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View Full Version : Please help me understand this brisket cook


markrvp
08-08-2013, 04:27 PM
I've been doing briskets for 2 or 3 years now and they never seem to take as long as I think they are supposed to. This morning I put on a 13 pound packer brisket at 8AM. I had trimmed the fat on the brisket so that there is about a 1/4" fat cap and the other side is clean of fat. The brisket starting temperature was 40 degrees and I had slathered it with mustard and applied Bovine Bold Rub. The cooker is a Large Big Green Egg and the starting temperature of the cooker was 250 degrees. The ambient temperature today is around 92-95 degrees. I trimmed the fat on the brisket so that there is about a 1/4" fat cap and the other side is clean of fat.

I've attached a Stoker Log graphic below. The gasket on my BGE is worn out, so I noticed some creep up in the chamber temp from 250 to 268 at about an hour and a half. I just let it do it's thing and it settled back down to 250 at the 4 hour mark. The meat temp rose steadily and went from 40 to 165 in 3 hours. It stalled at 165 for 2 hours at which point I pulled it and wrapped it in foil. I poked the flat with my finger and it was firm. I put it back in and kicked the temp up to 275. In less than an hour the flat temp hit 195. I knew it couldn't be done so let it go another hour at which time the meat temp reached 205. I probed the flat and it was very tender in some places, but not evenly. I let it go another hour and probed again. Only one place gave any resistance, so I've let it go another 30 minutes so far.

I am noticing that the meat hit a second stall at 205 and has been like that for an hour and a half. My total cook time so far is 8 hours, 20 minutes. Based on the general outline here, shouldn't it take at least 12 hours? I feel like this brisket is pretty much done now, but am I right?

The pit temps from the Stoker are consistent with the pit temp gauge. The meat temps from the Stoker probe are consistent with what I'm reading with the Thermapen.

Does my description and the image below sound like a correct brisket cook?

Bludawg
08-08-2013, 05:08 PM
BBQ RULES FOR SUCCESS

YOU CAN NOT COOK GREAT BBQ ON A CONSISTENT BASIS BY COOKING TO AN INTERNAL TEMPERATURE OR BY TIME ( XXX MIN PER LB) YOU MUST COOK BY FEEL! For Brisket it must pass the poke test(probe like soft butter in the thickest part of the Flat) Ribs pass the Bend Test, Pork Butts when the bone wiggles loose. These are the only reliable methods to ensure that your cook will be a success. There is one exception to these rules and that is Poultry which must achieve and internal temp of 170 deg in the thickest part of the thigh and 165 in the breast.

I suggest you forget all the at geeky stuff relax and cook, it never fails to only check the thickest spot on the flat it will be the last place to go tender all that other poking around is a waste of time. The second stall is why a long rest period( 2hr min) is essential to having a Moist brisket ( if that thing is still on hte pit get it off NOW). Vent it for an hr then rest it for 1. This is where the break down of the collagen happens the longer it takes the better the final product will be.

Cayman1
08-08-2013, 05:21 PM
Use temp probe to figure out when it is time to start checking tenderness, I'd start at 203-205. After that cook it to probe tenderness, don't worry about temp. It takes awhile to learn the feel of a tender brisket, but you will get it. I've had some tender at 203 and others not till 210. Cows are all different just like people. Me, I have plenty of fat, others, not so much.

Ron_L
08-08-2013, 05:32 PM
I'm a geek, and love playing with technology, but it's very easy to overanalyze things. BBQ is simple. Cook the meat until it is done. As the gang have point out, a brisket is done when a probe inserted into the thickest part of the flat goes in with little to no resistance. Don't over think it.

landarc
08-08-2013, 05:39 PM
If you're going to be that detailed. You better account for altitude, ambient humidity, resistance in probe wires, conductivity deflection due to primatic convection effect on protein dense strata (I made that up).

Trust the skewer. Quite trying to time things perfectly, it can't be done.

letdasmokeroll
08-08-2013, 05:49 PM
I have not done many briskets (2) as a matter of fact and trust me Im no geek but its very simple it HEAT and MEAT....my thoughts are if someone can cook great food using cinder blocks and a grate then all the rest is over analyzing it

Happy Hapgood
08-08-2013, 05:57 PM
I really like the detail of the description you have posted. I do temp for a living and subscribe to the school that temp rise and fall of both the pit and the meat (trends) are valuable tools in producing good BBQ.

But in the end, does it probe tender? I think a lot of confusion is where to probe and getting the feel for what is the elusive "probes like buttar" probe. I guess it comes with experience.

markrvp
08-08-2013, 06:10 PM
I gave all the details up front so people wouldn't have to wonder about the variables. I'm not trying to over think it, really. I cooked it until I thought it was done. I've always believed my BGE at 250 cooks brisket way faster than 1-1.5 hour/pound. This is a pretty consistent result for me. I just wanted to make sure that you guys agreed that what I'm seeing is correct. I'm working on getting my "feel" to be up to you pros standard.

gotribe28
08-08-2013, 06:28 PM
I am confused what IT are you looking for? Cause at 205 I am pulling mine and resting....

Ron_L
08-08-2013, 06:28 PM
I just wanted to make sure that you guys agreed that what I'm seeing is correct.

This is the hard part. I've cooks a lot of briskets and the only temps I know are when I foil, and that's just because I check it just for fun, and when I check for done, and that' only because I use my Thermapen to probe for feel. I have never graphed the temperature like that, so I really have no idea if that is correct or not.

gotribe28
08-08-2013, 06:32 PM
Oh and I think your times are less because you are trimming... I don't trim and I cook my brisket at about 275 for 7 - 7.5 hours until 205-210 IT....

markrvp
08-08-2013, 07:47 PM
I am confused what IT are you looking for? Cause at 205 I am pulling mine and resting....

I'm looking for the feel of the texture of the flat. The IT is just telling me when I should start checking that texture. At 195 is when I normally start poking at it. I was surprised that it hit 205 and just stayed there. It was at 205 for an hour and a half before the texture was what I felt was right.

Q-Dat
08-08-2013, 09:17 PM
I'll weigh in. As a former and still occasional brisket struggler, I think that there is some misunderstanding out there regarding the terms "probe tender" and "like butter". Folks tend to think as I did at first that "like buttah" refers to how little resistance there is when you push the probe in. True you are looking for it to go in fairly easily, but I think more important is how SMOOTHLY the probe goes in. I use a little utensil called a Cake Tester. You can get them at Bed Bath and Beyond and places like that. Its just a heavy gauge stiff wire with a little handle on one end. I like it because its thin enough to not make a big hole, but its not sharp on the end. Its just cut off flat. When I push it into the brisket slowly, and the brisket isn't ready yet, I can feel the strands of unrendered connective tissue breaking as it goes in. When I check again later and the brisket is ready, the movement of the flat probe tip through the meat will be smooth because the connective tissue has broken down to the point where I can't feel it break any more, or if I do its hardly noticeble.

The thickest part of the flat will always provide a little more resistance even when done, because the meat is thicker and denser there.

markrvp
08-08-2013, 09:30 PM
I feel like I'm getting worse at brisket instead of better. My briskets used to always be moist and delicious, but this one tonight was a disaster. It was dry and falling apart. I had to cut it thick or it would crumble apart.

So, just so I understand, I have overcooked the living daylights out of it, right? I pulled it at 9-1/2 hours after it had stalled at 205 for an hour and a half in the pit. It seemed very tender to me, but I guess too tender. I vented it on the counter for awhile, then covered it back up in foil. Total rest time was two and a half hours.

Also of great frustration is the lack of a smoke ring. There is one but it's very thin. I actually had good thin blue smoke coming out of the BGE. The flavor of the brisket was good, but the texture was awful.

Here are the pictures :(

Q-Dat
08-08-2013, 09:56 PM
Yep. Definitely overcooked. Chop that sucker up and make an awesome chili out of it. Then just be prepared on the next one.

Dallas Dan
08-08-2013, 10:19 PM
Briskets are all about low and slow. I have a large BGE too but always smoke briskets on my offset smoker and never less than 12 hours. Did you use a plate setter? If not, direct heat is a problem.

Also, the fat keeps the meat moist. Don't trim so much off.

Bludawg
08-08-2013, 10:23 PM
Like I said you can't go by meat temp probe tender it the thickest part of the Flat.this all the equipment I use besides a set of tongs.
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae164/Bludawg51/DSCF0057.jpg
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae164/Bludawg51/DSCF0066Modified2.jpg
I don't cook below 300 never had a full packer of any weight go beyond 6 hrs

Dallas Dan
08-08-2013, 10:25 PM
I vented it on the counter for awhile,

That allowed the moisture to evaporate and contributed to drying out the meat. Always keep it wrapped.