Holding whole brisket/pork long term in heated cabinet?

Smokesman · 06-20-2012, 10:31 AM

Hi Gang,

We have been vending in our area for several months now with excellent success. Serving very fresh brisket and pork is one reason for the success but on occasion (competition weekends primarily) we have found the need to cook, refrigerate, and reheat our vending meats a day in advance. While the results are acceptable they are not ideal as the quality certainly takes a hit from the reheating process.

I have held large cuts above 140 degrees 6 to 8 hours with no noticeable loss in quality. My question does anyone have experience holding large cut meats (wrapped in foil or plastic) even longer (12 to 18 hours) using a mechanical unit. I have heard of establishments that due to volume and capacity use this method out of necessity but no direct information or knowledge. So reaching out to the wise Brethren.

Thanks, Matt

roksmith · 06-20-2012, 04:37 PM

Hey Matt,
We have to do something like that because of our limited cooking space.. We'll smoke a batch for 5 or 6 hours, then wrap them and move them to a heated holding box running just over 200. They have been in there upwards of 10 ours or so while we cook the next batch. If they are wrapped tight, it works well..especially for pulled pork and brisket. Might need to experiment a bit with temp.

Rok

indianagriller · 06-20-2012, 04:58 PM

we have had real good luck holding in food film , never tried an extended hold, but one of our local bbq joints holds in an alto sham it has controls over both heat and humidity i believe...

Pitmaster T · 06-20-2012, 07:42 PM

answer on its way

Pitmaster T · 06-20-2012, 09:08 PM

In this vid and others you see the Tri Level process....which usually includes an impressive resting period (rendering)

This process does NOT include a chill down or freeze. I think it does reduce the quality. There is a loss and mushiness to meat that got cooked, chilled and reheated....that is not there for the overnight hold.

Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0002.jpg

After the Prerub (Glitter and Lawreys - or visa versa)

Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0003.jpg

The Dirty Dalmatian Post Rub

Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0004.jpg

(After Final step in Tri-Level Rub) Ready for the Pit

Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0001.jpg

Ready to Pull and Wrap (Weeping) Bark hard enough to dull knife

Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut _Brisket and a Dull Knife__0002.jpg

Wrapped and ready for a night's rest in the Proofing Oven at 160 or so.

Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut _Brisket and a Dull Knife__0001.jpg

Rested Brisket woken up... Proofing Oven Behind... Still More in there

Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut _Brisket and a Dull Knife__0003.jpg

Unwrapped and rested in the air... The Bark has snapped back... is the right texture but will not dull an edge as much as before.

Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0006.jpg

Brisket Yielding to my Pizza Knife... Dull, Dull Pizza Knife.

Smokesman · 06-21-2012, 09:29 AM

Thanks Donnie. When I was a brisket noob I watched and read just about everything you've posted - even did the Night Train brisket. I bow to your greatness and thank you! My vending brisket (which I prefer to our comp brisket) is a straight up traditional Texas style brisket I think you would be proud of. Finding good brisket here in southern Ohio is a challenge to say the least and I literally have had customers eyes roll back in there head upon sampling. That said the learning never ends!

I am very familiar with your wrap and hold process and have used it many times - did so for at least 8 hours with a holding cabinet for a big cook earlier this year. I guess my question is do you or anyone else have experience using this technique to hold even longer than 8 hours? Say 12 to 18 or even 24 hours? Has anyone tried it? At what point holding large cuts of beef or pork (wrapped tightly in plastic wrap in the safe zone above 140) do bad things start to happen? Food safety concerns?

Pitmaster T · 06-21-2012, 09:53 AM

Well let me see....

I started doing the briskets earlier two years ago.... they are off by 5. and all wrapped and in the holder by 6. Sometimes as early as 5. Pork butts definately in by 5.

I generally pull them to cool at 8 to 9 the next day...for a 300 plate get the hell out of here, butcher wrapped meat fest at 11:30 when church lets out. People's perception is that is the freshest they have ever seen, being that its all cut with that knife within minutes. The sound of 7 people wrapping up 1 and 1/2 pound servings is quite the racket... LOL

So that is at the most 14 - 15 hours of holding. My peeps that volunteer the first time always think... open it now...there is no way you can cut all that in 30 minutes!!! I gaurd that box with my life.

Jacked UP BBQ · 06-21-2012, 09:53 AM

I cook my brisket in 750 lb batches. When they come off I cool them completely and let the fat re hydrate into the meat. I chop them cold or slice them cold and reheat in the oven or cooken in a pan with some liquid for vending. I have had no real quality issues.

Pitmaster T · 06-21-2012, 09:58 AM

I can attest to something Jacked upm is saying and it gets asked here a lot.

I never thought to say what he said though but its damn true.

First, he sort of does part of what can be found on page 144 of "the book." Mills.

But he says something everyone should know. IF YOU ARE INCLINED to pre slice let it cool. Many slice when it is hot or even just warm. If you have to preslice and sometimes you just have to, this is the best way. If you can wrap in plastic after you slice, and reheat in the plastic, thats even better.

Thanks Jacked!

Pyle's BBQ · 06-21-2012, 08:54 PM

Thanks for the post. I just asked about this in the catering forum.

eplain · 06-22-2012, 05:44 AM

Question!... I cooked a 12lb Brisket last week. A friend was up from down south and asked for it on a Monday night but i work! so i had to cook it Sunday (8am to 8pm). I never did this before. It was in my WSW for 10 hours at a steady 225, the 2 hours wrapped in foil at 225. Out it came and rested in the foil for an hour. it appeared perfectly cooked. then i decided to wrap it in film and refrigerate. I took it out hours in advance on Monday night and put it in an oven at about 170 until it was warm throughout. I took it to the cutting board and it was AMAZING! so tender and juicy as hell. BUT! after being in the serving bowl for about 15 minutes, it began to tighten up and get VERY DRY! WHOA! What happened??? BTW- I trimmed most of my fat, for years I didnt do that. tried that the last 2 times and I swear I will never ever do THAT again. Maybe score the fat deep at 1 in. cross cut if at all, but I will NEVER trim my fat again (unless its excessive). Any thoughts?

Pitmaster T · 06-22-2012, 07:02 AM

I think you got it, eplain.

06-20-2012, 10:31 AM	#1
Smokesman Full Fledged Farker Join Date: 12-20-09 Location: Cincinnati, OH	Holding whole brisket/pork long term in heated cabinet? Hi Gang, We have been vending in our area for several months now with excellent success. Serving very fresh brisket and pork is one reason for the success but on occasion (competition weekends primarily) we have found the need to cook, refrigerate, and reheat our vending meats a day in advance. While the results are acceptable they are not ideal as the quality certainly takes a hit from the reheating process. I have held large cuts above 140 degrees 6 to 8 hours with no noticeable loss in quality. My question does anyone have experience holding large cut meats (wrapped in foil or plastic) even longer (12 to 18 hours) using a mechanical unit. I have heard of establishments that due to volume and capacity use this method out of necessity but no direct information or knowledge. So reaching out to the wise Brethren. Thanks, Matt __________________ Matt Schneider - "The Smokesman" - Velvet Smoke BBQ & Catering KCBS Certified BBQ Judge #54767 Weber Smokey Mountain 22 & Superior Smoker SS1 [B][COLOR="Red"]"To BBQ is human, for swine is divine!"[/COLOR][/B]

06-20-2012, 04:37 PM	#2
roksmith is one Smokin' Farker Join Date: 04-21-09 Location: Marietta, Ohio	Hey Matt, We have to do something like that because of our limited cooking space.. We'll smoke a batch for 5 or 6 hours, then wrap them and move them to a heated holding box running just over 200. They have been in there upwards of 10 ours or so while we cook the next batch. If they are wrapped tight, it works well..especially for pulled pork and brisket. Might need to experiment a bit with temp. Rok __________________ 4000 sq inch Wood Burner named Brutus - KCSB member/judge# 32129

06-20-2012, 04:58 PM	#3
indianagriller is one Smokin' Farker Join Date: 06-03-09 Location: Columbus,Indiana	we have had real good luck holding in food film , never tried an extended hold, but one of our local bbq joints holds in an alto sham it has controls over both heat and humidity i believe... __________________ JAMBO Pit, 700 Club, 180 Chicken x 6,180 Ribs, 180 Brisket American Royal #WCO

06-20-2012, 07:42 PM	#4
Pitmaster T Babbling Farker Join Date: 04-03-11 Location: Texas	answer on its way __________________ I could care less if you pay attention - my 15 years of threads are here for the historical record before my impending death. ABOUT PITMASTER T Edict. Grace Jones Rubber Grabber Binder

06-20-2012, 09:08 PM	#5
Pitmaster T Babbling Farker Join Date: 04-03-11 Location: Texas	Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut (Brisket and a Dull Knife) - YouTube In this vid and others you see the Tri Level process....which usually includes an impressive resting period (rendering) This process does NOT include a chill down or freeze. I think it does reduce the quality. There is a loss and mushiness to meat that got cooked, chilled and reheated....that is not there for the overnight hold. Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0002.jpg After the Prerub (Glitter and Lawreys - or visa versa) Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0003.jpg The Dirty Dalmatian Post Rub Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0004.jpg (After Final step in Tri-Level Rub) Ready for the Pit Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0001.jpg Ready to Pull and Wrap (Weeping) Bark hard enough to dull knife Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut _Brisket and a Dull Knife__0002.jpg Wrapped and ready for a night's rest in the Proofing Oven at 160 or so. Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut _Brisket and a Dull Knife__0001.jpg Rested Brisket woken up... Proofing Oven Behind... Still More in there Pitmaster T - Quickies - The Cut _Brisket and a Dull Knife__0003.jpg Unwrapped and rested in the air... The Bark has snapped back... is the right texture but will not dull an edge as much as before. Pitmaster T Series - Hot n Fast No Foil Jucicitidinous Brisket_0006.jpg Brisket Yielding to my Pizza Knife... Dull, Dull Pizza Knife. __________________ I could care less if you pay attention - my 15 years of threads are here for the historical record before my impending death. ABOUT PITMASTER T Edict. Grace Jones Rubber Grabber Binder

06-21-2012, 09:29 AM	#6
Smokesman Full Fledged Farker Join Date: 12-20-09 Location: Cincinnati, OH	Thanks Donnie. When I was a brisket noob I watched and read just about everything you've posted - even did the Night Train brisket. I bow to your greatness and thank you! My vending brisket (which I prefer to our comp brisket) is a straight up traditional Texas style brisket I think you would be proud of. Finding good brisket here in southern Ohio is a challenge to say the least and I literally have had customers eyes roll back in there head upon sampling. That said the learning never ends! I am very familiar with your wrap and hold process and have used it many times - did so for at least 8 hours with a holding cabinet for a big cook earlier this year. I guess my question is do you or anyone else have experience using this technique to hold even longer than 8 hours? Say 12 to 18 or even 24 hours? Has anyone tried it? At what point holding large cuts of beef or pork (wrapped tightly in plastic wrap in the safe zone above 140) do bad things start to happen? Food safety concerns? __________________ Matt Schneider - "The Smokesman" - Velvet Smoke BBQ & Catering KCBS Certified BBQ Judge #54767 Weber Smokey Mountain 22 & Superior Smoker SS1 [B][COLOR="Red"]"To BBQ is human, for swine is divine!"[/COLOR][/B]

06-21-2012, 09:53 AM	#7
Pitmaster T Babbling Farker Join Date: 04-03-11 Location: Texas	Well let me see.... I started doing the briskets earlier two years ago.... they are off by 5. and all wrapped and in the holder by 6. Sometimes as early as 5. Pork butts definately in by 5. I generally pull them to cool at 8 to 9 the next day...for a 300 plate get the hell out of here, butcher wrapped meat fest at 11:30 when church lets out. People's perception is that is the freshest they have ever seen, being that its all cut with that knife within minutes. The sound of 7 people wrapping up 1 and 1/2 pound servings is quite the racket... LOL So that is at the most 14 - 15 hours of holding. My peeps that volunteer the first time always think... open it now...there is no way you can cut all that in 30 minutes!!! I gaurd that box with my life. __________________ I could care less if you pay attention - my 15 years of threads are here for the historical record before my impending death. ABOUT PITMASTER T Edict. Grace Jones Rubber Grabber Binder

06-21-2012, 09:53 AM	#8
Jacked UP BBQ Babbling Farker Join Date: 06-09-08 Location: Forker River, NJ	I cook my brisket in 750 lb batches. When they come off I cool them completely and let the fat re hydrate into the meat. I chop them cold or slice them cold and reheat in the oven or cooken in a pan with some liquid for vending. I have had no real quality issues. __________________ Jacked UP BBQ vending Ocean County Pig Assassins competition team retired and is now known as Jacked UP BBQ Fec 750 Fec 100 Large Spicewine

06-21-2012, 09:58 AM	#9
Pitmaster T Babbling Farker Join Date: 04-03-11 Location: Texas	I can attest to something Jacked upm is saying and it gets asked here a lot. I never thought to say what he said though but its damn true. First, he sort of does part of what can be found on page 144 of "the book." Mills. But he says something everyone should know. IF YOU ARE INCLINED to pre slice let it cool. Many slice when it is hot or even just warm. If you have to preslice and sometimes you just have to, this is the best way. If you can wrap in plastic after you slice, and reheat in the plastic, thats even better. Thanks Jacked! __________________ I could care less if you pay attention - my 15 years of threads are here for the historical record before my impending death. ABOUT PITMASTER T Edict. Grace Jones Rubber Grabber Binder

06-21-2012, 08:54 PM	#10
Pyle's BBQ Babbling Farker Join Date: 10-25-06 Location: Madrid, IA	Thanks for the post. I just asked about this in the catering forum. __________________ Bryan, Team: Pyle's BBQ Yoder YS640; Good-One "Trail Boss" 60T; Weber Kettle rotisserie ring; Big A$$ Rotisserie; New Braunfels offset smoker; Weber Smokey Mountain; Backyard Bombers BBQ HJM Μολὼν λαβέ

06-22-2012, 05:44 AM	#11
eplain Knows what a fatty is. Join Date: 06-24-11 Location: West Haven, CT	Question!... I cooked a 12lb Brisket last week. A friend was up from down south and asked for it on a Monday night but i work! so i had to cook it Sunday (8am to 8pm). I never did this before. It was in my WSW for 10 hours at a steady 225, the 2 hours wrapped in foil at 225. Out it came and rested in the foil for an hour. it appeared perfectly cooked. then i decided to wrap it in film and refrigerate. I took it out hours in advance on Monday night and put it in an oven at about 170 until it was warm throughout. I took it to the cutting board and it was AMAZING! so tender and juicy as hell. BUT! after being in the serving bowl for about 15 minutes, it began to tighten up and get VERY DRY! WHOA! What happened??? BTW- I trimmed most of my fat, for years I didnt do that. tried that the last 2 times and I swear I will never ever do THAT again. Maybe score the fat deep at 1 in. cross cut if at all, but I will NEVER trim my fat again (unless its excessive). Any thoughts?

06-22-2012, 07:02 AM	#12
Pitmaster T Babbling Farker Join Date: 04-03-11 Location: Texas	I think you got it, eplain. __________________ I could care less if you pay attention - my 15 years of threads are here for the historical record before my impending death. ABOUT PITMASTER T Edict. Grace Jones Rubber Grabber Binder