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Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 07:06 AM
What items would you include on the menu if you had an upscale restaurant?

If you had to worry about waste and inventory control while being upscale, what would you put on your menu?

My current ideas are obviously brisket, a nice ribeye, and prime rib appearing a regular special.

Some people might argue that this should go in the catering section, but I want to know what you geeks think and this is just theoretical any way. :wink:

IamMadMan
12-27-2012, 07:40 AM
The problem is that our definition of BBQ and what the average consumer considers BBQ are vastly different.

While we enjoy the smoked meats ability to stand on it's own merit, the average consumer considers good BBQ to be in the sauce.

A local BBQ Restaurant opened up nearby and I took the family there, while they used fancy serving plates and upscale style decor, there was no smoke flavor to the meats. Brisket and Pulled Pork were cooked to perfection but lacked any slight hint of smoke altogether, as if they were cooked in the oven, and the side dishes were served cold. I thought this would be a better restaurant because he competes under the "Brethren" logo.

He has responded to my complaint so I will make another visit in the near future.

I've been to many BBQ restaurants only to be disappointed time after time and never return due to the disappointment.

We eat out 3 times a week and we have never chosen to return to any local BBQ Restaurant either informal or upscale. Seems like a tough sell to the multitude of consumers due to what they are prepared to expect.

Sadly the only BBQ I buy is from a few guys who set up in an old parking lots selling from their smokers and wrapping it in butcher paper. This type of vendor seems to be the only ones who appear to take pride in their cooking and end product.

.

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 07:47 AM
Point taken. I assure you that there will be a deep smoke in the brisket. I am originally from Dallas and remember the trips across town to Mesquite, to eat at a place that used to be notorious for all the right reasons.

I can not live up to that, but will try my damnedest.

The_Kapn
12-27-2012, 07:56 AM
The Throwdown threads are loaded with ideas for "upscale" BBQ.
I am amazed at what folks create.

Might be some ideas there.

Good Luck!

TIM

IamMadMan
12-27-2012, 07:57 AM
Point taken. I assure you that there will be a deep smoke in the brisket. I am originally from Dallas and remember the trips across town to Mesquite, to eat at a place that used to be notorious for all the right reasons.

I can not live up to that, but will try my damnedest.

Sounds like your cooks are done with passion, too bad you were not closer, I could use a good BBQ restaurant to sit, relax, and enjoy a good meal. If you can't relax the food isn't as enjoyable, if the food isn't enjoyable you can't relax, it's a balancing act.

I wish you the best of luck in your endeavor.....

The_Kapn
12-27-2012, 08:12 AM
I see you are in Rogers.
Many years ago I lived in Bentonville.
In the recent years my Daughter and her family lived in Fayetteville for several years and we went there a couple of times per year.

It is amazing how the area has grown and how the apparent income level has increased over the years.
If I was "forced" to move, NW AR would be high on my list of places to go--love it there! 8)

However, have you looked at the market for any "upscale" restaurant of any type?
My thoughts are that the area seems to be more of an "eating out" one as opposed to a "dining out" one.

Just some thoughts.

TIM

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 08:24 AM
I see you are in Rogers.
Many years ago I lived in Bentonville.
In the recent years my Daughter and her family lived in Fayetteville for several years and we went there a couple of times per year.

It is amazing how the area has grown and how the apparent income level has increased over the years.
If I was "forced" to move, NW AR would be high on my list of places to go--love it there! 8)

However, have you looked at the market for any "upscale" restaurant of any type?
My thoughts are that the area seems to be more of an "eating out" one as opposed to a "dining out" one.

Just some thoughts.

TIM

Tim,

This area has grown and will continue to grow for the foreseeable future. You really need to check out the restaurant scene here in Bentonville now (where I am sitting as we type).

Crystal Bridges opened this year and the traffic here from New York and LA for business is huge now. This is not the place you left.

Here is a link to one of my faves (right off the square). http://www.tuskandtrotter.com/

He has to be a real Ruhlman fan. Jerk got a James Beard this year. J/k he is great guy and gave me a ribbon for my chili this year. :cool:

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 08:26 AM
You might want to check this out also

http://crystalbridges.org/

One of the largest endowments in the country.

The_Kapn
12-27-2012, 08:28 AM
I am really not surprised by the changes.
Like I said, I watched it change over the years.
Glad to see there is an upscale market developing.

Great area.

TIM

Gig'em99
12-27-2012, 08:33 AM
What items would you include on the menu if you had an upscale restaurant?

If you had to worry about waste and inventory control while being upscale, what would you put on your menu?

My current ideas are obviously brisket, a nice ribeye, and prime rib appearing a regular special.

Some people might argue that this should go in the catering section, but I want to know what you geeks think and this is just theoretical any way. :wink:

Prime Rib might be ok, but a lot of eateries have it. You could add a twist by putting in a tri-tip. Done right, it'll go up against any filet (I'd argue it'd compete with a prime rib too!), and it's MUCH less expensive. Cooks relatively fast. Because they're smaller, and cook time is minimal, you have decent waste control. Not to mention they can be nursed back up to deliciousness after they've been refrigerated.

Brian

WineMaster
12-27-2012, 08:42 AM
Scallops take smoke well. Learn the art of Salmon. Tri-Tip is a nice steak to BBQ

deguerre
12-27-2012, 08:46 AM
Backstrap.:thumb:

JS-TX
12-27-2012, 09:00 AM
About 6 yrs ago I had the pleasure of eating at one of Weber's restuarants in the Chicago area. Food was good and the atmosphere was nice, not too fancy but not your usual q-joint either. Check out their NYE menu, this may give you some ideas. http://www.webergrillrestaurant.com

columbia1
12-27-2012, 10:44 AM
A brisket Stroganoff, you can use the leftovers from the night before. Done right is awesome!!
I used to cook at the old King's table buffet, all the left over beef was used for stroganoff the next day, it was the most ate part of the buffet line.

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 10:47 AM
A brisket Stroganoff, you can use the leftovers from the night before. Done right is awesome!!
I used to cook at the old King's table buffet, all the left over beef was used for stroganoff the next day, it was the most ate part of the buffet line.

Great idea. When I worked as sous chef (a long time ago) I always used any left over prime rib for stroganoff for the staff. No one missed the day after prime rib. Even the front of the house who was notorious for skipping out.

Dang good idea. Thanks.

Bludawg
12-27-2012, 11:17 AM
Sheep ribs done savory with chimi chury
Wagu & Berkshire Bacon Cheese burger with Stilton and crimini mushrooms on a Brioche roll
Beef pot pie made from left over brisket Flat

Ryan Chester
12-27-2012, 12:31 PM
My restaurant (Smoqued California BBQ) is much more upscale than the regular BBQ joint. We offer some higher end specials from time to time that don't stay on the regular menu such as pork belly, prime rib, fish offerings, etc. I have posted lots of pictures of our place in the Brethren Road Trips secion and you can google our name and probably find some photos.

landarc
12-27-2012, 01:02 PM
I have been liking what I have seen of Ryan's place, that is where I think a high end BBQ place can be taken. If what you are looking for is to feature BBQ, that is much the concept I would look at.

On the other hand, if you wanted to do fine dining, which is what I take upscale to really mean, it comes down to tailoring food to a higher level of service. Smoked meats can figure into the equation, but, it ends up being about how to create the elevated sensation of fine service with that food. You could still do brisket, pork shoulder and such, but, in smaller portions and with more presentation. Thus...

BBQ normal to me...brisket is served on the plate, with pickles, onion, maybe slaw and beans...

Upscale to me...brisket is served on the plate, with house made pickled vegetables and a sweet and spicy polenta and plate sauce from jus

I also think the flavors you pull or add to the meat have to be more complex, people will expect more expansive and creative flavors and higher quality meat if they are paying more for the experience.

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 02:03 PM
Landarc,

As usual, we are on a similar page. Somewhere between a bistro and a brasserie. I was thinking brisket as a single cut with a demiglace on the plate and a sourcream horseradish placed on the table.

For pork I was thinking about a rillette style presentation with pickled apricot, plum (prune), and possibly a compote.

I have to come clean and say the confited pork loin and duck would be on the menu as well as a cured pork collar.

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 02:08 PM
Also, a white bean puree is still beans, right.

Please keep this going guys Several good ideas have surfaced already.

deguerre
12-27-2012, 02:14 PM
Lessee...Memphis to Rogers is only 340 miles or so...

landarc
12-27-2012, 02:38 PM
Sour Cream Horseradish sauce is not served with brisket often enough if you ask me.

And as long as I am going down this road, gastrique goes so well with pulled pork. A cherry or apple gastrique, served with a nice rich pulled pork (but not shredded, left in chunks) and some white bean puree, or a sweet corn polenta (to allude to cornbread) would be lovely.

Also, I have often thought about riffing on collards, going either with kale or baby collards in salads and/or as a side dish. I love collards with vinegar, there has to be a way to take that and elevate it.

Oh, and if you chose to go with the elevated Steak house idea, all the rage lately, I would love to see someone finally do a chuck rib right. Cooked in smoke until absolutely tender, with the bone attached, not short ribs, something along the lines of an 8" rib, served with a dark fruit and jus reduction.

deguerre
12-27-2012, 02:50 PM
Also, I have often thought about riffing on collards, going either with kale or baby collards in salads and/or as a side dish. I love collards with vinegar, there has to be a way to take that and elevate it.



In a bowl with the pot likker and some thinly sliced pork belly as a small soup would be killer.

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 02:55 PM
Sour Cream Horseradish sauce is not served with brisket often enough if you ask me.

And as long as I am going down this road, gastrique goes so well with pulled pork. A cherry or apple gastrique, served with a nice rich pulled pork (but not shredded, left in chunks) and some white bean puree, or a sweet corn polenta (to allude to cornbread) would be lovely.

Also, I have often thought about riffing on collards, going either with kale or baby collards in salads and/or as a side dish. I love collards with vinegar, there has to be a way to take that and elevate it.

Oh, and if you chose to go with the elevated Steak house idea, all the rage lately, I would love to see someone finally do a chuck rib right. Cooked in smoke until absolutely tender, with the bone attached, not short ribs, something along the lines of an 8" rib, served with a dark fruit and jus reduction.

Great ideas!!

BUT an 8 inch rib.... that is insanity. I always thought that baby backs were for men *humph* intimidated by spares, but an 8 inch bone... Obviously I kid. However, that would have to be served on a rectangle plate with some sort of architectural construction. I am intimidated by that.

Hawg Father of Seoul
12-27-2012, 02:56 PM
In a bowl with the pot likker and some thinly sliced pork belly as a small soup would be killer.

Oh hell yeah. Sous vide then broiled pork belly.

Rover24
12-27-2012, 03:30 PM
Bone-in pork roast, sliced double cut style for a huge pork chop.