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I've had it with briskets! Help

krshome

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OK, i have asked for help here a couple of times with my briskets, but still having problems. I kill it with everything else, so i cant understand why i cant cook a brisket. Here is what I'm doing smoker temp 275 cook till 160 ish wrap in foil and cook till it probes about 203. let rest for 1-2 hours in a cooler. Meat quality is choice or prime. The results tuff, chewy, dry meat! Why is it chewy and tuff? Its probing fairly easily but maybe my probing skills are not on point. Do i need to cook longer or is it over cooked? i don't understand why its dry, its literally soaking in its own juices while wrapped. I know this is a beginner question, but this ha been going on now for years and I'm about to give up on briskets. HELP!
 
Stop cooking by temp and cook by feel. It sounds like you're overcooking.
 
Cook by feel. The probe should slide in and out with no resistance

Before you rest it are you venting it and letting the cooking process stop? Big mistake to pull, wrap and rest without a long bent to stop the cooking process.
 
SmokyDick yes understood, I don't cook by temp I use the temp more so to let me know when to start looking for doneness. On that note would it be unheard of its the temp on the meat went much higher than 203-205 before its ready? Also would the meat magically moisten if cook to a higher temp?
 
Eggzlot, No! i take it from the smoker wrapped and drop it in to the cooler. Wow! ok did not know it needed to rest first before the cooler. do you think that has been part of my problem?
 
Stop cooking by temp and cook by feel. It sounds like you're overcooking.

He described it as tough and chewy. That is not over cooked, it's undercooked (overcooked is dry and crumbly...i.e. you can't slice it without falling apart). It's also a possibility that his thermometer is off.....

krshome - SmokyDick is right that you need to cook by feel. When you probe it, what ever you use to probe should literally feel like a knife going into hot butter. That's the feel you're looking for.......Some folks here will tell you that their prime cuts won't give it up until 207-210. If you're cooking hotter, they usually finish higher too.

Don't give up. You will figure it out.
 
Is there a good starting point temperature in the cook to start probing the brisket for doneness? Im not looking for a temp when done just when to start looking. If I'm overcooking maybe i need to start probing sooner.
 
OK... Step away from the brisket :-D

Deep, calming breaths :becky:

Could you slice the brisket and it was tough, or was it falling apart? If you could slice it and it was tough, then it was under cooked. If it was falling apart, then it was over cooked.

You said that you pulled it when it probed 203. It is entirely possible that it wasn’t done at 203, especially with a 275 degree smoker temp.

Here is what I do...

Cook at 300 on the grate until the back color is where I like it (about 2 hours, typically)
Wrap and cook at 250 until the thickest part of the flat is probe tender. (About another 2 - 2 1/2 hours typically) I start probing at 2 hours.
Open the foil and vent for 10 minutes
Close the foil and put into the Cambro to rest.

I can’t remember the last time that I used the internal temp of a brisket or butt to determine the timeline. Each piece of meat is different, and the cook temp will also make a difference. I use my Thermapen as my probe since it is always what I use, and I can tell you that the IT will be 210 and even higher when the brisket is tender most of the time.
 
Next question. Are you slicing it against the grain? Even a perfectly cooked brisket will seem tough and chewy if sliced wrong.



I like to make a couple of shallow slices in the meat before adding the rub. Then you can clearly see the slicing direction after it is cooked.
 
Ron thanks, I can slice and it docent crumble so i must need to cook longer. Thats for pointing out that Prime might temp at 210 or higher makes me now not feel like i have to pull to early. Im going to give it another try tomorrow and i will resist pulling before it probes like hot butter and not worry if the temp goes higher than when all the blog websites and book say. Im hoping this is the only thing I have been doing wrong and it as simple as just waiting and letting the meat rest before the camber. Thanks guys.
 
Brisket is hard to pull off. Once you get the hang of it it is easy. I killed alot briskets learning and not in a good way.
I understand your frustration.
I imagine your cooking whole brisket. Try seperating the point from the flat before cooking. Much easier to manage imo. Cooking whole brisket is something that takes time to master and alot of screwing it up. Beans will save a bad brisket and salvage the meat. Up to you if you want to keep trying cooking whole. Try seperating to get a feel for what you are looking for.
Couple books that might help. Let me get links from Amazon.
 
https://www.amazon.com/Secrets-Smoking-Smokey-Mountain-Smokers/dp/1624140998

This guide is how Iearned to cook brisket. If it wasn't for this book I could not cook brisket consistently still.
Let you in on a secret or two. Smokin Hoggz rub is fantastic in scrambled eggs. I use beef broth instead of his beer marinade. The marinade is great but if its for home then beef broth works just fine.
 
Ron thanks, I can slice and it docent crumble so i must need to cook longer. Thats for pointing out that Prime might temp at 210 or higher makes me now not feel like i have to pull to early. Im going to give it another try tomorrow and i will resist pulling before it probes like hot butter and not worry if the temp goes higher than when all the blog websites and book say. Im hoping this is the only thing I have been doing wrong and it as simple as just waiting and letting the meat rest before the camber. Thanks guys.

There is way too many people who claim to be ‘experts’ online :-D

I have simplified my BBQ to the point that the only thing that I temp is poultry, and that is just to make sure that it is above 165 (for thighs), and things like pork chops to make sure that they are between 135-140. Everything else is by feel.
 
OK... Step away from the brisket :-D

Deep, calming breaths :becky:

Could you slice the brisket and it was tough, or was it falling apart? If you could slice it and it was tough, then it was under cooked. If it was falling apart, then it was over cooked.

You said that you pulled it when it probed 203. It is entirely possible that it wasn’t done at 203, especially with a 275 degree smoker temp.

Here is what I do...

Cook at 300 on the grate until the back color is where I like it (about 2 hours, typically)
Wrap and cook at 250 until the thickest part of the flat is probe tender. (About another 2 - 2 1/2 hours typically) I start probing at 2 hours.
Open the foil and vent for 10 minutes
Close the foil and put into the Cambro to rest.

I can’t remember the last time that I used the internal temp of a brisket or butt to determine the timeline. Each piece of meat is different, and the cook temp will also make a difference. I use my Thermapen as my probe since it is always what I use, and I can tell you that the IT will be 210 and even higher when the brisket is tender most of the time.




^^^^^ this.


A couple of points to somewhat extend what Ron (and others) said.


Tenderness of a brisket comes with the breaking down of the connective tissue between the muscle fibers. Luckily for us all, this is also where the moisture of a brisket comes from. Those connective tissues get broken down and the collagen renders. However, if cooked too long, that newly released rendered collagen will cook out and your brisket will get dry again.


WRT finished internal temp. There's a number of factors that determines what that finish temp will be. One of those factors is chamber temp. The breaking down of the connective tissue is a function of temperature over time, or time at temp. As you cook it , the brisket will spend different amounts of time at various temps. Like it might be between 40 and 50 degrees for 1 hour. Between 50 and 60 for 50 minutes, 60 and 70 for 40 mins. (BTW< I made these numbers up just to illustrate the point). As the internal temp increases, the rate of breakdown increases as well, shortening the overall cook time.

If you cook at a higher chamber temp, the brisket runs through each of those temp ranges much faster. The inevitable result is that the higher the chamber temp, the higher the finished Internal temp will be.

So, say you have 3 identical choice grade briskets. Exact clones of each other. One cooked at 225 will have lower finish IT than one cooked at 300. One cooked at 275 will have a finish IT in between those two.

Grade of beef also factors in. Usually, I believe Prime will have a lower finish IT. Choice would be in the middle. Select grade would be the highest.

To further complicate matters, let's go back to chamber temp. Most folks aren't using thermostatically controlled insulated ovens to cook brisket. Those types of cookers hold absolutely steady and consistent temps. Most smokers don't. You might target 250, but your smoker might settle in at 240 or 270. It might not (probably won't) even settle in. You might have temp swings of 20-40 degrees or whatever. It's no big deal, but that variation in temp quite possibly might affect what your finish IT will be.

On "probing". Packer briskets have two parts, the flat and the point. These are two different muscles and they have different characteristics. The point has a looser grain, more intramuscular fat and less connective tissue. The flat is a deeper pectoral muscle that does more work. It has less internal fat, a tighter muscle structure and more connective tissue.

When it comes time to probe, you can, and should, completely ignore the point. Due to having less connective tissue, it will be "done" and tender before the flat. But, due to it's higher fat content, it can cook for longer without over cooking. It's because of this that when the brisket is "done", you can pull it, separate off the point, cube it up, sauce it and put it back on the smoker for another hour or more to make unctuous burnt ends. It's actually kind of difficult to really overcook a point.

The flat is what you want to pay attention to. Specifically, the thickest part of JUST the flat. While your brisket is raw and trimmed, examine it. See where the point and the flat meet. Notice the seam of fat that separates them. Try to identify the rough area where it's just the flat and find the thickest part. Once bark is developed, it'll be a bit more difficult to figure it out.

Anyways, at about 185ish (doesn't matter if it's wrapped or not), start probing around the thickest part of the flat. Here is where experience will really kick in. The first couple times, I'd probably probe it every 15 to 20 mins. Nothing elaborate, just open the smoker, stab a few times, close the smoker. Once you have some experience under your belt, you might be able to adjust those times. Like, if it feels really tough to probe, you could probably give it another hour before probing again. The frequency of when to check will depend on how the brisket feels. Like, if it's close, but not quite there, maybe give it another 10 mins. But, to start out, I'd go with a set schedule.

Anyways, that's some of the reasoning/rationale behind it all. I've found that for me at least, understanding what is going on and why has let to more success with my cooking.



Sorry for the long dissertation. My ADD is apparently running unchecked today :)
 
Separate the point from the flat. Cook the point to make delicious burnt ends. Grind the flat and make delicious burgers, or mix with pork for an awesome smoked meatloaf. Perfect brisket every time. :razz:

Or cook up some beef short ribs. :thumb:
 
Are you getting your 275 from a door thermometer like a TelTru? We did out first brisket like that and it came out tough. We bought an Inkbird digital and put a probe on the grill, it was about 60 degrees hotter than the door thermometer.
The next one we did with the Inkbird we cooked around 250, and it came out pretty dang righteous, and this is from a couple of rank beginners.
 
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