Time to stir the kcbs bod pot again!!

[Plowboy]

Just a time out here on the discussion to thank Jorge, Jeff, Steve, and Dave for jumping into every topic and being frank in their response. Communication and transparency can give many a reason to vote for a candidate, but it can also give many a reason not to. At least they are having the dialog. I don't see anyone else doing it at the same level they are. I can only hope that this level of communication would continue after elected.

Of the current BOD, Candy does a great job of communication in terms of reach. Not that others don't, but my opinion is that she tries to interface with the membership more than normal. That said, Paul Kirk will sign an autograph if you buy a book. A true man of the people.

Like them or not, you can't deny that the four on the group ticket are serious about this and aren't sugar coating issues or ideas. Thanks, guys. Good luck.

 

[Plowboy]

I see a lot of your points here and I understand that to accomplish a fair solution, several factors need to come into play... mileage, team density, contest density and, to a degree, other sanctioning bodies (if KCBS really wants to "get the job" so to speak). What that says to me in looking at the bigger picture is that contests should never be presented to the board for approval without significant investigation and taking a look at all of these factors, not just mileage. Good thing we have a sanctioning committee! In that regard, I believe it should be filled by members of KCBS who reside in all regions of the country so that someone who should be "in the know" about team and contest density can have an input in nearly every instance. And to remain impartial, I don't believe any of them should be organizers.

Bravo. I really like that.

I don't know if organizers need to be excluded. They offer a perspective that teams, reps and judges might not have. Any of those people can be bias to an area, an organization, a contest, an organizer as much as an organizer can. Teams could be the most biased in the whole crowd if they want a second contest so they can bottom feed by diluting the level of competition at both contests. The committee should be able to govern itself when someone in the group seems to close to an issue. And if not, you've to the BOD to veto any committee decision. Not a perfect process, but you've got a great idea of having regional representation in that committee. If one was ever a prime place for regional representation, that committee seems to be the obvious choice.

 

[Coz]

I for one am glad to see discussion on the sanctioning process.Most folks dont realize it yet but in a state with 4 contests in 2011 and 3 of them were on consecutive weekends there has been a new contest on the schedule for the same weekend as one of the existing contests .All indications are that all 4 contests from this year are coming back so we would have one in June then 4 in a 3 week period in August . With the double header being one friday /sat and the other sat/sun being a 5 hour drive apart .OK so its doable to do both right ? Second contest is on an Island.... last ferry runs long before being able to get from first contest to second even leaving as soon as the last turn in is handed off. I am in no way wanting to discourage people from organizing a contest but damn please think what your doing to the people trying to compete .

 

[Leatherheadiowa]

I for one am glad to see discussion on the sanctioning process.Most folks dont realize it yet but in a state with 4 contests in 2011 and 3 of them were on consecutive weekends there has been a new contest on the schedule for the same weekend as one of the existing contests .All indications are that all 4 contests from this year are coming back so we would have one in June then 4 in a 3 week period in August . With the double header being one friday /sat and the other sat/sun being a 5 hour drive apart .OK so its doable to do both right ? Second contest is on an Island.... last ferry runs long before being able to get from first contest to second even leaving as soon as the last turn in is handed off. I am in no way wanting to discourage people from organizing a contest but damn please think what your doing to the people trying to compete .

Coz,
I think your example is a prime example of what is obviously being done wrong. I am a candidate for the BOD along with some other very insightful people. I think I would bring a vast knowledge of logistics and planning knowledge to the table. While I believe most contests are planned and carried out with the best intentions the break down in communication among organizers and the KCBS needs to be eleviated.
In my field of pharmaceutical research we deal with similar issues as they relate to conducting the medical research that we conduct. I have been very fortunate to experience and to have been a part of the team of researchers that helps physicians, patients, and pharmaceutical companies best utilize research sites, spread the patient load, and do what is best for the patients. In this case we need to accomodate the judges, contestants, organizers,reps, and the host communities. There are numerous variables and again, I believe I can bring a knowledge and skill set to the BOD to complete the equation with the given variables.
Just one candidate's point of view.

 

[Tarheel]

I see a lot of your points here and I understand that to accomplish a fair solution, several factors need to come into play... mileage, team density, contest density and, to a degree, other sanctioning bodies (if KCBS really wants to "get the job" so to speak). What that says to me in looking at the bigger picture is that contests should never be presented to the board for approval without significant investigation and taking a look at all of these factors, not just mileage. Good thing we have a sanctioning committee! In that regard, I believe it should be filled by members of KCBS who reside in all regions of the country so that someone who should be "in the know" about team and contest density can have an input in nearly every instance. And to remain impartial, I don't believe any of them should be organizers.

Only one thing I don't agree with is none should be organizers, who else is going to know what it takes to put one of these contest on. Unless you have done that how can you decide if someone is ready to go foward. I can see where you are going with it but the same can be said of any group you put together. The group needs to be a trustworthy and knowledegable and experenced one that can get it done together.

 

[Tarheel]

Just a time out here on the discussion to thank Jorge, Jeff, Steve, and Dave for jumping into every topic and being frank in their response. Communication and transparency can give many a reason to vote for a candidate, but it can also give many a reason not to. At least they are having the dialog. I don't see anyone else doing it at the same level they are. I can only hope that this level of communication would continue after elected.

Of the current BOD, Candy does a great job of communication in terms of reach. Not that others don't, but my opinion is that she tries to interface with the membership more than normal. That said, Paul Kirk will sign an autograph if you buy a book. A true man of the people.

Like them or not, you can't deny that the four on the group ticket are serious about this and aren't sugar coating issues or ideas. Thanks, guys. Good luck.

When it comes to the current board I know for a fact that most are very approachable and will talk to you. There are some tho that are not for what ever reason. Candy is one that does lurk here and will respond on occasion. It does seem to be tho that sometimes when they do they get bombarded with the negative. If we all look at the positive and try to expand on that the negative will soon be overshadowed to the point of non existence.

As for the five who are running I have enjoyed the interaction with each of them and I will say at least 4 have spent time answering the various topics that have been brought up. If you are honest and look at everything there is one who has chosen not to participate in these discussions. Think about your vote. Have a wonderful day, I am cause I am headed to Shelby to cook!!! Yey!!!:becky::clap2::clap2:

 

[Leatherheadiowa]

When it comes to the current board I know for a fact that most are very approachable and will talk to you. There are some tho that are not for what ever reason. Candy is one that does lurk here and will respond on occasion. It does seem to be tho that sometimes when they do they get bombarded with the negative. If we all look at the positive and try to expand on that the negative will soon be overshadowed to the point of non existence.

As for the five who are running I have enjoyed the interaction with each of them and I will say at least 4 have spent time answering the various topics that have been brought up. If you are honest and look at everything there is one who has chosen not to participate in these discussions. Think about your vote. Have a wonderful day, I am cause I am headed to Shelby to cook!!! Yey!!!:becky::clap2::clap2:

Tarheel, you bring up a good point about looking at the positive. Like the evening news, like the newspaper, and just about everything around us, society looks to find the bad in everything.
As a candidate I am glad to be able to participate in the discussions on here and in other outlets. In my platform I pointed out one negative aspect of the current direction of the BOD, and three other platform items that I feel need improvement.

 

[Jorge]

I would say it takes a minimum off 6 months to get one under control for someone who is good and well orginized. If someone comes to me or is refered to me the first thing I tell them is give yourself a year to do it. Pick a date a year in advance. That gives you time to get people together, sponsors lined up, location secured, amenities covered, advertizing inplace.

You say if they come to the table with all of the extras, money, place, ect. They need to be in the conversation. I have seen that happen, they come in with a song and dance and it turns into a one time wonder and is gone. Then the event that has been there ends up hurt and may not be able to recover. bigger is not always the answer either. A track record of being consistant or continuing to grow would weight heavier in my mind. And you have to protect that. It will end up being a case by case basis. Maybe the regional concept will help narrow it down or provide the board more information that they are currently getting.

Fair points, all. I won't accept song and dance or pleas based solely on good faith when opposed by a history of success, or verifiable documentation from an existing contest or other new event. If a new organizer can meet that burden, I'm willing to give them fair consideration and do everything possible to benefit all parties. At the end of the day, my decision will be in favor of whatever I feel is most likely to benefit the teams and judges.

 

[Jorge]

Before the board starts invoking the 50, 100, 150 or whatever mile rule to protect comps they need to scrape the tarnish off the KCBS sanctioning "star". Around here organizers still talk about the Lakeland debacle. The other complaint I hear in the northeast is that KCBS sanctioning is expensive for what the organizer actually gets. Invoke distance rules in the tightly packed north east and all that will do is make NEBS, MABA, BBQ Brethren, FBA, GBA and other bodies busier. There are other sanctioning bodies besides KCBS. Comps aren't going to fold because KCBS says no. Given the choice between cooking another sanctioning body and not cooking at all cooks are going to cook.

I'll leave Lakeland alone, for the most part but will say that based on the video I don't have much question about whether the entry was accepted or not, or whether it was late or not. What happened after that is more disputable and I've heard multiple versions of what happened or didn't happen. Without seeing the evidence for myself, I'm not prepared to offer an opinion.

I agree about Rep availability in the NE. My understanding is that KCBS is in the process of addressing that. Sooner would be better than later, but hopefully not at the expense of complete training or making sure to select the most qualified candidates. If necessary, I would be willing to support KCBS covering some travel expenses in the event that Reps have to be flown in so that the organizer isn't saddled with an unfair burden. KCBS is selling a service, and to an extent is responsible for the region being under served in terms of available Reps.

 

[Candy Sue]

.... Candy is one that does lurk here and will respond on occasion. ...

I thought I was pretty un-lurk-y! I'm on my way to being a farker... NO, I'm full-fledged now!!!

 

[Jorge]

I thought I was pretty un-lurk-y! I'm on my way to being a farker... NO, I'm full-fledged now!!!

I don't know, if we had you dressed in black and hiding in the shadows.....

Candy and I have had more than one frank discussion in the past. She was open and willing to listen, and share her point of view on issues where she could. I've got no problem with that, or her availability. I appreciate that fact, because much more often than not I'm sure somebody is calling because they are upset about something rather than to thank her for her time and what she's done. It's human nature, and I'm as guilty as the next guy.

Thank you, Candy Sue Weaver!

 

[Slamdunkpro]

I'll leave Lakeland alone, for the most part but will say that based on the video I don't have much question about whether the entry was accepted or not, or whether it was late or not. What happened after that is more disputable and I've heard multiple versions of what happened or didn't happen. Without seeing the evidence for myself, I'm not prepared to offer an opinion.

What happened / didn't happen is immaterial at this point. It's the perception of what happened that is still hanging around along with the sound of rug sweeping that occurred afterward.

This brings up something I'd like to see from the next board. If The Board/KCBS/Staff/Reps screw up - Acknowledge it, Fix it, and put it to bed right away. The less sweeping under the rug that the next BoD does the better to recover KCBS'S reputation.

 

[Jorge]

What happened / didn't happen is immaterial at this point. It's the perception of what happened that is still hanging around along with the sound of rug sweeping that occurred afterward.

This brings up something I'd like to see from the next board. If The Board/KCBS/Staff/Reps screw up - Acknowledge it, Fix it, and put it to bed right away. The less sweeping under the rug that the next BoD does the better to recover KCBS'S reputation.

I think we are on the same page.

 

[Plowboy]

When it comes to the current board I know for a fact that most are very approachable and will talk to you. There are some tho that are not for what ever reason. Candy is one that does lurk here and will respond on occasion. It does seem to be tho that sometimes when they do they get bombarded with the negative. If we all look at the positive and try to expand on that the negative will soon be overshadowed to the point of non existence.

As for the five who are running I have enjoyed the interaction with each of them and I will say at least 4 have spent time answering the various topics that have been brought up. If you are honest and look at everything there is one who has chosen not to participate in these discussions. Think about your vote. Have a wonderful day, I am cause I am headed to Shelby to cook!!! Yey!!!:becky::clap2::clap2:

Agreed. I think five are responding, but one isn't really saying much, imho.

 

[Tarheel]

I thought I was pretty un-lurk-y! I'm on my way to being a farker... NO, I'm full-fledged now!!!

I had no idea you were at that stage of royalty Candy, my humblest of appoligies from a lowley just on my way to be a farker. I bow to your talketivenes!!:eusa_clap

 

[Jeff_in_KC]

Only one thing I don't agree with is none should be organizers, who else is going to know what it takes to put one of these contest on. Unless you have done that how can you decide if someone is ready to go foward. I can see where you are going with it but the same can be said of any group you put together. The group needs to be a trustworthy and knowledegable and experenced one that can get it done together.

Roy and Todd, I'm not sure where knowing what it takes to put on a contest is as vital as a solid knowledge of geography, some idea of team density and what's fair and the right thing to do, but I can see your point. What happens then if a contest in question happens to be in an area where the sole member of the committee who is an organizer is from? Approving or denying the sanctioning (or recommending or failing to recommend) might prove to somehow create an advantage for the committee member who is the organizer in the area in question. I think there is a very workable solution to the sanctioning approval process and we're definitely on the right track in this thread!

 

[Tarheel]

Roy and Todd, I'm not sure where knowing what it takes to put on a contest is as vital as a solid knowledge of geography, some idea of team density and what's fair and the right thing to do, but I can see your point. What happens then if a contest in question happens to be in an area where the sole member of the committee who is an organizer is from? Approving or denying the sanctioning (or recommending or failing to recommend) might prove to somehow create an advantage for the committee member who is the organizer in the area in question. I think there is a very workable solution to the sanctioning approval process and we're definitely on the right track in this thread!

I think it should be a cross section of the whole group, orginizer, cook, judge. It should not be just one person so if there is a conflict it can be dealt with early within the group. The group still is just making a recommendation to the board based on the information gathered.
Again, I don't think it is any diffrent than a board member being in the same situation.

 

[Tarheel]

Ok, another subject here, the KCBS supplies the score cards and plates for the judging. What about the KCBS striking up a deal with a box company and supplying the boxes for contest so we have standard boxes at every contest. In shelby this weekend we had boxes that were called 9 1/2 x 9 1/2 but if you put a tape to them at the lip they were 9 x 9 and just below the lip where your meat would be was 8 1/2 x 8 1/2 . Everyone had the same box but it would be nice to know you were going to have the same box every time.

 

[Leatherheadiowa]

Tarheel,
As a candidate this is an issue but it has been an issue before I decided to run for the BOD. Having been a competitor for over a decade I have seen clam shells of all kinds. I wish there was a standard that was adhered to. There is a standard size but usually the reps go with whatever the organizer has gathered within reason. The variations are often outside of what I would consider "within limits".
I have also written a column at bbqcritic.com about this issue as it pertains to going green at bbq contests. You can read it and read the comments here: http://www.bbqcritic.com/28/post/2011/10/should-bbq-contests-go-green.html

From my experience as a business owner I would use a resource that the KCBS already has in place, Sams Club. You can find the easily available Hedty Hinged Lid Containers 9x9 at Sams Clubs. As part of the Sams Club Tour I would put Sams Club on the spot for a bulk price. A designated person at KCBS could order the boxes and have the same item shipped to every contest. It would be as simple as calling the organizer, asking for the number of categories, number of entrants, and multiply.
From a logistics point of view this would be a simple problem to solve and asking Sams Club to help out with the turn in boxes is something I would have no problem asking them. I have asked Home Depot, Lowes, and Northern Tool for more as a business owner.
I would like to see the regulations abided by and if the simplest of regulations can't be enforced then how can we expect other more complicated rules to be enforced?

 

[CaptTable]

Where I beg to differ is that it is never "as simple as asking the organizer how many teams and how many categories". Many contests will accept applicants up to and incuding the Friday of the contest (especially if there is a Backyard contest). If there are ancillary categories, most teams can sign up as late as when we are passing out boxes on Friday.

Then you have to worry about opening up the boxes to pass them out on Friday and UPS/Fedex has done their usual job of protecting your shipment and half are split (unusable) in some way. Too late to order more so you are back to the organizer having to go buy some then they might not be the exact type.

The idea of ONE box for all sounds nice, but I just don't think it feasible.

And remember, many, many contests are seeral miles from a Sam's while a Costco, etc. may be there in town.