Looking for honesty...do most BBQ joints make a real profit?

Pedro7 said:

Just curious, and you can send in a PM if you want, but what permits have you had to acquire to do this? My brother and I are in the same boat and want to potentially do something similar. We both have good 9-5s and aren't ready to leave that with young children, wives, and mortgages. But, I'm thinking if we can get a yearly permit to setup somewhere from the town we could just use our social media presence to market us locally and sell out of some food every/every other weekend. Would be riskier than just picking up catering jobs locally, but I can see it being easier.

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I'm not sure what permits I would normally need since I bought a little corner lot on a semi busy street. It was only a few grand but since I own it I only need to be inspected by the health department 1x a year. I do know that I can also get away with being near other restaurants because I don't have a food truck, I just tow my smoker and set up a tent and tables so they classify me as just a caterer so I don't have to follow some ordinance that food trucks do regarding distance from other food establishments.

Our margins are pretty tight but a lot of that stems from our commitment to making everything from scratch. Our mac & cheese has heavy cream, bacon and three different smoked cheeses, but we have to keep our prices down because the small town we live in just won't buy it if they deem it too expensive, no matter how good it is. We make enough for the business to sustain itself and cover most of our living expenses, but I still have to work a part-time job to make up for the shortfalls. I think within the next 1-2 years we should reach a point where we're turning a real profit. The catering side is starting to take off and our average daily gross receipts are increasing slowly but steadily.
If we would have been on more stable financial footing when we started and actually had an idea of what we were doing, we'd be better off. But if we waited for all that to happen we never would have taken the leap.

Q_Done_Right said:

I’m assuming this is all in the Houston area?

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Yessir

One thing I will offer as "something to think about" that doesn't show up on a financial statement or in a bank account that was mentioned above, is time. I've a few friends who are in the food industry (both food truck business and brick and mortar) and one thing I can tell you that is true about both of their situations. They are married to their businesses. It consumes every facet of their life. They have almost no time for even a normal weekend off, their "days off" are spent doing something with the business that needs to get done but they don't have time to do it on the days they are open. Both have considered hiring more staff so they can have more time to "get away". But the problem is, it would take them increasing their sales significantly in order to still net what they are netting now by doing it themselves. From what I gather it is definitely a labor of love and can quickly go from something you enjoy to something that is nothing more than a seven day per week low paying job.

Sometimes a hobby is best kept a hobby to ensure you're still having fun.

BBQ_Bama said:

One thing I will offer as "something to think about" that doesn't show up on a financial statement or in a bank account that was mentioned above, is time. I've a few friends who are in the food industry (both food truck business and brick and mortar) and one thing I can tell you that is true about both of their situations. They are married to their businesses. It consumes every facet of their life. They have almost no time for even a normal weekend off, their "days off" are spent doing something with the business that needs to get done but they don't have time to do it on the days they are open. Both have considered hiring more staff so they can have more time to "get away". But the problem is, it would take them increasing their sales significantly in order to still net what they are netting now by doing it themselves. From what I gather it is definitely a labor of love and can quickly go from something you enjoy to something that is nothing more than a seven day per week low paying job.

Sometimes a hobby is best kept a hobby to ensure you're still having fun.

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You are absolutely right. The days that we're open start at 6:00 am for me and generally don't wrap up until 9:00 pm. When we're closed we're working on cleaning, ordering supplies, putting them away, or planning the next opening. Or we're working on catering jobs and figuring out the layout, decorations, order of food and timelines.
Even when I'm on the road driving a truck it's all I think about. I think about ways to save money, improve my timeline so maybe I don't have to work as much, recipes, etc.
As far as hiring more staff to get more time off, it's my baby. I don't even like to run an errand while my wife takes care of things because I worry if she's making the sandwiches with enough meat or interacting with the customers enough or all kinds of crap. I don't think I could turn it over to someone else and actually relax.

Just kind of following in line with what others are saying and this is a tough business. It certainly is a labor of love and it's a great time and I'm enjoying myself, but there's not a whole lot of money to be made.

My particular situation has me working on military bases so I owe them 10% of my revenue off the top. This has its advantages because military personnel actually get a pretty decent wage these days and they spend money like crazy. But that 10% going to the base really is kind of a pain in the butt. I'm working on getting permitted so I can work in town but I'm still struggling with a commissary kitchen. I've found one but they want $100 per month, which isn't terrible, but that's just more of my money going out the door.

Like Medic92 I cook everything from scratch because it tastes so much better, but it eats up my entire day to day life in terms of time. I do lunch service most days from 11am to 1pm (or a bit later if we're still busy) so I am pretty much living the graveyard shift. I wake up at 11pm at night and cook all night long, then drive 15 miles to my serving location, setup, and serve lunch. Then at about 1pm I break everything down, do the dishes, clean up, and drive home. Then I start prepping my meat for that nights cook and by the time I'm done cleaning up all of that mess it's pretty much time for me to go to bed to start the cycle over again.

Cleaning / maintenance of the food trailer also takes a considerable amount of time. So many nooks and crannies that need to be cleaned with a rag since I can't get in there with a mop. My smokers are on the porch of my trailer which is nice and convenient, but it's also a hell of a chore cleaning the inside of the trailer, and then the outside of the trailer. Breaking down the smoker, pulling out all the racks, scrubbing everything down, and then cleaning the floor of the porch takes a good amount of time and it's not very fun. haha

My first couple of months I made pretty much no money because I was serving portions too big and I have figured out that ribs were killing me. The food cost for ribs is quite high right now and no matter how I broke things down I can't make any money off of ribs unless I'm charging $13-14 for a rib plate. Problem is I'm capped at a max of $12 for lunch because that's what the base dictates...and it makes sense to be honest. How many people want to spend $14 for lunch?

I'm kind of just rambling now but there's very few people who start up a food truck / food trailer business and end up "raking in the dough." My trailer cost me $17K and that included buying the shell, and then getting it wired and plumbed, as well as the smokers. Then I had to buy a truck that would be reliable and capable of towing a trailer that weighs ~6000Lbs. The truck cost me $16,500 and I also needed a few grand worth of equipment and supplies to get started. So I basically took a gamble and went $40K in debt to open my business and see if my business model would even work.

So far I'm making enough to pay my bills and that's about it. I'm lucky that my wife makes a great salary as she can take care of all our personal expenses, and I'm able to cover all of my business expenses. I'm getting better at cutting costs and serving more reasonable portions, so things are looking up. If I'm able to actually get permitted I can start doing off-base vending / catering and that has a chance to really jump me up to the next tier of sales.

Which one is it? I live in the same city, and yes, truly good BBQ is tough to come by in NW Louisiana.

Toast said:

Just my .02 here, but have you considered a smaller place? Here in Louisiana Cajun and Seafood is king. But here in North LA. Good BBQ is at a real premium. I know of 1 here and you won't find it on any top 10 list. Sure there are some chains here like Dickey's etc. but I can make better BBQ (disclaimer, can't cook for masses). There are about 1/4 million here in our area. Mississippi down the I-20 corridor like Vicksburg etc is also in need of good BBQ. Wishing you Good Luck in your endeavors.

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I'll offer a bit of advice. I've never owned a BBQ joint and have very little restaurant experience. In college I had two restaurant jobs:
1 - Brand new japanese place, I worked two shifts. Guy opened the place, hired a ton of kids, business was really slow and he laid off everyone who wasn't Asian. I'm not Asian. He did pay me at least.
2 - An italian place that was just a cover for a drug dealing business - I didn't know that when I took the job. The cook's parents owned the place, his girl friend complained about how he damaged her car the last time he 'did some runs' and he talked about how the cops were watching his house. I worked three shifts and we had only 1 customer that entire time, and their food was on the house, and no one was worried about the lack of business. I quit. I didn't want to be there the day SWAT came in through the windows. Lost money on that gig, I had to buy some clothes for the job and never got paid.

All that said, I did run my own business for about 6yrs building custom bicycle wheels, so I know a bit about running your own gig and social media marketing.

SOCIAL MEDIA is an amazing tool. Done right you can really increase your brand awareness, and it doesn't cost you much, if any, money to do so. That said, you need to be thoughtful with how you use it. Pictures and video are greater than just text. Don't post crappy pictures. Be careful with political posts. Make sure you're using the platform (facebook, instagram, twitter, etc) the way it's supposed to be used. For example, on Instagram used to (not sure if it's still the same as I don't use it anymore) you couldn't post links that were clickable, and users couldn't even copy a link, so if you put a link in the caption of a photo you were relying on the user to then go open their web browser and type the link in. Very, very, very few people will do that. I highly recommend Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook by Gary V. If you know about Gary, you likely either love him or hate him. Personally, I really can't stand to listen to the guy, BUT, he is smart, and the book is a worthwhile read.

When talking with others about how their business is going, be a little skeptical. Many people will not be brutally honest with you if they're struggling, they tend to make things sound better than they really are.

Don't confuse busy with successful. Busy means you have a lot to do, success means you're making money. They're not necessarily the same thing.

Don't be afraid or ashamed or apologetic to charge a fair price for your goods. You need to charge enough to make it worth your time and effort, anything less just means you're working your ass off for nothing.

Don't compete with other businesses on price. You don't want to win a race to the bottom. Compete on quality, customer service, and experience.

Experience and customer service are HUGE. People can buy, whatever you're selling, at lots of other places. But people can only buy it from YOU and YOUR PLACE at your place. Highlight that. Sell yourself, highlight and sell your employees (this is a great example IMO), and make people feel connected with you and your business. With my businesses, I wasn't selling anything people couldn't buy elsewhere. People bought from me because they wanted *me* to build their wheels, because I had a reputation for doing great work. They knew I would put them on the right components to fit them and their riding style and needs, and they knew the wheels would be built right and would hold up for years. They weren't just buying wheels, they were buying a piece of me. Give people a look behind the curtain, show them your passion and dedication to your craft. People connect with that.

Offering discounts, sales, etc needs to be done carefully, if at all. Done too much it lessens the value of your brand and goods, people get used to the lower prices and that's all they're willing to pay. I've gotten used to buying blue jeans on sale, therefore, I don't ever buy jeans unless they're on sale.

dgaddis1 said:

SOCIAL MEDIA is an amazing tool. Done right you can really increase your brand awareness, and it doesn't cost you much, if any, money to do so. That said, you need to be thoughtful with how you use it. Pictures and video are greater than just text. Don't post crappy pictures. Be careful with political posts. Make sure you're using the platform (facebook, instagram, twitter, etc) the way it's supposed to be used.

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Very good advice. We do almost 100% of our advertising on Facebook. We don't do enough on Instagram and Twitter but I'm working on that as well. As he said, you have to be very careful with other things you post. We live in a small town and I spent a solid year before we opened putting an end to my political or controversial posts. We wouldn't even put a sign in our yard supporting a particular candidate because in today's political climate people will avoid you just because you have a different belief than them. We stay out of any kind of drama that goes on and we're careful not to lean in any direction that might put off someone that leans the other way. It kind of sucks because I'm very opinionated and have always enjoyed a good debate/argument.

medic92 said:

Very good advice. We do almost 100% of our advertising on Facebook. We don't do enough on Instagram and Twitter but I'm working on that as well. As he said, you have to be very careful with other things you post. We live in a small town and I spent a solid year before we opened putting an end to my political or controversial posts. We wouldn't even put a sign in our yard supporting a particular candidate because in today's political climate people will avoid you just because you have a different belief than them. We stay out of any kind of drama that goes on and we're careful not to lean in any direction that might put off someone that leans the other way. It kind of sucks because I'm very opinionated and have always enjoyed a good debate/argument.

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Well...with politics, if you take a stand and pick a side, you'll definitely fire up some people in a good way, and make them like you more. But, you'll also turn some people off. If you get a net gain, it's a good marketing move.

Since running my own business for a while, I've definitely changed the way I look at stuff. When I see a business take a political stance I view it as marketing. It's not really about 'doing the right thing', it's not about morals or the owner's conscience - it's marketing, pure and simple. When a CEO makes a decision to do something in regards to politics, that's their own personal thing. But when they put out a press release touting their good deeds, that's marketing.

A few recent examples that spring to mind:
Nike's Kappernick ad.
REI halting sale of brands owned by Vista Outdoors.
Dicks Sporting goods halting the sale of assault rifles

All that said, it's a risk, and if you do something like that you have to know you will lose some customers.

For a small business, I'm of the opinion that it's best to build your brand in other ways that don't turn some people away. You (we) need all the 'fans' you can get, you don't want to be turning people away.

Speaking from a customer's viewpoint I can tell you this. I have a very low tolerance level for business owners using their place of business to convey their political views. Years ago there was a local restaurant in our area that my wife and I loved to patron. No matter when you went, you would find the owner walking around, talking to customers, ensuring everything was to their satisfaction etc. Then all of a sudden, and I don't know what was going on at the time to cause this, the owner begins to discuss politics with his customers as he's walking around the dining area. It started off as no big deal. But each time we went back we began noticing it more and more. We also noticed that passing conversations turned into lengthy debates between he and customers. When I go out to eat, it's for relaxation, leisure and entertainment. Not to have to worry about getting into a political conversation while I'm eating.

We quit going for this very reason. I'm their to eat your food, not discuss your politics.

There's different types of 'political' stuff too.

Physically going around getting into political discussions with your customers - that's a bad idea all around I think.

Making fun of the president (whoever that may be at the time), putting down their supporters, etc - that's a bad idea, IMO. Calling people "deplorable" for example...that's a bad idea, especially if you're a business. Deplorable money will pay your bills as well as any other money!

But if your local city/county/state has a potential new law being considered that could negatively impact your business, or your suppliers (like farmers), that is 'politics' you can openly talk about, so long as you're respectful with it. I've seen some local restaurants have posts like this on Facebook recently because the city/county was considering an additional tax on alcohol, which would raise prices. And pretty much everyone views the local city/county gov as incompetent and horrible at managing their own budget (they/we are waaaaaay in the hole), so talking about that proposed tax wasn't really going to piss anyone off.

Nice thread. At least learned from other's experiences or opinions.

We had a restaurant/grill/bar open here about five years ago that did well right from the start. It wasn't a BBQ; but many of the same business practices apply. Clean, good food, fast service, friendly staff....what's not to like. I usually went there twice a week. Sometimes alone, but mostly with my sons when they visited me. l was spending about $150-200 weekly there; and encouraging friends to go there. That lasted about a year; and suddenly a "no firearms" sign was posted on the front door. My sons, most of my friends, and myself are licensed to carry legally. It does not violate Georgia law to carry concealed in such a business establishment; but the owner does have the right to prohibit weapons in his place of business. I don't know why the owner suddenly chose to go this route....nor do I care. My sons and I haven't been back in four years. Most of my friends also chose to avoid the place.

I have no way to know if this stance towards firearms helped or hurt the overall business. The place is still up and running with quite a few vehicles in the parking lot when I drive past to go to our new hangout.

Unfortunately, there are both businesses and individuals alike who feel like they have to make an unsolicited "public statement" after any major societal event. I see it on Facebook all the time. Why people do this is beyond me. I've noticed some businesses do the same, which make sense because businesses are run by people. Bigger companies do things like this as a marketing/money grab. I think smaller businesses may do it for a short term money grab, but possibly feel the need to let their customer base know where they stand. I wouldn't do it. But I see it a lot.

napp37 said:

We had a restaurant/grill/bar open here about five years ago that did well right from the start. It wasn't a BBQ; but many of the same business practices apply. Clean, good food, fast service, friendly staff....what's not to like. I usually went there twice a week. Sometimes alone, but mostly with my sons when they visited me. l was spending about $150-200 weekly there; and encouraging friends to go there. That lasted about a year; and suddenly a "no firearms" sign was posted on the front door. My sons, most of my friends, and myself are licensed to carry legally. It does not violate Georgia law to carry concealed in such a business establishment; but the owner does have the right to prohibit weapons in his place of business. I don't know why the owner suddenly chose to go this route....nor do I care. My sons and I haven't been back in four years. Most of my friends also chose to avoid the place.

I have no way to know if this stance towards firearms helped or hurt the overall business. The place is still up and running with quite a few vehicles in the parking lot when I drive past to go to our new hangout.

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RangerJ said:

Well, finding a place in Texas that is not saturated is becoming more and more difficult. Your currently in Chicago, not sure what your background is or if your from Texas, but you'll need an "A" game to survive here these days.

We started popping up after competing for a few years, this led to a trailer, which has me now going on 4 years in a brick and mortar. I moved from downtown Houston to the suburbs.

To your original question, in my experience, you make enough to cover your costs and put a little in your pocket doing pop ups and trailers. So, if you have no overhead and very few bills and if this is a passion, your fine.

This was not the case for me, so there was a dip into retirement ( not advised) to pull it off / survive. I was in those days, trying to build a brand.

While you do assume substantial over head in the brick and mortar, you also pick up some more profitable items over proteins like soda, tea, beer, etc.

And as was mentioned, we all play with higher margin items, you have to.

I could go on and on, but there is quite a bit of history of this on this website, many of your answers can be found.

These are my experiences, while I'm sure there are similarities, I suspect each guy or gal slinging que for a living has a different story.

We moved and you can see our operation at either pappacharliesbbq.com or cypresstrailhideout.com

Good luck in your journey!

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Papa Charlie’s makes some good food. I recommend stopping by if you’re in the area.

#goofyque