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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind.


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Old 08-17-2010, 07:33 AM   #31
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Velvetta is processed food!!. OMG. keith
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Old 08-17-2010, 08:38 AM   #32
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Quote:
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This is a very astute observation. And if a cook hasn't learned how to problem-solve and comparison-test methods, what will they do when the curve has moved beyond them -- take another class?
Could not agree more, actually. Thomas Edison (who screwed Tesla!!!) once said that he did not fail 200 times at inventing a lightbulb, but succeeded in finding 200 ways not to do it.
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Old 08-17-2010, 08:55 AM   #33
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To the point of ethics. Several folks have suggested that it's allowed by the rules. Or is it? Is it simply not mentioned therefore gets under the wire by omission? The point my wife was trying to make to me (please remember this was a lively debate in my kitchen first) was that even though it's allowed by not being disallowed still leaves the judges in the dark as to what they are eating. Store bought foods have to have ingredients listed on the packaging, restaurants are "supposed" to follow certain guidelines set up by federal, state, and local agencies as well to keep the public safe. Do our organizations owe it to the people that taste our food to know what they are getting?
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Old 08-17-2010, 09:40 AM   #34
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Maybe I'm not exactly comparing apples to apples here, but most of the meats we are buying now days are already injected with some type of solution as a flavor enhancer since so much of today's poultry, hogs, cattle, etc are "factory" raised. 20-30-40 years ago, this was not so much the case (at least with hogs and cattle).

Is the question injecting period or injecting with a purchased product such as Butchers, FAB or Kosmos? If it's the later, where's the line for those making their own injections at home? Or is it OK for home made products? If so, then one could open the can of worms to rubs, sauces, mops, our own chopped wood, pits, hand dug pits, slaughtered animals ... would this be done after meat inspection?

Ok, I've purposely went overboard to demonstrate many of us have different views on what traditional BBQ is and difficulty of drawing lines within rules with all the different aspects to the bbq process.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:05 AM   #35
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The question was.....Is it ethical to serve enhanced meat to judges without telling them?
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:07 AM   #36
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The question was.....Is it ethical to serve enhanced meat to judges without telling them?
Absolutely, it's already enhanced when it leaves the packing plant.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:17 AM   #37
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I agree with Bobby. Go to a local grocer and see if there is anything that is not enhanced, especially on the pork side. If you disclose enhanced meat to judges does that also include other enhancements and or warnings of potential food allergies?

I think a judge needs to accept what they are going to eat with those precautions in mind. If they don't want to don't judge.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:42 AM   #38
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There are indeed products sold that are enhanced but, they are labeled so, to ethically inform the consumer. That's what this thread is about, ethics and informing.... You have a choice there fellas. You do not have to buy enhanced meat. I never do.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:47 AM   #39
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Quote:
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There are indeed products sold that are enhanced but, they are labeled so, to ethically inform the consumer. That's what this thread is about, ethics and informing.... You have a choice there fellas. You do not have to buy enhanced meat. I never do.
I hear ya, Zilla!!! The only enhancement my butcher does is cutting trimming fat!
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:00 AM   #40
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off-topic, so I deleted my reply
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Last edited by monty3777; 08-17-2010 at 11:01 AM.. Reason: off-topic
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:24 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZILLA View Post
There are indeed products sold that are enhanced but, they are labeled so, to ethically inform the consumer. That's what this thread is about, ethics and informing.... You have a choice there fellas. You do not have to buy enhanced meat. I never do.
True and while I don't know what the percentage is of enhanced vs non-enhanced meats are, (I'll see if I have some time do to a google search during lunch) I'm going to guess that packing plant enhanced meats account for a very high percentage of all consumed meats. Thus, I think it's implied that judges will be consuming injected meats during judging.
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:43 AM   #42
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Quote:
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The question was.....Is it ethical to serve enhanced meat to judges without telling them?
Modify the question a bit. Would you serve it to friends and family?
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:53 AM   #43
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Quote:
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The question was.....Is it ethical to serve enhanced meat to judges without telling them?


We can modify the rules to allow YOU to place a label in your turn in box to indicated your meat has been enhanced
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Old 08-17-2010, 12:11 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZILLA View Post
There are indeed products sold that are enhanced but, they are labeled so, to ethically inform the consumer. That's what this thread is about, ethics and informing.... You have a choice there fellas. You do not have to buy enhanced meat. I never do.
And so do the judges.......to judge... or not to judge.....

As far as I'm concerned, the fact that judges DO INDEED have a CHOICE should end this thread.
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Old 08-17-2010, 12:48 PM   #45
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There is a difference in basic expectation.

Consumers have a reasonable expectation that manufacturers and restaurants are required by law to disclose ingredients upon request. And in spite of this, we all know that offending ingredients are hidden by legal loopholes under such monikers as "spice", "hydrolyzed yeast extract", "flavorings" ad infinitum to protect proprietary monkeyings with said food products. Consumers also have a reasonable expectation that if they are to take personal responsibility to avoid offending ingredients, they do not order or consume them unless they absolutely know what's in them.

Judges have a reasonable expectation that they are judging food products from teams that have invested a considerable amount of effort in developing flavor profiles that they are NOT going to disclose. Personal responsibility then dictates that if a judge wishes to avoid possible sensitizers from unknown food products, they should avoid exposure.

So in its essence, the issue is not really about injecting. Offending sensitizers can be dusted or misted on, or applied in any number of ways. The issue is that these products are used in BBQ, and one can choose to avoid exposure or not. It's not like the little kid that has to have all peanut products banned from his classroom because he can't assess risk -- judges are adults who are well aware of the milieu in which they judge, and it would be utterly disingenuous for one to claim that they were shocked and unaware that MSG or phosphates might be in the food products they judge.
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