Sear vs. reverse sear vs. frozen sear

I first read about reverse sear on amazingribs.com. It made a lot of sense, as most of the great articles on that site do. I since have tried it several times. But I'm not getting the results I expect. At least by comparison to other methods.

I have been doing "regular" sear for years before. I use about 1# cuts which are about 1.5" thick. Usually they are NY strip, ribeye or picanha. There is no USDA here, I just buy good cuts at a good butcher I've frequented a lot.
I sear on a hot grill or charcoal chimney. Then move the steaks to a low and slow smoker (UDS for the last year). Pulled at MR or sometimes rare if the crowd is good. These come out good. A few mm of grey around the crust but most of the meat is rare-MR. Only good marks from everyone who had them. Let's say these are my baseline.

I've also had some attempts at searing frozen. Same method, just longer low and slow. These come out significantly better then regular sear. First the grey is very thin. Sometimes not even visible. Edge to edge MR just as you see in sous vide commercials. Second the bark is much darker and has more flavour. The burnt fat drippings fumes the UDS makes are noticable. The fat itself seems more burnt and softer. No doubt to me the longer coock benefits the steak. People get watery eyes when eating them... I'd say these are baseline +2.

Revere searing starts on the UDS. Gets pulled at 10-12*C under MR. Or done SV to the same temp. Then seared with a hot grill or chimney or gas burner.
Heat's up to doneness. It's a little better then regular. But the crust is less flavourful. It's like most the smoke and burnt fat from the UDS gets washed or coarsely burnt away. Left with just a crust with a small hint of rich tastes. The inside is very much like regular sear. The heat gradient looks very much the same, just a little better. These are BL+0.5.

I'd like to get my RS better. Or maybe frozen is really the best way.

Stlsportster said:

Ofer, hard to say as I have had great success with the reverse sear...but on larger cuts of meat. I use it regularly on Tri Tip, London Broil/Top Round, and even recently on a beef tenderloin roast.

In all of those cases they are thick enough to allow the sear to put a good crust on the outside of the meat. I think it would work less well on thinner cuts where that sear wont be as long.

I know you said the steaks were 1.5 inches thick....what type of cut?

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Ribeye, NY strip and picanha.

smoke ninja said:

When you reverse sear try resting before the sear. Get the grill raging hot during that and sear lid off to your liking. Works best for thick steaks and roasts

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Rest and pat dry until the coals are really hot.
I've also tried coating with a little oil.

Blowin' Smoke said:

I have not yet done, but have wanted to try, a frozen steak sear. Are you seasoning it frozen? Seems like it would be tough to get any appreciable amount of salt/pepper to stick with a frozen surface.
.

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Seasoning frozen doesn't work. It doesn't stick. And whatever sticks just burns away without leaving any flavor.
I season during the low and slow cook.
Last time was q-salt. It turned out great.
The spices mixed with the smoke and the fat vapor. Delicious!
I do pat it dry thoroughly when frozen. And apply a light oil coating.

m-fine said:

The reverse sear should allow you to serve while the crust is still hot and sizzling. Oh so good.

As mentioned previously, I think the step you are missing is the rest/cool down. You cook a little closer to the desired finish temp, then pull the meat to rest and cool while you build the fire raging hot. A good fire should sear in about 30 seconds per side total. Maybe two periods of 15 seconds on each side. Between the rest to cool the meat and hot enough fire, you can get a similar effect to the frozen sear without over cooking the inside. That plus non-frozen beef or beef thawed slowly (overnight) has a better texture and flavor than frozen and thawed quickly.

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Ok. Maybe I'm not resting long enough to cool.
I'll try that.

Gore said:

For steaks, you can get much the same effect by leaving the steaks out on the counter for an hour to come to room temperature. If room temperature is warm, all you need to do is sear and they're done.

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But then it's almost like searing on a pan. There's hardly any grill taste. I do like the effect of a long smoke on a steak.

Gore said:

I'd completely disagree with you there. To me, it does not taste anything like pan-seared. There are a lot of variables in your fire. How hot it is, how much smoke it's producing, etc. How far do you think your smoke penetrates the meat?

As you've read the articles, you'd realize the principle advantage of the reverse sear is that the temperature gradient in the meat is low until the very end. This prevents the distribution of juices within the meat and subsequent loss of those juices due to this distribution. As pointed out by the Ninja, this effect can be achieved in a number of ways of which reverse sear and sous vide are two. Both bring up the temperature of the meat slowly so the temperature gradient remains low. It can also be achieved by taking the meat out and resting it on the counter. I've often thought of this as a poor man's (or lazy man's) sous vide. The net result is much the same. You get a very uniform interior and a sear on the outside. Sous vide is more efficient, of course, because you can more safely bring that interior temperature up to the final temperature. As far as flavor goes, it tastes like a grilled steak and I've not had an issue with lack of smoke. I'd contend results are similar to revers sear or sous vide:

https://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=102078

Finally, I should note that everyone has a different preference in steak. Having a uniform interior is considered desirable, but on occasion, I really enjoy a huge doneness gradient, when the center of the meat is cold and red and the doneness increases uniformly to the outside. This is achieved with a fast cook of a cold steak, and I do it without putting the lid on my smoker. It is a different feel entirely as the different textures and doneness and flavors play with your mouth and taste buds. Yeah, it may lose some juices, but it tastes great too and sometimes that's what I want.

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Far be it from me to argue with the Porterhouse Steak Master!!!:clap::hail:

My friend I say that the method you described produces a great steak. I have done room temp. steaks. In fact that was my method for a long time before smoking. They were great. But I really can't tell them apart from pan searing.
Maybe it is because of my fire.
But I say the long smoke gives it another dimension of taste I only found in long smoked after seared steaks. I also say reverse searing after long smoking does't give me the same result. The frozen steak holds juices well and can be cooked longer and slower. Also the heat gradient is near perfect.

I know smoke doesn't penetrate much of the outer layer. However I found more of it sticks to a frozen steak. In a good way. Also I found searing in the end of the cook burns out most of the spices. I don't season heavily but I do like some seasoning. So I sparke lightly after searing and let it cook. Anyway that is my experience. I will give a try to reverse sear with a longer rest. Got a lot of steaks in my future...:mrgreen: