UDS Issues Again.

[snoqualmiesmoker]

I can't get this thing to hold a solid temp for more than 20 min. It will keep climbing up and up.
I can throttle it down, by closing 2 of the vent holes. I can throttle it up by opening it all the way. I can't seem to find a sweet spot to get this thing solid like other claim.



Last night was the 2nd cook on the uds, but the first long cook. Used 10 briques to heat, got the temp up to 200 and began to throttle her back. The UDS stopped at about 230. I put a shoulder on and the temp stayed pretty good for about 20 min. Then it would drop, probably because i put on a hunk of meat that was 40.
I had it up to to 240, and semi-holding and went to bed leaving 1 vent fully open (2:00 am). By 6:00, it was down to 170, but holding (the meat was 160). I opened it up and got it up to 240. I figured it would have held for 4 hours at least.

I wrapped the meat at 170, and pulled it at 180, as I do on my egg. The meat (and it could be a bad shoulder) was tough in the middle, but juicy at the bottom (fat cap down).

It was great to eat, but was all about slicing as opposed to pulling.

The lid is solid, no leaks.
My grate is 17-inches weber kettle fire grate, with a 9-inch tall piece of metal about that same size.

I have been thinking of trying a fire-grate that is 9-inches but only 12 inches accross. Maybe this will help.

Ideas?

Thanks,

JB

[Meat Burner]

JB, how high is the bottom of your fire grate to the bottom of the barrel? Also, where are the air intakes?

[snoqualmiesmoker]

JB, how high is the bottom of your fire grate to the bottom of the barrel? Also, where are the air intakes?

Fire grate is 3-inches off the bottome of the floor. The 3 holes are 2 inches off the bottom of the drum. It is similar to the Norco build.

[Cliff H.]

What size are those intakes and what do you have for exhaust ?

[sfbbqguy]

Sounds like you have a solid build on the drum.
Although I'm no expert by any means...maybe try a differnt kind of charcoal and see what happens 'cause it would appear that you've done most everything right as far as I can tell.

[SoEzzy]

It sounds like you need a practice burn!

I did three "cooks" on my UDS before I put any meat on.

My UDS liked to run at 265 with 3 3/4" holes as air intakes, I could take it down to 225 but it had to be fiddled with all the time, I could open all the vents and get it to 285 bet it didn't like that much either, but it would rock and roll all day at 265.

Se I adapted to cooking at 265, I then saw how friends were cooking at 295 - 315 and what that does for chicken etc, and I drilled 3 more holes as air intakes, it now runs at 295 in the groove and with fiddling I can keep it down to 225 or up to 325.

But I don't see the benefit of fighting the groove.

You could try another 4 or 5 briquettes in the start up, that will give you a bigger fire base and may push you up to the 250 mark, the main thing IMO is find the place the pit works best for you.

[Bbq Bubba]

Ya, you did everything right except you choked it too much when you went to bed.
Had you left 1 1/2 holes open, i bet it would have purred at 240.

[Meat Burner]

JB, don't know what to tell you. Sounds like the build is fine. One point, making an adjustment may take 30 minutes or more to get the results you want. For some reason on all my drums, I start the fire and start adjusting temps when they hit about 180 degrees, and let them creep up to a solid temp, so I run mine for a full hour before putting the meat on. That just works the best for me. Hopefully, some others may chime in here on the diminsions of the basket. All of my grates are 14 inch diameter and 6 inches tall. Long burns are not a problem.

[Meat Burner]

JB, thinking Bubba may be right. You may be real close. A little more intake and the patience to let it settle in. All my intake valves (4 of them) are 1/2 inch. With just one open overnight, the fire would do exactly what yours did...go down. For a steady 225 degree long cook, I have all four valves almost half open and she just runs steady for hours. Everything else sounds solid.

[Norcoredneck]

Ok here's my take.
1) get new fuel
2)clean out drum
3)fill basket
4)start fire as described 1 cap off, valve 100%
5)when temp gauge on side hits 250, throttle to 1/2 -1/4 valve.
6)add smoke chunks, meat
7)seal drum
8) let it go. Only adjust after 45 min. little less if above 250, little more if above 250.
9) after 4 hours if temp has dropped, kick/rattle can to loosen ash.
10) if after anothe 30 min it has not started climbing adjust in small steps, patiently waiting for stability.
11) after 7.5 hours check temp on meat. Lid off as short as possible.
12)Pull at 195-200. Rest for 1/2 hour min.

Things I feel people do wrong is get extremely anal about temp. +/-10 is great.
People adjust and expect immediate results.
People open up anpeek without admitting it.
Some try and guess exactly ho much charcoal it will take, load it up, snuff it and reuse it for next cook. Save $3 worth of charcoal my scrimping and end up with $20 worth of mediocre meat.

Do a basic drum build, basic cook and fark with everything after you know what a succesfull cook is. People want to outcool or build the cheepest and end up dissappointed with the results. The guys that build a known and proven build are the ones that post the great Pron. If you notice everyone who replies goes back to basic questions. Intake size, exhaust, fire basket size, space under basket for ash, How well it is sealed. Add a variable in there and it will change how the drum functions. Like I said before cook on a ECB and you will cherrish a drum. Most of all learn to do a successful basic cook and then start tinkering.

[Countryhb]

Like I said before cook on a ECB and you will cherrish a drum. Most of all learn to do a successful basic cook and then start tinkering.
So Pat, basically you are saying that he should cook on a really chitty cooker so that cooking on a semi-chitty cooker ain't that bad? :biggrin:

[Norcoredneck]

The waste incinerator you cooked on taught you some patients there grasshopper! you ever throw in too much fuel and have to scoop some out because the temp got out of control? All I am saying is it is not an oven, any cooker takes reaction time. Gotta learn what you got with patience. Fire has to spread or burn down to get equilibrium. To quick adjustments and you end up chasing your tail.

*****Notice to Masses******
Country has drum Envy.

[Weiser]

Great advice Norco!
This (your) method, works very well for me.
I haven't screwed anything up yet.

Weiser

Ok here's my take.
1) get new fuel
2)clean out drum
3)fill basket
4)start fire as described 1 cap off, valve 100%
5)when temp gauge on side hits 250, throttle to 1/2 -1/4 valve.
6)add smoke chunks, meat
7)seal drum
8) let it go. Only adjust after 45 min. little less if above 250, little more if above 250.
9) after 4 hours if temp has dropped, kick/rattle can to loosen ash.
10) if after anothe 30 min it has not started climbing adjust in small steps, patiently waiting for stability.
11) after 7.5 hours check temp on meat. Lid off as short as possible.
12)Pull at 195-200. Rest for 1/2 hour min.

Things I feel people do wrong is get extremely anal about temp. +/-10 is great.
People adjust and expect immediate results.
People open up anpeek without admitting it.
Some try and guess exactly ho much charcoal it will take, load it up, snuff it and reuse it for next cook. Save $3 worth of charcoal my scrimping and end up with $20 worth of mediocre meat.

Do a basic drum build, basic cook and fark with everything after you know what a succesfull cook is. People want to outcool or build the cheepest and end up dissappointed with the results. The guys that build a known and proven build are the ones that post the great Pron. If you notice everyone who replies goes back to basic questions. Intake size, exhaust, fire basket size, space under basket for ash, How well it is sealed. Add a variable in there and it will change how the drum functions. Like I said before cook on a ECB and you will cherrish a drum. Most of all learn to do a successful basic cook and then start tinkering.

[Meat Burner]

JB, I reread your original post and thought about it a little different. Everything about your drum build sounds fine. If you are trying to adjust after 20 minutes there may be your difficulty. That is not enough time to measure the change you made. Like Norco and I both mentioned, it may be a patience issue. These are great smokers but have to dial it in and give it enough time to react. Keep practicing and it will start working out just fine. Patience bro.

[Weiser]

I agree Meat.
I remember reading somewhere in the UDS Bible about waiting 30 minutes after making an adjustment.
45 minutes is even better.
Like Pat said, plus/minus 10* is nothing to worry about.

Weiser.


JB, I reread your original post and thought about it a little different. Everything about your drum build sounds fine. If you are trying to adjust after 20 minutes there may be your difficulty. That is not enough time to measure the change you made. Like Norco and I both mentioned, it may be a patience issue. These are great smokers but have to dial it in and give it enough time to react. Keep practicing and it will start working out just fine. Patience bro.

[1130home]

You also might lose some temps from drippings. Wind blowing into vent hole higher temps, wind blowing away lower temps.

[snoqualmiesmoker]

What size are those intakes and what do you have for exhaust ?

Intakes are the 3/4 nipples (2) and a 3/4 inch brass ball valve.

Exhaust is a weber kettle lid (the 4 hole vent).

[snoqualmiesmoker]

It sounds like you need a practice burn!

I did three "cooks" on my UDS before I put any meat on.

My UDS liked to run at 265 with 3 3/4" holes as air intakes, I could take it down to 225 but it had to be fiddled with all the time, I could open all the vents and get it to 285 bet it didn't like that much either, but it would rock and roll all day at 265.

Se I adapted to cooking at 265, I then saw how friends were cooking at 295 - 315 and what that does for chicken etc, and I drilled 3 more holes as air intakes, it now runs at 295 in the groove and with fiddling I can keep it down to 225 or up to 325.

But I don't see the benefit of fighting the groove.

You could try another 4 or 5 briquettes in the start up, that will give you a bigger fire base and may push you up to the 250 mark, the main thing IMO is find the place the pit works best for you.
This was the 5 burn so far, 1st with a shoulder.

So Pat, basically you are saying that he should cook on a really chitty cooker so that cooking on a semi-chitty cooker ain't that bad? :biggrin:

I learned on a unmodded Bandera. Now that was a struggle. Then I found this place.

You also might lose some temps from drippings. Wind blowing into vent hole higher temps, wind blowing away lower temps.

I was thinking about that. I may get some elbows and get them off the ground so they point up. This way the wind, which sucks up here would have less chance of moving the fire up/down.

[swamprb]

Pike Place is only 11 days away. Is Old Dawg bringing the Egg?

More thoughts to ponder...

What is the elevation of Snoqualmie? Are you living in a developement that is on tribal burial grounds?

[JD McGee]

Pike Place is only 11 days away. Is Old Dawg bringing the Egg?

More thoughts to ponder...

What is the elevation of Snoqualmie? Are you living in a developement that is on tribal burial grounds?

Pay no attention to that voice coming from the curtain James...:twisted: You are welcome to use my WSM's for Pike's if you'd like. I'll be there Sunday working the PNWBA booth...possibly Saturday evening if I'm bored. :-P

I've also got more drums...just in case yours is cursed by the voice from the curtain...:lol::lol::lol:

[Mark]

snoqualmiesmoker stated:
"Used 10 briques to heat"

I only use wood and my UDS design is significantly different than what you guys have built. But 10 briques seems awful skimpy.

[snoqualmiesmoker]

You also might lose some temps from drippings. Wind blowing into vent hole higher temps, wind blowing away lower temps.

Pike Place is only 11 days away. Is Old Dawg bringing the Egg?

More thoughts to ponder...

What is the elevation of Snoqualmie? Are you living in a developement that is on tribal burial grounds?
I am at 800 ft, but in a wind vortex. 5-10 while cooking is normal.
It wouldn't surprise me if this place is like "Poltergeist"!
Oh, and the Egg is coming. i will be posting pics of the new table. It is amazing. It was built to survive travel.

Pay no attention to that voice coming from the curtain James...:twisted: You are welcome to use my WSM's for Pike's if you'd like. I'll be there Sunday working the PNWBA booth...possibly Saturday evening if I'm bored. :-P

I've also got more drums...just in case yours is cursed by the voice from the curtain...:lol::lol::lol:
I am going to try one more round, then figure a alternate strategy.

snoqualmiesmoker stated:
"Used 10 briques to heat"

I only use wood and my UDS design is significantly different than what you guys have built. But 10 briques seems awful skimpy.

Just using what the UDS gods above told me! I had used a full chimney and that got things a bit too hot!

[Weiser]

I tried the Ten Bric Method last weekend.
Didn't work.
Reverted to my old way of lighting a full chimney.

Weiser



I am at 800 ft, but in a wind vortex. 5-10 while cooking is normal.
Just using what the UDS gods above told me! I had used a full chimney and that got things a bit too hot!

[snoqualmiesmoker]

Since the no pics or it didn't happen rule is in effect:

Here is the pork going on. Then the result. Looks great. Not too good in the pulling.

[snoqualmiesmoker]

Tonight I moded the drum. I bought some 90-degree elbows and another valve to try and control this thing. The nipples now point to the sky (:) :) :)) while the two valves are attached to 24-inch black pipe so I don't have to bend over (LAZY_MOD!). Cleaned it out and re-lit it. No food, just a test run. Oh, and I shrunk my charcoal grate by about 9 inches. It was huge, Same size as an weber kettle charcoal grate..

[wlh3]

JB Jut try this. This won't work if your pipe nipples are welded in. Take off one nipple and leave a 3/4 in hole for the intake, get a flexable magnet to cover the hole with. Start aprox 30 briqs dump in leave all intakes open put on lid wait till temp gauge hits 225* close all intakes except for the one that has the flexable magnet. If you have a clean drum and all new charcol it will tend to run 255* to 265* just cover the hole with the fllexable magnet about 1/8 in. It should run 225* for a long time. If you have used charcol and new mixed together leave hole completly open should run at 225* no problem. If you don't like it put your nipple and hardware back on:icon_bigsmil

[snoqualmiesmoker]

Got fedup with this. Tried vertical pipes, and though it still never held, it slowed its decline.

As a last gasp i decided to get out the Stoker.
I had read a post here:
http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36868 and that gave me the idea.

I took the fan used for my egg and taped it to a rain gutter adapter from Lowes. The tape is from the US Gov, called 100 MPH tape. Had it for years. Taped the stoker to the drum.

Any who, I poured some lump in the firebox (had to use lump as I ran out of Briquets) and fired it up. I gave up on the 10 brick method, I just put in a firestarter I used on the egg.

At 10:45, I set the stoker for 225 and let her rip. About 20 min in I changed the temp to 230.
Stoker overshot but brought it back down in 5-min to 230 where it sits.

Currently it is 1:09 and the drum is holding at 230, rock solid.

Should have done this in the first place. I am wondering how long it will hold since at the bottom of the pile of lump are briquets, and I hope the ash doesn't clog it up.

Thanks for all your help.

JB

[Radical Rick]

this sounds great!

[The Pickled Pig]

I wrapped the meat at 170, and pulled it at 180, as I do on my egg. The meat (and it could be a bad shoulder) was tough in the middle, but juicy at the bottom (fat cap down).

It was great to eat, but was all about slicing as opposed to pulling.


You may want to consider cooking the butts to 200-205F for pulling purposes JB. They will pull a whole lot easier.

[Cliff H.]

Your set up is very similar to mine. Ofcourse my drum is uglier than yours.

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/vb_gallery_th/0/c23a3e9285431827d0db5b479312f66b_172.jpg?dl=120978 9331 (http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/group.php?do=picture&groupid=12&pictureid=172)


My weber lid does not seal very well so I have to add foil around the lip of the drum to give the lid something to seal to. This is the only thing I plan to re-do on the next build.

The drum will suck air from anywhere it can when put to the test.

Also, in one of your pics, I noticed a thermomter probe laying on the grate. If you are leaving it like that during a cook then you are getting a bad reading. It needs to be off the grate. Stuck thru a potato or something. Just making sure.

[jazzspot]

Also, in one of your pics, I noticed a thermomter probe laying on the grate. If you are leaving it like that during a cook then you are getting a bad reading. It needs to be off the grate. Stuck thru a potato or something. Just making sure.

Good catch Cliff!! I looked at that pic several times and didn't pick up on that.

[snoqualmiesmoker]

Just a quick up date. I am running out of fuel. So We made it from 11:00 last night to 8:45 am. Not bad for half a load of fuel.

[swamprb]

Jimmy- Are you signed up for the Klose class at Apple Creek Timber? If so what will you be cooking on?

[snoqualmiesmoker]

Jimmy- Are you signed up for the Klose class at Apple Creek Timber? If so what will you be cooking on?

Yep, and we will be brining everything, but the kitchen stove. You?