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jeffreywp1
08-28-2014, 06:59 AM
I love spicy food and I love spicy salsa. When I go to Mexican restaurants I always ask for what ever spicy salsa they have. Not all are spicy and not all are good, but there is a flavor that some of them have that I can't seem to duplicate. Its kind of a bacon flavor, that I assume comes from a toasted dried chile. Does anyone know what chile gives this flavor? It isn't chile de arbol because I have toasted that chlie in every way possible and have rarely achieved that flavor.

CraigC
08-28-2014, 07:09 AM
Sure it isn't chipotle? I find that fresh salsa, Pico de Gallo, is best when made with fresh chiles. Serranos are my usual choice, but if I make xnipec salsa (dogs nose), habaneros are used.

thesemicullen
08-28-2014, 07:20 AM
I also think it's probably chipotle. I keep cans of chipotles in adobo sauce in stock in my pantry. I find that the smoky adobo sauce goes good in ... well, just about anything savory.

BKish25
08-28-2014, 07:32 AM
Two things are important to me with salsa:

Texture -- the tomatoes and onions should be minced into small chunks, but not pureed. Also, some liquid is desireable.

Balance -- I like hot, but the peppers should not overpower the garlic or cilantro.

jeffreywp1
08-28-2014, 07:58 AM
Sure it isn't chipotle? I find that fresh salsa, Pico de Gallo, is best when made with fresh chiles. Serranos are my usual choice, but if I make xnipec salsa (dogs nose), habaneros are used.

I do not think it is chipotles in adobo sauce because I use them regularly. But I have not tried dried chipotle's.

NickTheGreat
08-28-2014, 08:06 AM
Is it cumin? I don't know if people put that in salsa or not, but we put it in about everything.

Cibelo
08-28-2014, 08:52 AM
Smoked Paprica?

rookiedad
08-28-2014, 09:08 AM
if it's bacon flavor you get, the chile's probably have been smoked or wood fire roasted. why not try experimenting with some yourself. take all your ingredients smoke or roast over hickory as it is hickory that gives the bacon flavor.

oldbill
08-28-2014, 09:22 AM
I've used smoked poblano and jalapenos (chipotles) in my salsas and either will give it the smoky flavor you're describing.:-D

Smokeat
08-28-2014, 09:27 AM
To "Round Out" the salsa flavor, or make it more robust, try using chicken bouillon powder or chicken base as your salt component.

Redleg71
08-28-2014, 09:48 AM
For years I tried to recreate the restaurant salsa. Then someone told me the secret! Mexican restraunts give that stuff out for free so you know it is inexpensive. The main ingrediant is almost always canned tomatoes. Fresh tomatoes lack the color and the taste. I agree that some chopotles would also give it that smokey bacon flovor youre looking for.

Goyo626
08-28-2014, 10:45 AM
Are you talking green or red sauces? I am a big fan on toasting dried chiles (passila, guajillo, arbol, etc) on a hot comal until they blister then throwing them in boiling water before putting them in a blender. It all depends how you want the sauce to taste. For example in a tomatillo salsa blackening the skin on the tomatillos will mellow the acidity of the sauce.

I have never tasted a bacony flavor in salsa. Maybe they pan fry chiles in lard?:confused:

BurntOffering
08-28-2014, 10:50 AM
I always use black pepper to taste, it could be at least part of the bacon flavor.

Yendor
08-28-2014, 10:52 AM
Canned tomatoes are a must, you can try the following recipe with fresh and canned and they are two different flavors altogether. I probably should not be sharing this as it is a family secret and the ingredients are added based on how hot the jalepenos are and what not. We get requests for this recipe all of the time. If you want more heat add your favorite serrano/habanero/ghost/Trinidad scorpion. FYI, this is my Mom's recipe that my wife has down pat, believe me, my mom knows Tex-Mex food.

1 Can Diced Tomatoes (14-15oz)
¼ of medium white onion
1-2 jalapenos (depending on heat level)
½ C Fresh Cilantro (more to taste)
1 TBSP garlic
1 tsp salt
½ TBSP cumin (start with less as it can get bitter)
½ lime squeezed

Quickly blend, but not puree, to your liking.

Dr. Trout Bum
08-28-2014, 10:57 AM
Not sure about the "bacon" flavor, except to say that where I grew up, bacon grease was what was used to fry anything. So, if they are sauteeing onions and garlic, it might be done with a little bacon grease. The others may be onto something with the chipotle for the smokey flavor.

I use the following (I make my red enchilada sauce with it) for that flavor. I also use it in my BBQ sauce and rubs. It was my "secret" ingredient until now. I like BBQ sweet and spicy - this will bring the heat while adding a great red chile flavor.

http://www.chimayotogo.com/pc-67-7-rancho-de-chimayo-red-chile-powder-579.aspx

bvbull200
08-28-2014, 11:07 AM
Canned tomatoes are a must, you can try the following recipe with fresh and canned and they are two different flavors altogether. I probably should not be sharing this as it is a family secret and the ingredients are added based on how hot the jalepenos are and what not. We get requests for this recipe all of the time. If you want more heat add your favorite serrano/habanero/ghost/Trinidad scorpion. FYI, this is my Mom's recipe that my wife has down pat, believe me, my mom knows Tex-Mex food.

1 Can Diced Tomatoes (14-15oz)
¼ of medium white onion
1-2 jalapenos (depending on heat level)
½ C Fresh Cilantro (more to taste)
1 TBSP garlic
1 tsp salt
½ TBSP cumin (start with less as it can get bitter)
½ lime squeezed

Quickly blend, but not puree, to your liking.


Thanks for the recipe. You have to be mindful of which peppers you are adding for heat, though, as their flavors (not just heat) are fairly distinct. I don't really cook with Scorpions ever, because they are too sweet/fruity. I opt for Ghosts almost every time due to their smokey flavor. I just grew my first Carolina Reaper, too, but it is really just a trophy since it also has a fruit-like flavor that I don't use much in cooking.

Yendor
08-28-2014, 11:21 AM
Thanks for the recipe. You have to be mindful of which peppers you are adding for heat, though, as their flavors (not just heat) are fairly distinct. I don't really cook with Scorpions ever, because they are too sweet/fruity. I opt for Ghosts almost every time due to their smokey flavor. I just grew my first Carolina Reaper, too, but it is really just a trophy since it also has a fruit-like flavor that I don't use much in cooking.
I agree on the fruitiness, the Scorpion actually tastes great in this recipe. I have some dried ghosts that are from India that were dried over smoldering coals that have a great smokiness to them. I have to admit that I do not like habaneros as the smell turns me off right away and I very much dislike their flavor, like a sewer to me.

BurntOffering
08-28-2014, 11:28 AM
I agree completely with the canned tomatoes. I also like to dice 1 tomatillo for texture and a pinch of chipotle powder for back end heat.

Smokesignalsfromtx
08-28-2014, 11:30 AM
More than likely it's a hint of cuminos....

bvbull200
08-28-2014, 11:33 AM
I agree on the fruitiness, the Scorpion actually tastes great in this recipe. I have some dried ghosts that are from India that were dried over smoldering coals that have a great smokiness to them. I have to admit that I do not like habaneros as the smell turns me off right away and I very much dislike their flavor, like a sewer to me.

I'll have to make two batches and give them a taste.

Habaneros are in no-man's land for me. I don't mind their taste, but they aren't hot enough for my use, but too hot for many other's use. If I'm going milder, then a roasted jalapeno tastes better, to me.

Moose
08-28-2014, 11:37 AM
I love spicy food and I love spicy salsa. When I go to Mexican restaurants I always ask for what ever spicy salsa they have. Not all are spicy and not all are good, but there is a flavor that some of them have that I can't seem to duplicate. Its kind of a bacon flavor, that I assume comes from a toasted dried chile. Does anyone know what chile gives this flavor? It isn't chile de arbol because I have toasted that chlie in every way possible and have rarely achieved that flavor.

Jeff,

Can you describe the kind of salsa you're talking about? Is it a red, chile based salsa, or a pico de gallo, or perhaps a blended tomato based salsa?

BDAABAT
08-28-2014, 11:48 AM
Canned tomatoes are a must, you can try the following recipe with fresh and canned and they are two different flavors altogether. I probably should not be sharing this as it is a family secret and the ingredients are added based on how hot the jalepenos are and what not. We get requests for this recipe all of the time. If you want more heat add your favorite serrano/habanero/ghost/Trinidad scorpion. FYI, this is my Mom's recipe that my wife has down pat, believe me, my mom knows Tex-Mex food.

1 Can Diced Tomatoes (14-15oz)
¼ of medium white onion
1-2 jalapenos (depending on heat level)
½ C Fresh Cilantro (more to taste)
1 TBSP garlic
1 tsp salt
½ TBSP cumin (start with less as it can get bitter)
½ lime squeezed

Quickly blend, but not puree, to your liking.


@Yendor: Excellent recipe! Thanks for sharing! This is very much like what I use as my standard.

One of the great things about salsa is that it's SOOOOO good and soooo easy to play with a basic recipe to figure out what variables can change for your specific tastes/purposes. Think about the basics: heat, herb, garlic, acid and EXTRA.

For example:
If you modify the heat (different peppers or mixes of peppers), you can get different heat and different character of the heat. I always add either canned chipotle or dried chipotle to give that smokey heat to my salsa. Can even use sriracha if you don't happen to have jalapanos/habs handy or if you just want to try a different heat profile.

Herb: Play with the cilantro concentrations... some folks like more, some like less. Small differences in amount can have profound effects on the flavor. Add some fresh basil in addition to cilantro. BTW: in my world, salsa REQUIRES fresh cilantro! But that doesn't have to be the only herb included. Throw in some cumin or coriander. Find out what you like and what works for the meal that you're having.

Garlic: For me, this is the difference between an OK salsa and one that will be memorable. For one 14-15 oz can of tomato, I generally go with 5 + large cloves of fresh garlic. Also, IMHO, there's a substantial difference in flavor between the jarred stuff and the fresh cloves that are chopped. I prefer the fresh whole clove garlic.

Acid and EXTRA: acid is important to add to salsa. You don't need much, but you need some. It adds brightness and helps bring out the flavors of everything in the mix. I usually use regular white vinegar. The extra can be something like using lime juice instead of vinegar (as in Yendor's recipe above)...it's acid plus citrus that goes so well with the rest of the ingredients. Extra can be some sweetness to balance out and provide contrast for the acid and the heat (say chopped mango). I'd include salt in the EXTRA as well... a small amount of salt is absolutely needed, but like all the other ingredients, you can refine the taste of your salsa by using different types of salt. I've sometimes used some smoked salt in addition to the chipotles to really emphasize the smokey flavor or the salsa.

BTW: salsa works on just about anything savory. Throw some on your eggs, add to soups, toss a bit on your pizza, mix in with your favorite tomato sauce... it's just amazing stuff.

Bruce
(certified/certifiable salsaholic):biggrin1:

Yendor
08-28-2014, 12:09 PM
Here is the feedback that my boss literally sent me 5 minutes ago. I gave him the recipe above yesterday.
"You are correct it is awesome better than any I have had. I used Jalapeno but used seeds and all it has a nice kick."

Along with what BDAABAT said, to start with keep it simple. This isn't rocket appliances, it's salsa. Like all other good food get your base recipe down before making alterations and go easy on those alterations, here again keep it simple.

Heisenberger
08-28-2014, 12:13 PM
Are you talking green or red sauces? I am a big fan on toasting dried chiles (passila, guajillo, arbol, etc) on a hot comal until they blister then throwing them in boiling water before putting them in a blender. It all depends how you want the sauce to taste. For example in a tomatillo salsa blackening the skin on the tomatillos will mellow the acidity of the sauce.

I have never tasted a bacony flavor in salsa. Maybe they pan fry chiles in lard?:confused:


He is on the right track. Toasted pasilla, guajillo, ancho, arbol, and california chile. Toast them up and re-hydrate. Blend with your other salsa ingredients and there you have it.

jeffreywp1
08-28-2014, 01:21 PM
To "Round Out" the salsa flavor, or make it more robust, try using chicken bouillon powder or chicken base as your salt component.

That sounds interesting! Thanks!

jeffreywp1
08-28-2014, 01:29 PM
Canned tomatoes are a must, you can try the following recipe with fresh and canned and they are two different flavors altogether. I probably should not be sharing this as it is a family secret and the ingredients are added based on how hot the jalepenos are and what not. We get requests for this recipe all of the time. If you want more heat add your favorite serrano/habanero/ghost/Trinidad scorpion. FYI, this is my Mom's recipe that my wife has down pat, believe me, my mom knows Tex-Mex food.

1 Can Diced Tomatoes (14-15oz)
¼ of medium white onion
1-2 jalapenos (depending on heat level)
½ C Fresh Cilantro (more to taste)
1 TBSP garlic
1 tsp salt
½ TBSP cumin (start with less as it can get bitter)
½ lime squeezed

Quickly blend, but not puree, to your liking.


I'm a big fan of canned tomatoes for salsa. They are a available year round and cheap

jeffreywp1
08-28-2014, 01:34 PM
Are you talking green or red sauces? I am a big fan on toasting dried chiles (passila, guajillo, arbol, etc) on a hot comal until they blister then throwing them in boiling water before putting them in a blender. It all depends how you want the sauce to taste. For example in a tomatillo salsa blackening the skin on the tomatillos will mellow the acidity of the sauce.

I have never tasted a bacony flavor in salsa. Maybe they pan fry chiles in lard?:confused:

It's always been an earthy red salsa with toasted dried peppers in it. A friend of mine used to run one of the restaurants that had salsa with that balcony flavor. He said they toasted the arbols and what ever else in the oven. I have once achieved that flavor using arbols only.

Guynoir
08-28-2014, 04:26 PM
I know the recipe my uses is a copy cat recipe for Chevy's Fresh Mex Salsa. It uses a small amount of liquid smoke. It does come out tasting exactly like Chevy's Salsa

lantern
08-28-2014, 05:02 PM
OK....I think I know EXACTLY what you're talking about. A restaurant around here had a family recipe for what they called "oil salsa". What this is usually called is salsa macha and if done correctly it is one of my favorite things on the planet!!

It's dark and oily and has a smokiness to it. The magic happens when it's added to things. Thin line on the inside of you fajita....boom awesome. And in your case I think they are adding a bit to their fresh salsa for a smokey pop.


So, check out salsa macha. It looks a bit like chinese chile sauce, but brings a smile to this man's face!:biggrin1::biggrin1:

BobBrisket
08-28-2014, 07:54 PM
It's always been an earthy red salsa with toasted dried peppers in it. A friend of mine used to run one of the restaurants that had salsa with that balcony flavor. He said they toasted the arbols and what ever else in the oven. I have once achieved that flavor using arbols only.

As other have stated, one common method is to pan fry all do the veggies in oil or even lard: tomato, onion, garlic, cilantro, and even the fresh or dry pods. From there, everything in the pan along with the grease gets tossed into the blender. From there, the salt, pepper, etc gets added and blended. That is the type of oily salsa you guys are referring to.

jeffreywp1
08-28-2014, 09:30 PM
As other have stated, one common method is to pan fry all do the veggies in oil or even lard: tomato, onion, garlic, cilantro, and even the fresh or dry pods. From there, everything in the pan along with the grease gets tossed into the blender. From there, the salt, pepper, etc gets added and blended. That is the type of oily salsa you guys are referring to.

I have never tried pan frying the veggies before blending. My normal approach to making salsa is to start of toasting the arbols in the oven. I have done them every way possible without fire. In the oven, on the stove top, with and without oil, boiling with and without toasting, with and without seeds, burning them black and lightly toasted. I then mince some onion and cilantro that does not go into the blend. In the blender goes the tomotillos, half and onion, jalapeno or 2, or serrano, the left over cilantro and coriander, some herbs, some honey, lime juice, sometimes chipotles in adobo and the arbols, salt and pepper. Blend that well and then add some canned tomatoes and pulse a few time to leave thick. Mix that with the minced onion and cilantro. I have added pasillas, anchos, molettos. With that base recipe, I once achieved the bacon like flavor. I cant remember which toasting method I used or if I added another dry chile. But I was asked if I had put pork in the salsa. Thats how much it tasted like bacon. I was just hoping someone knew what chile or otherwise how to get that flavor.

BobBrisket
08-28-2014, 10:17 PM
I have never tried pan frying the veggies before blending. My normal approach to making salsa is to start of toasting the arbols in the oven. I have done them every way possible without fire. In the oven, on the stove top, with and without oil, boiling with and without toasting, with and without seeds, burning them black and lightly toasted. I then mince some onion and cilantro that does not go into the blend. In the blender goes the tomotillos, half and onion, jalapeno or 2, or serrano, the left over cilantro and coriander, some herbs, some honey, lime juice, sometimes chipotles in adobo and the arbols, salt and pepper. Blend that well and then add some canned tomatoes and pulse a few time to leave thick. Mix that with the minced onion and cilantro. I have added pasillas, anchos, molettos. With that base recipe, I once achieved the bacon like flavor. I cant remember which toasting method I used or if I added another dry chile. But I was asked if I had put pork in the salsa. Thats how much it tasted like bacon. I was just hoping someone knew what chile or otherwise how to get that flavor.

Okay, I actually made a salsa a little while ago to test something. I pulled some maters from the garden and various peppers that I have out there too. One whole onion and one whole bunch of cilantro. I used about 6 cloves of garlic, but tossed em in at the end so they wouldn't burn. I only used a few tbs of evoo and let the maters, onions, cilantro just sweat out on low for a little while. I added salt to draw out the liquids and some pepper. The chiles I used were fresh and orange in color for the most part so not a deep color, but it did toss in some dry red Thais from last year in with the veggies. It had great heat and flavor and the oil taste is there. I wouldn't call it a bacon flavor, but I think you might be looking for the sweet flavor from the maters and onions as they breakdown and carmelized a bit in the oil. That sweet flavor is a bit reminiscent of a salty, bacony, flavor.

Zin
08-28-2014, 10:38 PM
The secret to real Mexican salsa is to cook (simmer) the salsa in a skillet. Also using chile piquin chiles are best imho. Make sure you add basil and oregano to the salsa.

Canned tomatoes are better than fresh tomatoes unless you are just making pico de gallo.

jeffreywp1
08-29-2014, 07:27 AM
I forgot to mention garlic in my list of ingredients. And even though I only gave a vague recipe of my salsa, I hereby swear anyone who reads it to secrecy.:tape2: I have only shared my recipe with 6 people. Two in Virginia, two in Canada, one in Texas and one in Sweden. I wish I could take one of them back. The one in Texas takes it to work and has the Mexicans begging for the recipe. They take it home to their Grandmother to try and figure out whats in it. People who have ate my salsa regularly ask why I want to change it. I always think it can be improved and I am still searching for that bacon like flavor.

Twisted T's Q
09-02-2014, 11:36 AM
this is a great thread, is there a favorites here at the forum so that I can save this thread there ?

jeffreywp1
09-02-2014, 01:27 PM
this is a great thread, is there a favorites here at the forum so that I can save this thread there ?

Not that I know of. When I see a thread that I want to reference later, I just save it in my favorites on the computer under food.

Moose
09-02-2014, 01:45 PM
this is a great thread, is there a favorites here at the forum so that I can save this thread there ?

Not that I know of. When I see a thread that I want to reference later, I just save it in my favorites on the computer under food.

There is actually, it's the Roadmap to the Qtalk forum for noteworthy threads:

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7818

I just posted a link to this thread there so it's on the map. :thumb:

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3042683&postcount=97

The_Kapn
09-02-2014, 02:05 PM
Under "thread tools" above, there is a "Subscribe to this thread " option.

Then, when you want to find it later it is listed under "Subscribed Treads" in the "User CP" above.

At least I think it works that way for everyone. :oops:

TIM

Randy3269
09-02-2014, 03:48 PM
Canned tomatoes are a must, you can try the following recipe with fresh and canned and they are two different flavors altogether. I probably should not be sharing this as it is a family secret and the ingredients are added based on how hot the jalepenos are and what not. We get requests for this recipe all of the time. If you want more heat add your favorite serrano/habanero/ghost/Trinidad scorpion. FYI, this is my Mom's recipe that my wife has down pat, believe me, my mom knows Tex-Mex food.

1 Can Diced Tomatoes (14-15oz)
¼ of medium white onion
1-2 jalapenos (depending on heat level)
½ C Fresh Cilantro (more to taste)
1 TBSP garlic
1 tsp salt
½ TBSP cumin (start with less as it can get bitter)
½ lime squeezed

Quickly blend, but not puree, to your liking.


I've got this sitting in the fridge now. Can't wait to give it a try :clap:

Thanks,
Randy

Goyo626
09-02-2014, 04:10 PM
Imo the sauce used is entirely dependent on the dish. Steak tacos are served with a chipotle-arbol-dried habanero sauce. It is a smoky/sharp heat that complements beef (i also love it on burgers). Carnitas goes well with a green tomatillo based salsa and fresh serranos/jalapenos. The acidity of the tomatillos cuts through some of the fat of the pork which brightens the whole dish. Beans pair well with a molcajete sauce. And taquitos go well with an avocado sauce (not to be confused with guacamole), which adds a creaminess which goes well with the crunchy taquitos.