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cseymour45
08-27-2015, 11:20 AM
This could be a thread in the catering section and i'm sure it has been answered at some point. However, I am just curious how many of you backyard warriors make extra cash cooking for families or churches. I have tossed around the idea for sometime, but I also start thinking about whatever liability is at risk. I would probably only cook for smaller groups, family friends etc. as capacity is somewhat of an issue with only a Humphrey Weeble. Businesses are where I could see some legality issues. I don't really want to go through the hassle of becoming a real business on my end, just enjoy cooking and people enjoy my Q, so I figure why not make some extra cash and maybe earn enough to get a new smoker one day.

If you have any horror stories or tips, please share. I have many questions just finding a lot more about real catering companies when I search online.

Teleking
08-27-2015, 12:10 PM
The health department will send all of your hopes and dreams spiraling into the pit of despair.

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 12:21 PM
The health department will send all of your hopes and dreams spiraling into the pit of despair.

You mean if they were to find out? I wasn't planning on running some big operation, just under the table stuff for family friends or anyone that could be trusted not to come after me with lawyers if they choked on a rib.

Diesel Dave
08-27-2015, 12:31 PM
You can't trust anyone NOT to sue you if they choke on a rib bone or by some chance get sick. Not saying you're not being clean and doing things properly in your cooking, but it happens. Maybe not your food but you're leaving a door open for law suits by not being legal and carrying insurance

churrodog
08-27-2015, 12:35 PM
I don't have experience in it, but wouldn't it be hard to actually make money without selling in quantity? The cost of fuel, meat, serving trays, sides, etc. would add up pretty fast, especially since you would have to front all of it and would need a system to collect.

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 12:44 PM
I don't have experience in it, but wouldn't it be hard to actually make money without selling in quantity? The cost of fuel, meat, serving trays, sides, etc. would add up pretty fast, especially since you would have to front all of it and would need a system to collect.

Sure, all of those things like you mentioned would have to be figured into the cost of the buyer. The total needs to be figured before hand, that way your buyer can have one lump total. So no, to answer I don't see it being hard to make money, the question is just how much money. A $50 profit is still profit. Basically what i'm getting at is that I have plenty of free time while still having a job, but i'm not really wanting to jump through all of the hurdles of a big catering operation.

Pole D
08-27-2015, 12:49 PM
Can you be hire to just as a cook? In other words the group buys the food/rubs/whatever and then you get hired to cook what they purchased.

Teleking
08-27-2015, 12:52 PM
If you're willing to loose everything you own, have at it. Not a risk I would be willing to make. This has been discussed many times.

pjtexas1
08-27-2015, 12:56 PM
This crosses my mind every now and then but then I think about how stupid people are and I never do anything. My cooks are limited to my house. I make a couple of exceptions for the guys at work but even that scares me. I have one next month where a good friend of mine that used to work for me is hosting his daughter's volleyball team, small D3 school. Should be about 25 people. I really trust this guy but I tell him in advance that if someone sues I am putting all the blame on his terrible food handling skills because I know the food was safe when I handed it to him. We laugh but he knows I am serious. The biggest cook I have done was for a family that owns a chain of restaurants. That was a cook for over 100 and I was nervous for days after. Probably never do that again. I think it gets too complicated really quick. Some of the horror stories just scare the crap out of me but then again I am the paranoid type to begin with so keep that in mind while reading this. Short of getting insurance specific to catering your home owners will not extend to food that leaves your property or at least that is what I was told by my agent. I don't have any idea what happens if the health department catches you buy some odd chance.

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 12:56 PM
Can you be hire to just as a cook? In other words the group buys the food/rubs/whatever and then you get hired to cook what they purchased.

I guess maybe that's how I should have worded this thread. I am not looking to make sides and all of that jazz for people. Or even giving them nice warmers to hold the food. I'm thinking more like this question from 'Pole', my profits would probably come from my time and whatever someone is willing to pay for that. They are on their own once I get the finished products to them.

AlwaysSmokey
08-27-2015, 01:08 PM
Word of mouth works wonders. Cards left at gas stations. Social media. Plenty of ways to spread the word. There are many guys taking orders for daily cooks using patio cookers or small backyard smokers.

I think being legit is a very good thing. Having food safe practices, cooking areas, and certifications. Insurance and all the legalities paid for, etc....

However, I hate it when people instantly threaten with "your going to loose everything" or any other toxic vomit they can spew. ---he's just selling a few racks to neighbors. I guess my neighbor is going to loose everything for selling me eggs huh ?!! Get a grip !

Would I worry about getting sued over 4 racks of ribs.... no. Would I worry about the health dept.? .... no. Small stuff, like what I think you have in mind, is just a little extra spending cash. I say go ahead, have fun, pocket a little beer money.

Regards,

Kevin

pjtexas1
08-27-2015, 01:18 PM
I guess maybe that's how I should have worded this thread. I am not looking to make sides and all of that jazz for people. Or even giving them nice warmers to hold the food. I'm thinking more like this question from 'Pole', my profits would probably come from my time and whatever someone is willing to pay for that. They are on their own once I get the finished products to them.

This is basically what I do. They bring the meat to me and when I am done they pick it up. No sides. Just meat, disposable pans and instructions on how to slice. I have never charged anyone officially but I do request a bag of charcoal, a big roll of foil, etc to get back a little of what I am putting into it. I get some requests but I normally turn them down. What I am really looking for is some sort of charity to cook for so they can assume all the risks.

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 01:20 PM
Word of mouth works wonders. Cards left at gas stations. Social media. Plenty of ways to spread the word. There are many guys taking orders for daily cooks using patio cookers or small backyard smokers.

I think being legit is a very good thing. Having food safe practices, cooking areas, and certifications. Insurance and all the legalities paid for, etc....

However, I hate it when people instantly threaten with "your going to loose everything" or any other toxic vomit they can spew. ---he's just selling a few racks to neighbors. I guess my neighbor is going to loose everything for selling me eggs huh ?!! Get a grip !

Would I worry about getting sued over 4 racks of ribs.... no. Would I worry about the health dept.? .... no. Small stuff, like what I think you have in mind, is just a little extra spending cash. I say go ahead, have fun, pocket a little beer money.

Regards,

Kevin

That's pretty much how I feel about it. I know people that have pulled it off many times, never had a problem whatsoever. These topics bring out the negative nancy's which I can already clearly see. I don't ever see stories about the Amish people I used to live around in Iowa being taken for everything they have for selling some jams, pies or whatever else they have. Highly doubt they are all legal with papers where I grew up in So IA.

Common sense goes a long way.

Diesel Dave
08-27-2015, 01:24 PM
However, I hate it when people instantly threaten with "your going to loose everything" or any other toxic vomit they can spew. ---he's just selling a few racks to neighbors. I guess my neighbor is going to loose everything for selling me eggs huh ?!! Get a grip !

Would I worry about getting sued over 4 racks of ribs.... no. Would I worry about the health dept.? .... no. Small stuff, like what I think you have in mind, is just a little extra spending cash. I say go ahead, have fun, pocket a little beer money.

Regards,

Kevin

You're neighbor is selling you a raw product. Not a cooked product. There's a difference. Not trying to argue here just pointing this out.

ETA: Not being negative, just pointing out reality.
And here the health dept does check the Amish, be it a stand or their pie shops.
The pie shops have to be licensed here, it's a cooked product

Smoke & Bark Barbecue
08-27-2015, 01:30 PM
That's pretty much how I feel about it. I know people that have pulled it off many times, never had a problem whatsoever. These topics bring out the negative nancy's which I can already clearly see. I don't ever see stories about the Amish people I used to live around in Iowa being taken for everything they have for selling some jams, pies or whatever else they have. Highly doubt they are all legal with papers where I grew up in So IA.

Common sense goes a long way.


There is very little of this left in the world.

Yes there is a profit to be made. Yes its possible. Try it.....enjoy.

Smoke & Bark Barbecue
08-27-2015, 01:32 PM
Word of mouth works wonders. Cards left at gas stations. Social media. Plenty of ways to spread the word. There are many guys taking orders for daily cooks using patio cookers or small backyard smokers.

I think being legit is a very good thing. Having food safe practices, cooking areas, and certifications. Insurance and all the legalities paid for, etc....

However, I hate it when people instantly threaten with "your going to loose everything" or any other toxic vomit they can spew. ---he's just selling a few racks to neighbors. I guess my neighbor is going to loose everything for selling me eggs huh ?!! Get a grip !

Would I worry about getting sued over 4 racks of ribs.... no. Would I worry about the health dept.? .... no. Small stuff, like what I think you have in mind, is just a little extra spending cash. I say go ahead, have fun, pocket a little beer money.

Regards,

Kevin

Thank you!

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 01:40 PM
You're neighbor is selling you a raw product. Not a cooked product. There's a difference. Not trying to argue here just pointing this out.

ETA: Not being negative, just pointing out reality.
And here the health dept does check the Amish, be it a stand or their pie shops.
The pie shops have to be licensed here, it's a cooked product

In reality depending on the state the egg seller could have a high cause for concern, have they been chilled, are you labeling a grade? I know the USDA takes these things seriously.

I probably shouldn't have used the Amish as an example, because I do know in the upper states they are heavily inspected. This isn't the case in small town So Iowa, I knew many families that didn't give a damn about any papers and sold many items roadside, no pie shops.

It's just the risks that some people are willing to take that others aren't.

AlwaysSmokey
08-27-2015, 01:42 PM
It's all good Diesel Dave !
:tea:
I am just saying the times I have done it, friends have done it, people I know on facebook have done it,.. no one sh*t bricks over health dept. stuff. I just don't see it as a worry. I tend not to be a worrying type though. I got better stuff to do with my life. :thumb:

Regards,

Kevin

SmokinJohn
08-27-2015, 01:43 PM
....What I am really looking for is some sort of charity to cook for so they can assume all the risks...

Therein lies the problem.

Let's say you are making 5 pork butts for a church. You drop one pulling it out of the smoker. You rinse it off (5 second rule) and foil it and send it.

Someone gets ill eating it. You want the church to take the hit for that? That's not cool.

What if one of the butts was bad from the start? The supplier should take the hit, not you or the church.

There was a case where an American company bought tires made in China and supplied them to American passenger cars. The Chinese manufacturer changed the design specs (to make more profit, but making the tires less safe) without informing the American importer.

When the tires blew (harming and killing people), who did the victim's families go after? The importer. The importer claimed it was the Manufacturer's fault. The victim's families didn't care; the importer should have checked the quality of the goods. The courts agreed.

I am not trying to rain on your parade, but your post struck a nerve. I understand what you are trying to do, and I admire it. I would like to do the dame thing. But I see why BBQ costs so much in the stores and trucks. It's not just the cost of the meat and rubs and charcoal. It's liability insurance. It's fire insurance.

landarc
08-27-2015, 01:44 PM
I will chime in here for those of use who used to, or still do, cook professionally, and who tried, or still try to make a living as cooks. What you are proposing to do it illegal, it cheats the system against those of us that do it the right way. It's no different that a company that pays people under the table. Now, that being said...

Can/will you make money, of course you will. Because you are not paying for insurance, licensing, kitchen time, commisary expenses etc...you will be able to undercut the existing market and make good money doing this. The likelihood of your being sued is very minute, simply because people will rarely sue a freelance cook. The irony is, the more legitimate you are as a catering or vending operation, the more likely it is that you will be sued.

AlwaysSmokey
08-27-2015, 01:57 PM
Well,.. lemmy just say that I am not cheating anyone. If local BBQ joints were up to the task I would never get a call. Secondly, I get calls that start with,.." you firing up the pit " So to say I am preforming some illegal activity is the same as saying my son is as well for shredding the neighbors back 20 and getting paid for it. He's not an insured lawn service is he?! But he's cheating huh....?... I dunno,.. that cheating comment rubbed me a little wrong. I know what you are trying to say landarc,.. I just don't see it that way. How is my or my son's hard work cheating? Now if I started serving 200 people a day and not paying anything,... yeah,.. I totally agree,.. but this... nah,... this ain't anything worth fussin over.

Regards,

Kevin

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 02:10 PM
What you are proposing to do it illegal, it cheats the system against those of us that do it the right way. It's no different that a company that pays people under the table. Now, that being said...

The irony is, the more legitimate you are as a catering or vending operation, the more likely it is that you will be sued.

You would have a hard case trying to sell the following as illegal:
1. Person A buys a pork butt on his own from any given retailer.
2. Person B cooks said pork butt at his home for person A.
3. Person A gives person B a donation he deems proper.
4. Person A picks up pork butt from person B when a proper temp is reached.

Two individuals can do whatever they please with whatever food they choose. You are talking about running a business illegally. I am not proposing that.

I agree though, your risk of being sued goes up the more legitimate you are because you are generally feeding more and risking more. It isn't really that crazy of a concept to me.

landarc
08-27-2015, 02:16 PM
You would have a hard case trying to sell the following as illegal:
1. Person A buys a pork butt on his own from any given retailer.
2. Person B cooks said pork butt at his home for person A.
3. Person A gives person B a donation he deems proper.
4. Person A picks up pork butt from person B when a proper temp is reached.

.
You're in Texas, I am in California, that is the starting point.

Yes, what you are describing is illegal in California. It has already been determined that regardless of the nature of the transaction or how things are titled, if cooked food is exchanged under and agreement, for either money or credit, that the food is considered to fall under the requirements for proper food handling. Meaning, it cannot be prepared in a residential kitchen.

landarc
08-27-2015, 02:22 PM
Well,.. lemmy just say that I am not cheating anyone. If local BBQ joints were up to the task I would never get a call. Secondly, I get calls that start with,.." you firing up the pit " So to say I am preforming some illegal activity is the same as saying my son is as well for shredding the neighbors back 20 and getting paid for it. He's not an insured lawn service is he?! But he's cheating huh....?... I dunno,.. that cheating comment rubbed me a little wrong. I know what you are trying to say landarc,.. I just don't see it that way. How is my or my son's hard work cheating? Now if I started serving 200 people a day and not paying anything,... yeah,.. I totally agree,.. but this... nah,... this ain't anything worth fussin over.

Regards,

Kevin
I apologize if it rubbed you the wrong way, certainly not why I am on this forum. I was making a point about how some (including me) feel about this issue.

In the real world, I am a licensed and registered landscape architect, who specializes in selling design and engineering consulting services. It does rub me the wrong way when gardeners, who carry none of the $5,000 of costs I have to pay every year, undercut me for design services when they are not supposed to be selling them.

Your son wants to hustle up a bunch of chipping and mowing work, more power to him. I personally, draw a random line, at 18 years old, if a kid under 18 wants to hustle and get some work going, I always support that. When it's an adult, totally different to me.

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 02:22 PM
Well i'll be darned landarc... So I need to stay out of California, do not formally agree on anything, hope that whoever picking the food up hides the donation somewhere for me to find and i'll be alright. Easy enough.

Diesel Dave
08-27-2015, 02:33 PM
The law that Landarc mentioned is applicable here in Michigan as well. I'm guessing it's the same in all states

Ron_L
08-27-2015, 02:38 PM
Illinois, too

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 02:47 PM
Alright, so originally I asked if anyone had any horror stories. Do any of you have ACTUAL people you know that have been served with fines or anything of the such. I understand we have laws on everything, our states all have seat belt laws and speeding laws, but we don't all follow the rules all day everyday.

It's nice seeing all the opinions, but from what I read there's a group of people that would classify me with criminals and take my home and car away from me... and another that would let me join them in the backyard and drink beer.

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 03:13 PM
You would have a hard case trying to sell the following as illegal:
1. Person A buys a pork butt on his own from any given retailer.
2. Person B cooks said pork butt at his home for person A.
3. Person A gives person B a donation he deems proper.
4. Person A picks up pork butt from person B when a proper temp is reached.

Two individuals can do whatever they please with whatever food they choose. You are talking about running a business illegally. I am not proposing that.

I agree though, your risk of being sued goes up the more legitimate you are because you are generally feeding more and risking more. It isn't really that crazy of a concept to me.


I hate to wade into this chit show but you are forgetting about the IRS. Donation=benefit= income

daninnewjersey
08-27-2015, 03:35 PM
I sold a bunch of BBQ for a while before I started selling at the farmer's market. Never had any horror stories.....and I sold quite a bit. Of course I only sold to people I knew or people recommended to me by people I knew and trusted. Never sold to total, out of the blue strangers......I would tell them they had the wrong guy....:becky::becky:

PatAttack
08-27-2015, 03:35 PM
Why take the chance?

pjtexas1
08-27-2015, 03:47 PM
Alright, so originally I asked if anyone had any horror stories. Do any of you have ACTUAL people you know that have been served with fines or anything of the such. I understand we have laws on everything, our states all have seat belt laws and speeding laws, but we don't all follow the rules all day everyday.

It's nice seeing all the opinions, but from what I read there's a group of people that would classify me with criminals and take my home and car away from me... and another that would let me join them in the backyard and drink beer.

I like to think we would all welcome you in the backyard for some q and beer. Some of us are just paranoid farkers. Do what you feel comfortable doing.:thumb: We are just trying to give all the angles even if they are far fetched to some degree.:heh:

SmokinJohn
08-27-2015, 03:52 PM
Alright, so originally I asked if anyone had any horror stories. Do any of you have ACTUAL people you know that have been served with fines or anything of the such. I understand we have laws on everything, our states all have seat belt laws and speeding laws, but we don't all follow the rules all day everyday.

It's nice seeing all the opinions, but from what I read there's a group of people that would classify me with criminals and take my home and car away from me... and another that would let me join them in the backyard and drink beer.

Kevin,

I have relatives that are criminals. That doesn't mean I wouldn't have a beer with them. :peace:

I am supposed to have car insurance on my vehicles. In lieu of that, I can post a $35,000 bond with my DMV.

I *could* say, "Not gonna do it. Not paying for insurance". And I would save thousands per year....until the day I get in a three or four-car pileup and get sued.

No one is trying to stop you from what you want to do; We are a concerned group of people, both pro and amateur, that are giving you both sides of the coin.

cds9333
08-27-2015, 04:04 PM
While I do not have a horror story, I wanted to provide the following link explaining Texas' laws. http://farmandranchfreedom.org/texas-cottage-foods-law-2013-faq/

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 04:09 PM
I hate to wade into this chit show but you are forgetting about the IRS. Donation=benefit= income

:clap::clap2: And on this note I guess I will just bow out of this thread and actually regret starting :doh:. I should have known it would get completely blown out of proportion like most things. I'll just go back to my beer, mind my own business and let the paranoid group carry on.

AlwaysSmokey
08-27-2015, 04:14 PM
Wow,... just wow,.. some of you are just mind numbing. No wonder this country is so caught up on all the wrong sh*t.

This attitude. This blast a person first and tell them you know everything attitude. They are cheaters and are taking business from companies. I mean really,.... do you hear yourself? Just,... farking wow. I am glad me and my neighbors, friends, family, community, do not share your ideals or views on how to deal with situations like this,.. and probably most everything else.

Sad,

Kevin

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 04:19 PM
:clap::clap2: And on this note I guess I will just bow out of this thread and actually regret starting :doh:. I should have known it would get completely blown out of proportion like most things. I'll just go back to my beer, mind my own business and let the paranoid group carry on.

Wow, just trying to help since I actually own a small business and deal with crap like this.

You go ahead and do what you got to do for a few bucks. I will not share any business related info with you that is based on experience, law, or education that I have received. Don't want to hurt your feelings and all. Everyone here is just trying to help. If you only wanted to hear a specific opinion, you should of just asked yourself.

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 04:21 PM
Wow,... just wow,.. some of you are just mind numbing. No wonder this country is so caught up on all the wrong sh*t.

This attitude. This blast a person first and tell them you know everything attitude. They are cheaters and are taking business from companies. I mean really,.... do you hear yourself? Just,... farking wow. I am glad me and my neighbors, friends, family, community, do not share your ideals or views on how to deal with situations like this,.. and probably most everything else.

Sad,

Kevin

Nobody blasted anybody. People were just trying to help.

Haveuseen1?
08-27-2015, 04:30 PM
Here in Alabama I think nearly every High School Football and Baseball team has a pork butt fund raiser. They usually presell the butts for 35.00 each. Money goes to the sports Alumni club. That way the club can funnel money to the sports program for items that are really needed but the red tape of the school system creates chaos on. New bleachers, helmets, travel expenses, etc.... I have never noticed a Health Inspector permit being displayed. They are heavily advertised. Either they are breaking the law and nobody cares, or they have all the permits etc... maybe they just dont display them.

I will say, that if a weekend cook, who occasionally cooks some butts for someone, takes enough business away from a "legitimate" business, that it has a real financial impact, then I believe the business already has enough trouble that it will not be here long anyway. Not saying it is right or wrong, just saying that if that one guy can close you down, then odds are your business is lousy anyway.

I dont really have a dog in this fight, other than I do buy the school butts. I would feel a little weird telling them I cant buy their butts because Big Bob Gibsons right down the road sells butts and legally I have to buy them all from them. I understand your school program may suffer from this, but the law is the law. I do think Big Bob Gibsons has been around for a long time. Actually they started in 1925 selling meat from the back yard.

AlwaysSmokey
08-27-2015, 04:31 PM
Oifmarine2003, he isn't a business. He asked about making some cash on the side. Your's and other's business exp. is not in question here. I'm sure it's vast.

But when I hear things like I have heard earlier in this thread,... wow,.. just wow...

Like, and I'm paraphrasing, "stealing buisness" and "cheating" and "earning under the table is fine till your 18..." and " the health dept. is gonna get you" and " your gonna loose everything".

:tsk:

kev.

landarc
08-27-2015, 04:37 PM
Kev, I am sorry, again, that you find what I have said to be so offensive. To be clear, I never said he will get sued/loose everything/die from the plague, all I pointed out is that a few of use who had/have business in the food industry feel a little perturbed when folks don't play by the rules that we play by.

In fact, I would fall on the side of believing that a person doing this is almost 100% not going to get into trouble of any kind. I've been a business entrepreneur for 35 years now, life has treated me well. And to be honest, I have not always played by the rules. So be it. Just putting another point of view out there.

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 04:39 PM
Oifmarine2003, he isn't a business. He asked about making some cash on the side.


.

If you think that makes any difference to the IRS you are fooling yourself.

landarc
08-27-2015, 04:42 PM
Here in Alabama I think nearly every High School Football and Baseball team has a pork butt fund raiser. They usually presell the butts for 35.00 each. Money goes to the sports Alumni club. That way the club can funnel money to the sports program for items that are really needed but the red tape of the school system creates chaos on. New bleachers, helmets, travel expenses, etc.... I have never noticed a Health Inspector permit being displayed. They are heavily advertised. Either they are breaking the law and nobody cares, or they have all the permits etc... maybe they just dont display them.

I will say, that if a weekend cook, who occasionally cooks some butts for someone, takes enough business away from a "legitimate" business, that it has a real financial impact, then I believe the business already has enough trouble that it will not be here long anyway. Not saying it is right or wrong, just saying that if that one guy can close you down, then odds are your business is lousy anyway.

I dont really have a dog in this fight, other than I do buy the school butts. I would feel a little weird telling them I cant buy their butts because Big Bob Gibsons right down the road sells butts and legally I have to buy them all from them. I understand your school program may suffer from this, but the law is the law. I do think Big Bob Gibsons has been around for a long time. Actually they started in 1925 selling meat from the back yard.
This is really a vague area of the code. I have, for the past 40 years, been involved with charity cooks for churches and non-profts. The requirements have changed slowly, with the general trend to more regulation (I know, shocking). My current understanding is that most of these cooks are illegal to the letter of the law, but, are ignored, as they are seen as generally in the public interest. Our church has been shut down twice, and threatened with closure once, over our old Chicken Teriyaki fundraiser. We never did find out who was the complainant.

Many of the schools out here have abandoned the cook-out type fundraiser and instead work with local restaurants to do "school night" type fundraisers.

Jason TQ
08-27-2015, 04:54 PM
:clap::clap2: And on this note I guess I will just bow out of this thread and actually regret starting :doh:. I should have known it would get completely blown out of proportion like most things. I'll just go back to my beer, mind my own business and let the paranoid group carry on.

Ah cool.

Let's be honest here shall we cseymour45..............With 3 pages this quick and you resisting all those suggestions with new questions (which about 95% say don't do it) your mind was made up before it even started :thumb:.

You didn't hear what you wanted over and over again, so you use the argument that it is getting "blown out of proportion" and time for you to leave because the disagreeing masses told you what you didn't want to hear even for a second :clap2:. So it's the masses fault and not yours..........got it :thumb:

Your scapegoat is you haven't heard any horror stories on this thread yet. So sell away! :becky:

Edit: And proudly share your margins with the licensed restaurant owners/caterers on here. They love that stuff :-D

Teleking
08-27-2015, 05:13 PM
How much did that cup of coffee cost McNasty back in the day?

For the record church kitchens selling food are licenced here. 501(3)(c) non profits are exempt from the rules.

Making arrangement to cook in a licensed facility is perfectly legal. Church, VFW, elks club, soup kitchen, etc... Most ins. Company's will underwrite any of the aforementioned location policy for said activities.

Cheers

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 05:50 PM
Ah cool.

Let's be honest here shall we cseymour45..............With 3 pages this quick and you resisting all those suggestions with new questions (which about 95% say don't do it) your mind was made up before it even started :thumb:.

You didn't hear what you wanted over and over again, so you use the argument that it is getting "blown out of proportion" and time for you to leave because the disagreeing masses told you what you didn't want to hear even for a second :clap2:. So it's the masses fault and not yours..........got it :thumb:

Your scapegoat is you haven't heard any horror stories on this thread yet. So sell away! :becky:

Edit: And proudly share your margins with the licensed restaurant owners/caterers on here. They love that stuff :-D

No it really wasn't, until the IRS comments started. But now it is.

Not a scapegoat, just the truth.:thumb: Someone got a little angry :chillpill:

Jason TQ
08-27-2015, 06:01 PM
Someone got a little angry :chillpill:

Yes that was you :becky:. Glad you pointed it out for us with you post about turning and leaving stomping your feet because you got "mistreated" and didn't hear what you wanted to hear :clap:.

But I guess you are definitely done now, your know..........coming back after you said you were out..............:-D

dport7
08-27-2015, 06:06 PM
Nothing to do with Q, I was in business since 1986. one of the good ones was, there
was a car wreck, a picture taken showed my dump truck in the background, I was called by someones lawyer trying to blame me for distracting the driver, long story short if I wouldn't have had insurance against frivolous law suits it would have cost me 10 grand, thats what the $ was before it was dropped.

Considering I was 60 feet off the road paving a parking lot, minding my own business.

Hope it never happens to him, but if it does, be ready, it won't be fun.

landarc
08-27-2015, 06:08 PM
I hope you learned your lesson and drive less distracting dump trucks now

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 06:08 PM
Yes that was you :becky:. Glad you pointed it out for us with you post about turning and leaving stomping your feet because you got "mistreated" and didn't hear what you wanted to hear :clap:.

But I guess you are definitely done now, your know..........coming back after you said you were out..............:-D

Ha! Sorry fnbish, I missed the rule that you have to declare yourself back. Apologies! I am glad this has turned into a blast cseymour45 by you and has nothing to do with Q. I never heard stomping feet, surprised they carried clear the GA, I don't recall claiming I was mistreated. I just had not interest in debating the pros and cons, apparently you measured it was already at 95% cons.

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 06:11 PM
No it really wasn't, until the IRS comments started. But now it is.

Not a scapegoat, just the truth.:thumb: Someone got a little angry :chillpill:

So, in your opinion, who got mad? I mean, besides you (obviously).

And it wasn't comments. It was a fact. If you don't want to believe what the IRS considers income, than so be it.

Jason TQ
08-27-2015, 06:21 PM
Ha! Sorry fnbish, I missed the rule that you have to declare yourself back. Apologies! I am glad this has turned into a blast cseymour45 by you and has nothing to do with Q. I never heard stomping feet, surprised they carried clear the GA, I don't recall claiming I was mistreated. I just had not interest in debating the pros and cons, apparently you measured it was already at 95% cons.

Just pointing out that you verbally said you were done when the other kids weren't playing the way you wanted to play. You could have continued a civilized discussion about the topic you chose, but instead you did a "I'm out mic drop" kind of deal which to me sounded like you were a little fussy.

I wish you well and hope you don't get into any trouble. Perhaps you'll be able to take criticism better in the future when others don't share your opinion that you asked for. And maybe don't call all those others a "paranoid group" as you walk away not wanting to play anymore because they didn't play nice.

-Jason

dport7
08-27-2015, 06:21 PM
I hope you learned your lesson and drive less distracting dump trucks now

Yes I did I sold the business, and left that lousy state.

So, in your opinion, who got mad? I mean, besides you (obviously).

And it wasn't comments. It was a fact. If you don't want to believe what the IRS considers income, than so be it.

Love your sig line, how true, how true.

Ok, back to the one sided debate.

Ron_L
08-27-2015, 06:32 PM
Mod note:

Before this gets out of control, let's all take a step back and relax. Folks are free to ask whatever question they like, but folks are also free to express their opinion when answering that question. That means that you won't always like the answer that you get :-D

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 06:34 PM
So, in your opinion, who got mad? I mean, besides you (obviously).

And it wasn't comments. It was a fact. If you don't want to believe what the IRS considers income, than so be it.

No, I really haven't been mad at all. When was it so obvious, if I may ask? Did I throw up some mad icons?
Anyway, I really don't care about the IRS involvement in any of this, I am not opening a 'business', period.
If you think every individual in this country goes around reporting every extra couple of hundred dollars they get you are sadly mistaken. The IRS wouldn't even waste a single second stressing over me and my measly few ribs I cook for my buddy down the street.
I understand all of your concerns over food safety, that is probably the most important consideration in all of this. Not the glamorous extra beer drinking money.
I can't help it if my Q is better than anything in my neighborhood, we don't have a Franklins on every street, people want quality stuff without having to drive long distances and not everyone has a smoker. So, i'm sorry I don't work for wooden nickels, but I will help a brother out from time to time and a nice discounted rate. I was just curious how many of you have had bad experiences, and from the replies not many.

Jason TQ
08-27-2015, 06:34 PM
Ok, back to the one sided debate.

I'd actually like to see it get back on track. Even if some folks leave. Maybe some that have done it successfully and made a lot of money could share or they found loopholes that made it legit. Not everyone has seen this yet so there could be horror stories, though getting sued is likely not going to be shared.

BBQLuver
08-27-2015, 06:35 PM
This is really a vague area of the code. I have, for the past 40 years, been involved with charity cooks for churches and non-profts. The requirements have changed slowly, with the general trend to more regulation (I know, shocking). My current understanding is that most of these cooks are illegal to the letter of the law, but, are ignored, as they are seen as generally in the public interest. Our church has been shut down twice, and threatened with closure once, over our old Chicken Teriyaki fundraiser. We never did find out who was the complainant.

Many of the schools out here have abandoned the cook-out type fundraiser and instead work with local restaurants to do "school night" type fundraisers.

I'm not a lawyer and I'm not quoting the law, but I was told that many of the schools and churches have been changing their "bake sales" to be "bake donations" where you "donate" a specific amount you will "receive" a prize/thank you award. That award/prize just happens to be food. This allows them to skirt some of the issues of selling food because it is no longer technically being sold.

PatAttack
08-27-2015, 06:43 PM
Good idea. Maybe you could just turn it into a "donation", sort of thing.?

pjtexas1
08-27-2015, 06:46 PM
I'm not a lawyer and I'm not quoting the law, but I was told that many of the schools and churches have been changing their "bake sales" to be "bake donations" where you "donate" a specific amount you will "receive" a prize/thank you award. That award/prize just happens to be food. This allows them to skirt some of the issues of selling food because it is no longer technically being sold.

When I asked this question I was told told something different. My insurance agent said that any food that you cook that you are responsible for said food regardless of selling or giving it away. I don't know about other states...

That being said I do see all bake sales around here are "donations". Never really thought much about it until I read your post. There has to be something to it or they would still be bake sales, right???

cseymour45
08-27-2015, 06:47 PM
I'd actually like to see it get back on track. Even if some folks leave. Maybe some that have done it successfully and made a lot of money could share or they found loopholes that made it legit. Not everyone has seen this yet so there could be horror stories, though getting sued is likely not going to be shared.

From what I have researched the only way to become 'legit' is to open an actual trailer. Which really wouldn't be that hard, but you would need probably a solid 4 - 6 grand, maybe more. Because all of us Q guys don't fall into the Cottage Food laws, we have items that are potentially hazardous. Even though I trust my Q over some of the restaurants I've entered.
I just haven't gotten any stories like I thought I might about the average Joe that's only doing a few racks of ribs and a couple butts. Which makes me feel good. I didn't think about pissing of restaurant owners because there aren't really any around me that do what i'm talking about.

dport7
08-27-2015, 06:48 PM
The church I attend has done a fall festival for three years now, we don't charge any money, just for that reason, plus it helps the ones who don't quite have enough.

We use moneys out of our general fund for those types of things.

dport7
08-27-2015, 07:12 PM
From what I have researched the only way to become 'legit' is to open an actual trailer. Which really wouldn't be that hard, but you would need probably a solid 4 - 6 grand, maybe more.

That would be a good thing, you never know. What if that investment turned 30 times that much each year. If it is your passion, go for it.
If you don't make any profit, "meaning more write off than income"
after a certain amount of time you will be considered a hobby business
and hopefully left alone by our buddy's "irs" Do it right though, talk to a
GOOD tax accountant

Best to ya in your endeavors, I was told I couldn't do it also, I bought em out in 5 years, ran theirs as mine for 7 more years. Joke was on them.

pjtexas1
08-27-2015, 07:21 PM
Mod note:

Before this gets out of control, let's all take a step back and relax. Folks are free to ask whatever question they like, but folks are also free to express their opinion when answering that question. That means that you won't always like the answer that you get :-D

Before...:laugh: since when is Ron the comedian around here?

Teleking
08-27-2015, 07:21 PM
No, I really haven't been mad at all. When was it so obvious, if I may ask? Did I throw up some mad icons?
Anyway, I really don't care about the IRS involvement in any of this, I am not opening a 'business', period.
If you think every individual in this country goes around reporting every extra couple of hundred dollars they get you are sadly mistaken. The IRS wouldn't even waste a single second stressing over me and my measly few ribs I cook for my buddy down the street.
I understand all of your concerns over food safety, that is probably the most important consideration in all of this. Not the glamorous extra beer drinking money.
I can't help it if my Q is better than anything in my neighborhood, we don't have a Franklins on every street, people want quality stuff without having to drive long distances and not everyone has a smoker. So, i'm sorry I don't work for wooden nickels, but I will help a brother out from time to time and a nice discounted rate. I was just curious how many of you have had bad experiences, and from the replies not many.

Worked well for Al Capone and Wesley Snipes��.

Can't speak for unlicensed operation but my short stint with the health department observed many legitiment licensed facilities get fined for the whole spectrum of food code violations. Not to stereotype but the majority are Asian fair establishments with a language and cultural barrier. Cross contamination is a big one and even seen some BBQ vids posted that make me cringe.

That said a pasta barn continuously got slammed for dumping acres of leftover steaming pasta in a bin into the fridge. Still 50 degrees 12 hours later in the fridge. List goes on. Baked potatoes improperly cooled at room temp then chilled..outbreak. The best one was a catered wedding by a licenced facility. 80+ people sick out of 125. Investigation revealed those 80 had wedding cake. Result was the real cake got dropped the day before and the well intended MIL made a new cake on a fresh cross cut log platter.

Don't even get me started on the meat slicers at the local deli not getting cleaned and sanitized.

It happens regardless of how well intended the gesture. I have a very very hard time eating out.

Cheers I wish you well on your venture. A visit to the local health dept. will give you all the information you want on fines levied and violations as its free public information.

Edit:
Forgot to mention the food borne illness symptoms can take up to 72 hours to present. As such, even if your food is not the cause anything eaten in that time frame will be questioned and investigated for everyone that is sick.

pwa
08-27-2015, 07:36 PM
From what I have researched the only way to become 'legit' is to open an actual trailer.

Call the Health Dept alot of states allow 1 -3 day vending on a temp permit, they usually require 3 tub for wash, one for hand, Hot water with a on/off pour spout, thermometer and keeping food in the safe range. all easy enough to do for under $100. permits are cheap 2. At least that way your legit.

I owned and ran a BBQ shack, I still do catering but I do it all legit I learned my lesson..... you wanted a story here you go I started selling things as you described made a few bucks, so one Thanksgiving I decide while I was cooking for the rescue mission(which I do every thanksgiving with my kids) I pre sell a few birds and donate the money to the rescue mission. Well 1 customer started calling and complaining about a raw turkey cause it was to juicy to be cooked. I tried explaining brining, proper cooking and not over cooking to no avail. I gave her double her money back out of my pocket and went legit the next day. And for the record I got a call the next day telling me it took her 9 hr to get the bird cooked properly. It can and does happen the few buck it takes to do it legit is alot better then worrying for weeks you'd get a call saying hello my name is XYXZ attorney at law.

Do what you want. I'll still be doing it legit I came close enough to learn.

Clint

landarc
08-27-2015, 07:40 PM
darn those juicy, succulent smoked turkeys, what's wrong with you.

Dry as dust, Dry as dust


or, you could steam it into submission

PatAttack
08-27-2015, 07:45 PM
darn those juicy, succulent smoked turkeys, what's wrong with you.

Dry as dust, Dry as dust


or, you could steam it into submission

That story gets funnier every farking year!:pound::pound:

Maybe BIL could use a pressure cooker this year!:laugh:

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 08:09 PM
That story gets funnier every farking year!:pound::pound:

Maybe BIL could use a pressure cooker this year!:laugh:

I feel like you and your BIL should star in a reality show / sitcom. Cross between the odd couple, survivor, and perfect strangers.

mike-cleveland
08-27-2015, 08:11 PM
From what I have researched the only way to become 'legit' is to open an actual trailer. Which really wouldn't be that hard, but you would need probably a solid 4 - 6 grand, maybe more. Because all of us Q guys don't fall into the Cottage Food laws, we have items that are potentially hazardous. Even though I trust my Q over some of the restaurants I've entered.
I just haven't gotten any stories like I thought I might about the average Joe that's only doing a few racks of ribs and a couple butts. Which makes me feel good. I didn't think about pissing of restaurant owners because there aren't really any around me that do what i'm talking about.

Hey i started a thread in which I looked at the rules and see what I need to do. End off story obey the rules.

AlwaysSmokey
08-27-2015, 09:01 PM
Oh for fark's sake.

For the millionth time,.. he is talking about small batch, low numbers, bbq. Patio cooking and letting a neighbor take home a rack for a couple of bucks. Not a catering service.

Should demand grow, or he decide to take a swing at scratching a living with it, then yes,.. you fellas are right. Taxes, health codes, and the methods of doing a venture professionally are the only way. But we aren't talking about that.

So before casting your snobby nose upward and passing your judgment, maybe you should make sure your having the same conversation.

For farks sake, what is with you guys?

Regards,
Kevin

oifmarine2003
08-27-2015, 09:09 PM
Oh for fark's sake.

For the millionth time,.. he is talking about small batch, low numbers, bbq. Patio cooking and letting a neighbor take home a rack for a couple of bucks. Not a catering service.

Should demand grow, or he decide to take a swing at scratching a living with it, then yes,.. you fellas are right. Taxes, health codes, and the methods of doing a venture professionally are the only way. But we aren't talking about that.

So before casting your snobby nose upward and passing your judgment, maybe you should make sure your having the same conversation.

For farks sake, what is with you guys?

Regards,
Kevin

Let it go

pwa
08-27-2015, 09:13 PM
Oh for fark's sake.

For the millionth time,.. he is talking about small batch, low numbers, bbq. Patio cooking and letting a neighbor take home a rack for a couple of bucks. Not a catering service.

Should demand grow, or he decide to take a swing at scratching a living with it, then yes,.. you fellas are right. Taxes, health codes, and the methods of doing a venture professionally are the only way. But we aren't talking about that.

So before casting your snobby nose upward and passing your judgment, maybe you should make sure your having the same conversation.

For farks sake, what is with you guys?

Regards,
Kevin

Re read what I posted I started like hes talking... I learn my lesson. There is a reason the majority say do it right..... Like my Granddad always told me do it right or don't to it at all.... I wish I listen more saved me a lot of stress and worry.

Clint

mike-cleveland
08-27-2015, 09:24 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rfbn3ieVUYU


piece

Jfortner
08-27-2015, 10:06 PM
Live in CA, here they sue you just for talking to them and giving them bad advice.

Rusty Kettle
08-27-2015, 10:07 PM
I hear what your saying about this being just a small time guy but I am siding with the don't do it people here.

Odds are you won't have any trouble.

If you do get sued it will be ugly trust me. I have had to fight off a law suit.
Cost $75,000+ in legal fees. We won by the way if you can call that winning. It wasn't food related but it was hell. Pure hell.

Look I am not trying to make you mad or hurt you feelings. I am concerned that it may bite you right in your arse. I want to do the same thing myself and I have been offered good money and yeah it has crossed my mind about making a quick buck or two because we need it. There is to much risk for me personally to do it. I would check into a temporary food permit as was suggested. Probably not to expensive and you know to cover your arse it's worth a little bit of extra money.

Check into a temporary food permit it won't hurt to check.

Your getting some really good advice about this stuff. Sure some people got their undies in a bunch but they mean well.

I plan to sell down the road but I am getting the permits when we do and passing all the health inspections and whatever else is involved. It just isn't worth the head ache in my opinion.

Good luck to you and I hope you can make it work and be legit. If not don't do it as the possibility of something going wrong and you getting fined is pretty real. Not likely but you know if you do get hit you will regret it.

blazinfire
08-27-2015, 10:53 PM
Just feeling froggy and wanted to share my opinion on this matter. I think if a friend/family member came to you wanting you to spend day smoking them food I would ask for a "donation" for my time. As a beginner to smoking and using smokers it is a time consuming process.

But I don't think trying to make an extra buck doing "charity" cooks, or for groups of people would be a smart idea. that could cause the unwanted attention that everyone else is bringing up about health regulations and what not.

Friends can easily turn into an enemy if something crazy would happen. keep that in mind! There is a reason why people that cooks for $$$ is required to have special permits, insurance, etc. So I understand 100% where everyone else coming from that disagree's with the idea of this topic!

But if you don't get caught, then who cares right? :D

SmokinJohn
08-28-2015, 08:24 AM
Live in CA, here they sue you just for talking to them and giving them bad advice.

I'm suing you because you live near me and we haven't met, and you haven't been to the SoCal bashes.

Is there a lawyer in the house?

Art A
08-28-2015, 09:39 AM
Note to self....Don't ever...I mean ever...ask the brethren for opinions on selling Q' on the sly...Only questions on how to smoke, cook, what type of briquettes, rubs, sauces, etc. Unless, of course, I'm feeling mischievous and want to watch the s**t storm that develops.
:twisted:

bwaynef
08-28-2015, 10:24 AM
What would be the minimums for satisfactorily going legit ...in most states. 3 wash bins, a thermometer, ...and what else (besides the license/permit).

I've considered doing something similar last football season, ...and got some interest from folks, but couldn't nail down what I needed to legitimize things so I just cooked for myself.

Dinkle
08-28-2015, 10:49 AM
Lol don't let these Yankees discourage you. Texas isn't as liberal as the north.

ButtBurner
08-28-2015, 10:51 AM
What would be the minimums for satisfactorily going legit ...in most states. 3 wash bins, a thermometer, ...and what else (besides the license/permit).

I've considered doing something similar last football season, ...and got some interest from folks, but couldn't nail down what I needed to legitimize things so I just cooked for myself.

a certified commercial kitchen

Rusty Kettle
08-28-2015, 10:52 AM
I'm suing you because you live near me and we haven't met, and you haven't been to the SoCal bashes.

Is there a lawyer in the house?

John, that may sound absurd to most people but it happens. I can't go into the details for legal reasons. I will tell you though when I was sued along with my parents, my father had never and I mean never met the person filing suit against him. Trust me the court system is really screwed up. I guarantee there is a lawyer out there that would honestly be all for you doing that. I know you are joking but it does happen every single day. I am insured now for that sort of thing to protect myself in the future.

I have experienced frivolous lawsuits first hand. It's no picnic and cost about $75000. It's not a joke. People are offering advice like this because who is going to back him up in a law suit? His insurance will not back him up. He will be hung out to dry. People are very fast to file a suit these days and even if you win your legal costs are not considered damages therefore they are non-recoverable. Right or wrong doesn't matter in the eyes of the law. You have the right to represent yourself so you are free to choose not to have a lawyer so it is considered something you choose therefore not damages.

My point is it can get very ugly very quickly. While I will say you wont lose your home as your first residence is protected even if you and your spouse are sued your money is not safe and neither are your wages. They will garnish your wages if you lose a lawsuit. If you don't do it legit you are just asking for trouble. Take it from a guy who has fought off a law suit. It's not a picnic and it has gone on for years. It is pure hell. Don't put yourself at risk for something so stupid as not getting the proper permits. There are temporary permits in PA at least. They even ease regulations a little bit to make it more doable.

For a couple bucks do it legit as it isn't worth the headache if you get caught.
Probably you won't get caught but if you do you will regret it.

Pyle's BBQ
08-28-2015, 12:31 PM
This thread got me thinking. I am going to start doing small electrical jobs to make some extra cash. I'm fairly handy and understand the basics of electricity. What could go wrong?

SmokinJohn
08-28-2015, 01:36 PM
John, that may sound absurd to most people but it happens. ....For a couple bucks do it legit as it isn't worth the headache if you get caught.

Probably you won't get caught but if you do you will regret it.

I live in California, and my day job involves supporting our Litigation team.

I believe every word you said. The only position I haven't been in in court is as an officer (Judge, bailiff, reporter, clerk, or lawyer).

My comment was to my Yorba Linda Brother (I am probably 10 minutes max from him, but we haven't met) in jest.

DriverWild
08-28-2015, 02:17 PM
I think the rub here is that no one wants to give you bad advice. Bad advice could land you in hot water and no one wants to see you in that position. We would all tell our relatives, friends and neighbors the same advice you were given. I will give you some advice from a personal experience. I was having a garage sale and my son wanted to make some cash, how about selling hot dogs? I called the local health dept and ran it by them and they told me as long as he didn't charge money for the hot dogs we could do it. No problem, free hot dogs with a tip jar and the kid made more than if he had put a price on the dogs.

That being said, you are not a young person who makes like $5 per week in allowance. If you are making anything that resembles income my advice would be to go legit, report earnings to Caesar, and sleep well at night. That's the advice I would give to my best friend or brother.

Best wishes, cheers!

landarc
08-28-2015, 02:30 PM
I live in California, and my day job involves supporting our Litigation team.

I believe every word you said. The only position I haven't been in in court is as an officer (Judge, bailiff, reporter, clerk, or lawyer).

My comment was to my Yorba Linda Brother (I am probably 10 minutes max from him, but we haven't met) in jest.
You bastard! :becky:

Uomograsso
08-28-2015, 02:35 PM
After reading this thread I would like to add my $0.02 worth. *Disclaimer, I am not a lawyer nor have I ever played one on TV and I didn't just stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. That being said. It doesn't even have to be your food that makes someone sick. Nor does it have to be the person you sold to originally. What if some one bought your food then gave it to someone else. They get sick after eating it. The cause was really a bad burger they made the day before, but they remember that they got some BBQ. Now your friend you sold it to isn't the litigious type, but their friend is and they come after you. That is just one scenario I can think of.

I do work in a field where we look at risk and risk management very closely. We look to identify, analyze and evaluate risk to monitor and mitigate the possibility of loss. For my company that can be millions of $$$. Do you want to take on this type of risk involved in cooking for people without the proper licenses and insurance? Does this expose you to risk? Yes, how much risk? That is up to you to figure out.

cseymour45
08-28-2015, 03:37 PM
a certified commercial kitchen

What would be the minimums for satisfactorily going legit ...in most states. 3 wash bins, a thermometer, ...and what else (besides the license/permit).

A commercial kitchen, unless you have everything on a trailer considered satisfactory for the County or State you are in.
The area I have been looking into would want a cold storage for anything you need to keep cold (Under 40F), maybe a nice large cooler could work, but i'm not sure. Warm storage, for holding temps above (135F), I believe. The ability to produce hot water on site storing 5 Gal minimum, with 3 wash system. Thermometers to check storage temps. I find the hot water production and water storage to be the hardest part to fix up.
ButtBurner hit the nail on the head though, there is no way you are going to get by with your at home kitchen prepping. Even with a Temp Permit you need access to a commissary kitchen (I don't have any around, that I know of yet).

Edit: Could you just heat water up using a large pot / propane burner and pour it into an insulated (say 15 Gal or so) container? Still though, I guess you would need to prep food at a health code approved kitchen beforehand. Thinking out loud sorry folks.

Dinkle
08-28-2015, 03:59 PM
charge an entrance fee and provide free food.

Jason TQ
08-28-2015, 04:30 PM
Note to self....Don't ever...I mean ever...ask the brethren for opinions on selling Q' on the sly...Only questions on how to smoke, cook, what type of briquettes, rubs, sauces, etc. Unless, of course, I'm feeling mischievous and want to watch the s**t storm that develops.
:twisted:

I think there is something to say about this severity of the subject then don't you? Very nice group of folks here, but this subject obviously is a little more serious than debating/arguing over the best fuel, cooker, temps to cook meat, etc.

cseymour45
08-28-2015, 05:03 PM
I was having a garage sale and my son wanted to make some cash, how about selling hot dogs? I called the local health dept and ran it by them and they told me as long as he didn't charge money for the hot dogs we could do it. No problem, free hot dogs with a tip jar and the kid made more than if he had put a price on the dogs.


So then, I assume since the individuals consumed the hot dogs on your property and you didn't technically 'charge' you are safe if they get 'sick' or choke? Obviously your never safe though, like it has been covered 100X over on this thread.

This brings up another question for me, legally what happens if you serve food at your home and someone comes after you saying they got sick? Homeowners insurance covers that?

Rusty Kettle
08-28-2015, 05:57 PM
So then, I assume since the individuals consumed the hot dogs on your property and you didn't technically 'charge' you are safe if they get 'sick' or choke? Obviously your never safe though, like it has been covered 100X over on this thread.

This brings up another question for me, legally what happens if you serve food at your home and someone comes after you saying they got sick? Homeowners insurance covers that?

Depends on the policy but probably. I would advise you check your policy if you want to know. I have an umbrella policy and am covered for a lot. We pay thirty bucks a month for ours and it's 1 million dollars in extra coverage.

Now I have no problem telling people that because well insurance companies never hand over money willingly. As long as I don't so anything intentionally I am safe. Now you break any rules or laws they will drop you very fast.

My wife got hit by a guy in a parking lot and he tried to lie and say she hit him. They went after him very fast and cleared my wife of any wrong doing. So yeah since we are such good customers they ripped him a new one.

Best advice I can give anyone is insure yourself and don't skimp on insurance in anything. Better to pay more and sleep well at night.

Teleking
08-28-2015, 06:39 PM
So then, I assume since the individuals consumed the hot dogs on your property and you didn't technically 'charge' you are safe if they get 'sick' or choke? Obviously your never safe though, like it has been covered 100X over on this thread.

This brings up another question for me, legally what happens if you serve food at your home and someone comes after you saying they got sick? Homeowners insurance covers that?

Thanks for officially jumping the shark! Or are you charging them for the privilege of dining at your house? Very clear the line in the sand is elusive at this juncture.

Don't argue for the sake of arguing. I remind my kids all the time.

Cheers.

pjtexas1
08-28-2015, 08:15 PM
This brings up another question for me, legally what happens if you serve food at your home and someone comes after you saying they got sick? Homeowners insurance covers that?

I checked a while back and mine covers it.

landarc
08-28-2015, 08:29 PM
No, giving away food does not protect you from liability in the event someone gets sick. If someone had gotten sick from those "free" hotdogs, they could have sued. They almost assuredly would not win the suit, but, as anyone who has been sued can tell you, you start losing the minute you are served.

And no, the IRS would never come after that kid, or for that matter, the OP. Just not enough money.

And yes, at least as it applies in CA, you owe a due diligence for the safety of anyone who you invite into your home (and crazy enough, some amount to anyone in your home regardless of invitation). If you feed people, and they get sick, they could sue you.

PatAttack
08-28-2015, 09:56 PM
Is this BS thread still going...Fark!

Dude, do whatever you want to do. Take our advice or leave it.

Die, thread, DIE!

:laugh::tsk:

Pyle's BBQ
08-28-2015, 10:37 PM
Is this BS thread still going...Fark!

Dude, do whatever you want to do. Take our advice or leave it.

Die, thread, DIE!

:laugh::tsk:

I thought I had it, but nooo.!!!!!

Trailer Trash
08-29-2015, 04:36 PM
I just read this whole thread for first time and despite how frustrated you have ALL made each other over this topic it IS a great thread. The truth of the matter is, even though we are a country that squawks "Land of the free, hard working entrepreneur success stories", we have as a country developed laws and legal systems that make it nearly impossible for a citizen to "make a few extra bucks". Don't get me started on rules and regulations started in some specific states that find their way into the rest of the states. I have searched this forum as well the entire web for some small hint that I COULD do what was asked by Cseymour... Nobody gave me the thumbs up I was looking for. It's like ooking for a thumbs up on cheating the IRS. That said, I have been pulled in by the IRS for a $200 mistake and I DO cook for freinds, family and co-workers and I DO take a free tank of propane on exchange... I also purchased insurance as a "Private Cook" and have all the food handlers certs that is required of the Health Department, not because I lawfully had to, because the law was a mute point at this stage of the game, but because I wanted to KNOW for the safety of my freinds. Do what you want. Just know there certainly are arssholes in this day and age just looking for an opportunity to ruin someone's day. This comes to you from a BAD, BAD CRIMINAL. LOL