and acids. The molecules of each are different sizes and some are attracted to the chemicals in meats while some are repelled by them. Some can flow easily into the microscopic voids between muscle fibers, but most are too large.

Marinades, unless they are heavy with salt, in which case they are properly called brines, do not penetrate meats very far, rarely more than 1/8", even after many hours of soaking. Marinades do most of their work on the surface, within 1/16" of the surface, or in cuts in the surface, whereas brines can penetrate deep into the cell structure.

Marinades are meant for flavoring and will only absorb into the outer layer of the meat. Smaller and thinner pieces marinate faster, so consider cutting some meats into serving sizes. If injected, they will not be absorbed, but merely slowly leak out of the injection hole.

This means that marinades are best on thin cuts of meat. Gashing the surface with a knife or stabbing it with a fork will help the marinade to get in a little deeper, but it also pushes bacteria down in. If you cook to safe temp with the aid of a quality digital thermometer, this is not a problem. The marinade will only flavor the cells they touch so even if jaccarding, minimal contact and absorption is achieved.

.

Pretty accurate rundown, thanks Mad Man.....

Terry, I THINK I understand what you're aiming for.....to get the marinade flavoring all thru the piece & "cooked in", correct?

I've experimented with injecting butts different ways, different mixes, flavors, combinations.......
Some were OK, most of what happened was the marinade 'migrated' to the outside, down the fat lines & maybe most importantly, into the bone area.

See in the center of this pic where it looks brown & grainy?

Jan29Danaedad076.jpg


That's the rubs / powders carried in by the fruit juice or other liquids I used...........it does flavor some, but it's uneven, spotty & still needs mixing in at the end......

A possible remedy, if I'm reading your aim correctly, might be to rub & cook per your normal method to finish, rest, pull a little sooner than serving time,gently fold in the marinading / saucing juice mix & heat thru in the serving pans to get the flavoring "baked in"....................

Personally, i think with some attention to timing (which you're already attending to anyways, for a wedding thing, right?) the meat could be served nicely flavored, but not overly drowning in sauce & be just peachy..........


All that said, there may be some of the comp people who will know much more about this.....if they are doing anything like this to sort of 'burn' the flavor stamp into the meat as it cooks.......I do remember seeing a short clip of Myron finishing injecting & then told the cameraman " I need to get this on the smoker" & as he turns around, the pork shoulder, which he's holding up by his shoulder, is just pouring liquids all the way over to the box.....there's something to it, just not sure you'd be able to get it figgered without several practice runs.....

Another thing, I know I can inject something like tri-tip thoroughly enough & in a patten that will hold the injection in the piece fairly well.....the finished product comes out flavored all thru & baked in enough to be pretty much continuously even in the piece......not only is that a different texture & grain of meat, but I've had 25 years to practice......the best bet, I would think is to heat the finish saucing in after pull..........
 
Thanks MM. So are you saying that the marinade is not really even worth it and I should just use it as a finishing sauce and something to mix into the already pulled pork?

Hopefully I can get some more insight soon as I did plan on starting tonight.

Basically correct....

Your best bet, if you wish to flavor all of the meat, is to cook your pork, let it rest for a couple hours, mix some of the drippings in with your marinade to help marry the flavors. Heat the marinade as you pull the pork, then lightly pour the sauce over the meat and mix. Do not over do it as it can overpower the flavor of the pork. This is what many have indicated above, it does work well, but use caution not to use too much sauce and overpower the tastes.

You want to taste the natural sweetness of the pork, but have hints of the marinade in every bite.


.
 
I would think dong a really simple rub and then adding the marinade after the cook or maybe as a glaze during the last 15-20 minutes. will get you the best end results without too many un-knowns. Also if you wrap the butt, try using soy and hoison sauce as the liquid.
 
Thanks y'all. Yes, I am trying to get the flavor all through the meat, not just on the bark. It sounds like the best way to do that is at the pull time, when the re-absorbs juices.

I think I will do the marinade (minus the pineapple so it doesn't turn to mush), do a good rub right before they go on the smoker, baste with the leftover marinade, pour some into the pans when I wrap, and then add more right after the pull.

About time for me to start prepping now. Thanks again y'all. I'll be posting pics later today and tomorrow.
 
At competitions, I use my Jaccard on my Brisket before marinating but for butts I think it is better to inject because they are so thick. But there should be nothing wrong with using the Jaccard on the butts if that is what you want. Injecting will just get the flavor throughout moreso than the Jaccard.

If you are going to baste with the marinade, make sure you set some aside prior to marinading the meat. You do not want to baste with marinade that has had raw meat sitting in it.
 
Thanks, I planned on simmering any marinade that touched the meat, but I have enough to make extra.
 
Seems to me like we're dancing around the obvious, that was only mentioned once...

To get flavors down in the meat, INJECT, INJECT, and when in doubt, INJECT. And, you don't have to leave it overnight. I inject, and rub, then go light the fire and bring the smoker up to temps, then put the meat on. The injection and rub are usually on there about an hour before going on the smoker.

Did I mention? INJECT.
 
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