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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind.


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Old 10-23-2017, 05:54 PM   #31
Jason TQ
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Originally Posted by Okie Sawbones View Post
However, I could be wrong, based on the scores of 6-6-6-7-8-9, it doesn't sound like the judge was out of line with their score. Just word your comments carefully.
Agree here. Those are consistently not good taste scores. So seems like the judges were on the same page. Also three tenderness scores were 7-7-6 which also is not great, but shows consistency in that.
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Old 10-23-2017, 05:59 PM   #32
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Agree here. Those are consistently not good taste scores. So seems like the judges were on the same page. Also three tenderness scores were 7-7-6 which also is not great, but shows consistency in that.
Fair enough.
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Old 10-23-2017, 07:47 PM   #33
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Wow! I just check in now and then to see what's really happening with the Pit Masters once and awhile...Backing out slowly now.
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Old 10-23-2017, 09:10 PM   #34
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Wow! I just check in now and then to see what's really happening with the Pit Masters once and awhile...Backing out slowly now.
Hey, this is a TAME thread for this forum.
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Old 10-24-2017, 12:19 AM   #35
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You have some nice bark on the BE's, but no bark on the slices? I would put fewer BE's in the box - like one line only in the front or in the back. Your slices look a little thick, which unless your brisket is falling apart overdone, is going to make it come across tougher and make it more chewy. I would slice them a little thinner, and put 8-9 slices in. You need to work on the symmetry when you place the slices in the box - the slices in the rear of the box are way out of alignment with the rest.

The judge would have done you bigger favor to let you know by checking a couple of boxes why they gave you the score they did. A few of them really didn't like your taste, so the next time you cook, really evaluate your beefy flavor(injection/foiling liquid), smoke (creosote/bitter?), salt, and sauce. You might try and wrangle a judge after they are done judging the contest to see if they will come over to your tent and tell you what they think of the brisket, or ask another team to do the same.

Also remember that your Costco Prime is going up against the top teams cooking SRF Black/Gold and the vaunted A9's, so you need to get A LOT of flavor out of those Primes, and you need to cook them perfectly. I think the primes are easier to get good BE's out of, but they are not as nice on the slices.
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Old 10-24-2017, 04:39 AM   #36
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Really? I just took the KCBS judging class in March and am almost positive they said if you do multiples, it had to be at least 6 of each type. Maybe I'm misremembering or that was a recommendation or something.
The rules state "Each contestant must submit at least six (6) portions of meat in an approved container." So portion would be a rib (as they must be presented with the bone... and I saw one this year that wasn't!) or any combination of pieces and/or enough other meat from chicken/hen to make up adequate portions (which could be sliced, chopped, pulled), any combination of brisket or pork slices, pulled or chopped meat for 6 portions. So even something as unusual as 1 drumette and enough pulled thigh meat for 3 portions, and 2 breast slices would still be a legal chicken entry. But honestly if you feel strongly enough about your food to do a combination entry, for example... money muscle slices, plugs and pulled pork... have enough for each judge to get some of each.
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Old 10-24-2017, 05:28 AM   #37
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Just competed in the Ohio Smoked meats and BBQ festival, and contrary to how positive we were after turn ins, pretty disappointing to to finish 30th overall out of 40 teams. Any feedback from the box presentations, to understanding what the scores are telling me would be greatly appreciated. Negative feedback is welcome, you won't hurt my feelings and I would appreciate the brutal honestly.

Really confused on the Brisket scoring though guys, 38th out of 40 is a head scratcher. Now the flats finished way too early - so the flats (cooked 2 costco primes, 1 #16lb and 1 #20lb) sat in the hot box for literally 6 hours. It wasn't a top 15 box, but it wasn't 2nd to last either. They were pulled at 202 in the middle, and even after that long a rest had good tenderness, passed the "bend" test, pulled apart with little effort and had good flavor. A bit dry, but the slices that made the box took an au jus bath prior to boxing.

See attached feedback from one of the judges - and note - I have 8 slices in the box, and 15+ burnt ends. "I didn't get a slice because the pieces were inadequately cut"? What in the heck is that!!! That makes no sense to me - see the box.

Thoughts? Is there any way I can pursue additional feedback from the table to know what the judge is talking about? I need more of an explanation.
Photo's are always a little deceiving with lighting and all. I was glad to see your appearance scores on the pork was strong despite having the placement orientation turned 90° in the box. I'm not in that group but some judges are used to the more traditional face view of the slices. That said I would have scored the pork a 7/8 because the arrangement and some of the slicing was uneven. On the ribs, the saucing looks a hair thick and gloppy... again I would have scored a 7/8, so even with small dings these boxes were still above average to very good in my eye.

It sounds like you figured out the comment card and the judge that mentioned the non-separating slices. Although voluntary... if the judge that didn't get a slice didn't fill out a comment card letting you know about that, I'll bet the TC (or another judge) dropped a hint that it would be beneficial... and it is. Although the judge shouldn't score down for the missed slice... it looks like that judge didn't care for the taste or tenderness of the 1 or maybe 2 BE's that they took (sure they could have taken more than 1 BE). Had I been filling out the comment card I would have elaborated on the 6 and most likely the 7 by using the check boxes.
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Old 10-24-2017, 07:32 AM   #38
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It was to me too, initially, but as Burnt said, at least you got a comment card.

The last contest that I judged, where we had 6 or 7 entries each time, I tried to write comment cards on every entry, just to see if I could do it. I've seen various people say it can be done. I could NOT do it and write down anything meaningful, just check boxes. I wish we had more time, but that seems unlikely. So back to commenting on 7s or less.
I bet the Reps just wanted to throttle you all that extra work you caused them
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Old 10-24-2017, 08:36 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by didisea View Post
You have some nice bark on the BE's, but no bark on the slices? I would put fewer BE's in the box - like one line only in the front or in the back. Your slices look a little thick, which unless your brisket is falling apart overdone, is going to make it come across tougher and make it more chewy. I would slice them a little thinner, and put 8-9 slices in. You need to work on the symmetry when you place the slices in the box - the slices in the rear of the box are way out of alignment with the rest.

The judge would have done you bigger favor to let you know by checking a couple of boxes why they gave you the score they did. A few of them really didn't like your taste, so the next time you cook, really evaluate your beefy flavor(injection/foiling liquid), smoke (creosote/bitter?), salt, and sauce. You might try and wrangle a judge after they are done judging the contest to see if they will come over to your tent and tell you what they think of the brisket, or ask another team to do the same.

Also remember that your Costco Prime is going up against the top teams cooking SRF Black/Gold and the vaunted A9's, so you need to get A LOT of flavor out of those Primes, and you need to cook them perfectly. I think the primes are easier to get good BE's out of, but they are not as nice on the slices.
Great feedback - thank you!
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Old 10-24-2017, 08:40 AM   #40
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Photo's are always a little deceiving with lighting and all. I was glad to see your appearance scores on the pork was strong despite having the placement orientation turned 90° in the box. I'm not in that group but some judges are used to the more traditional face view of the slices. That said I would have scored the pork a 7/8 because the arrangement and some of the slicing was uneven. On the ribs, the saucing looks a hair thick and gloppy... again I would have scored a 7/8, so even with small dings these boxes were still above average to very good in my eye.

It sounds like you figured out the comment card and the judge that mentioned the non-separating slices. Although voluntary... if the judge that didn't get a slice didn't fill out a comment card letting you know about that, I'll bet the TC (or another judge) dropped a hint that it would be beneficial... and it is. Although the judge shouldn't score down for the missed slice... it looks like that judge didn't care for the taste or tenderness of the 1 or maybe 2 BE's that they took (sure they could have taken more than 1 BE). Had I been filling out the comment card I would have elaborated on the 6 and most likely the 7 by using the check boxes.
Good points. Thanks.
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Old 10-24-2017, 08:43 AM   #41
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I didn't inject the brisket, and I only do S&P rub. I've never truly tasted the difference injecting the flat can make on the slices. The ones i've done have came out the same as the ones with no injection.

The fact virtually every competitor injects, I have to experiment some more. Any recommendations for commercial injections - I'm looking at Butcher BBQ?
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Old 10-24-2017, 11:13 AM   #42
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Question....if judge did not get a slice of brisket, then how was he/she able to score on taste and tenderness?
You score the meat you did get.
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Old 10-24-2017, 11:19 AM   #43
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I bet the Reps just wanted to throttle you all that extra work you caused them
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Old 10-24-2017, 04:01 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by CentralOhioBBQ View Post
I didn't inject the brisket, and I only do S&P rub. I've never truly tasted the difference injecting the flat can make on the slices. The ones i've done have came out the same as the ones with no injection.

The fact virtually every competitor injects, I have to experiment some more. Any recommendations for commercial injections - I'm looking at Butcher BBQ?
Butcher has a great product. I would highly recommend injecting. Also experiment with some rubs that are proven to win. BPS Money, BPS Cash Cow, Smokin Guns Hot, Plowboys Bovine Bold. Any of those are a step above S&P.

Just keep practicing and continue improving and you'll be fine.
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Old 10-24-2017, 07:40 PM   #45
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The fact virtually every competitor injects, I have to experiment some more. Any recommendations for commercial injections - I'm looking at Butcher BBQ?
I use Butcher BBQ for home cooking and small caters. I like the result that I get:



Lots of good commercial rubs out there. For brisket, I really like Peppered Cow by Simply Marvelous.

Good luck, and have fun experimenting.
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