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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind.


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Unread 02-17-2010, 11:51 AM   #1
ModelMaker
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Default 6 seperate and identifyable

It appears that rule 16 has been modified to allow the cook to present their ribs as they see fit (resemble a slab from the whole rack) vs six pieces that must at presentation look seperated.
There is no rule violation unless a judge does not have a rib to sample.
Me thinks this is good, and it appears the BOD listens and responds.
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Rule 16
Each contestant must submit at least six (6) portions of meat in an approved container. Chicken, pork and brisket may be submitted chopped, pulled, sliced, or diced as the cook sees fit, as long as there is enough for six (6) judges. Ribs shall be turned in bone-in. Judges may not cut, slice, or shake apart to separate pieces. If there is not enough meat for each judge to sample, the shorted judge(s) will score a one (1) on all criteria, and the judges having samples will change the Appearance score to one (1).

The motion was seconded by Candy Weaver.

Vote:
11 yes, 0 no, 0 abstentions
The motion to renumber and modify passes.

Ed
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Unread 02-17-2010, 12:00 PM   #2
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Curious, what's your plan for fitting them in the box?
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Unread 02-17-2010, 12:06 PM   #3
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As a judge I am impressed when a box comes in and the ribs look like one piece from the whole rib. It means you are confident enough to not pick thru 6 different racks of ribs in hoping you can find 6 good ribs.
I guess thats my goal.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 12:08 PM   #4
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Gotcha! I mistook you to mean you wanted to turn in multiple bones per piece. My bad.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 12:24 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ModelMaker View Post
As a judge I am impressed when a box comes in and the ribs look like one piece from the whole rib. It means you are confident enough to not pick thru 6 different racks of ribs in hoping you can find 6 good ribs.
I guess thats my goal.
ModelMaker
So do you score up or down based on this criteria you have personally defined and added to the judging system? There is nothing in the KCBS judging guidelines for this. You are supposed to judge the appearance of the meat, period. There is nothing stated anywhere about looking to see if all ribs came from the same slab.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 01:26 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QN View Post
So do you score up or down based on this criteria you have personally defined and added to the judging system? There is nothing in the KCBS judging guidelines for this. You are supposed to judge the appearance of the meat, period. There is nothing stated anywhere about looking to see if all ribs came from the same slab.
Appearance is largely what is appetizing to thee... Some may feel that
a "whole slab" is more appetizing than 6 riblets side by side... His/her
neighbor might feel differently and is more impressed with the riblets
showing smoke ring, whatever. Parts of it are very subjective. It's
appearance, afterall.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 01:30 PM   #7
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Unread 02-17-2010, 01:39 PM   #8
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Sorry I don't have the rules in front of me but I can't make out any real difference in the old rule from the new and I don't see where it said anything about turning in a whole slab from the same continues section. Me thinks the rule was reviewed and motion set forth to keep it unchanged but like I said I don't have the old copy in front of me so may be I missed something here.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 01:48 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mo-Dave View Post
Sorry I don't have the rules in front of me but I can't make out any real difference in the old rule from the new and I don't see where it said anything about turning in a whole slab from the same continues section. Me thinks the rule was reviewed and motion set forth to keep it unchanged but like I said I don't have the old copy in front of me so may be I missed something here.
Dave
Identifyable was removed. They don't check for 6 until each judge takes a piece and that's after appearance is scored.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 02:26 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QN View Post
So do you score up or down based on this criteria you have personally defined and added to the judging system? There is nothing in the KCBS judging guidelines for this. You are supposed to judge the appearance of the meat, period. There is nothing stated anywhere about looking to see if all ribs came from the same slab.
Part of judging the appearance of the meat is judging the story the cook is telling you when he turns in the meat.

If the story he gets from the box is I am very proud of what is in my box and you can take any thing out of my box then thats the story he is getting.

I have been able to get a similar story when i was presented with a box of ribs once. I think there was 12 ribs in the box. I really felt the guy was telling me you can take anything you want. It doesnt matter.

Sometimes the story can really stick out and the box speaks to me and other times it doesnt. I wouldnt say I judge up or down per say but i am sure it figures in there somewhere.

I had someone last year turn in his rib box with the meat upside down. I really felt he was telling me the meat just didnt look good so he would turn them in upside down. It was a part of his story.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 02:45 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ford View Post
Identifyable was removed. They don't check for 6 until each judge takes a piece and that's after appearance is scored.
So I guess you should make sure each rib is seperated by at least a viewable line or it can be a DQ or just given a 1 for appearance. I am only guessing here.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 02:52 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mo-Dave View Post
So I guess you should make sure each rib is seperated by at least a viewable line or it can be a DQ or just given a 1 for appearance. I am only guessing here.
Dave
No, that was the past rule. If judge 6 gets nothing, then there is action taken.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 02:55 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mo-Dave View Post
So I guess you should make sure each rib is seperated by at least a viewable line or it can be a DQ or just given a 1 for appearance. I am only guessing here.
Dave
Dave, what you're describing is what was required when the word "identifiable" was included. Running a toothpick between each rib ensured that on appearance, six separate pieces could be visually I.D.'d. The crux was that six pieces were determined on appearance, at the time the box was first opened.

Now that the word "identifiable" is removed, there's no longer a need to make each piece visually distinct, or out in plain view. As long as each judge can pick up a piece, it's all good. Now the distinction isn't made until a judge is shorted (whether by miscount or by pieces incompletely cut), in which case the judge with no sample puts 1s for all attributes, and those judges who got pieces must change their appearance scores to 1s.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 04:40 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QN View Post
So do you score up or down based on this criteria you have personally defined and added to the judging system? There is nothing in the KCBS judging guidelines for this. You are supposed to judge the appearance of the meat, period. There is nothing stated anywhere about looking to see if all ribs came from the same slab.
I personally defined or added nothing to the rules. I said I was impressed by the look of a slab of ribs. It niether motivates me to increase or decrease the score no more so than if the bones were presented upside down.
I would give an appearance score on the box as it was presented.
The box with a even, smoothly placed group of ribs would score better than a handfull of ribs put in the box bone side up.
I have read, heard, and understand the rules as they have been given to me. Don't assume otherwise.
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Unread 02-17-2010, 05:05 PM   #15
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When I first read the new rule my thoughts turned not to ribs but more towards those that turn in chopped or pulled meat, that it now longer has to be 6 seperate portions and can be one large portion, provided it is enough for 6 judges

Quote:
Originally Posted by stlgreg View Post
Part of judging the appearance of the meat is judging the story the cook is telling you when he turns in the meat.

If the story he gets from the box is I am very proud of what is in my box and you can take any thing out of my box then thats the story he is getting.

I have been able to get a similar story when i was presented with a box of ribs once. I think there was 12 ribs in the box. I really felt the guy was telling me you can take anything you want. It doesn't matter.

Sometimes the story can really stick out and the box speaks to me and other times it doesnt. I wouldnt say I judge up or down per say but i am sure it figures in there somewhere.

I had someone last year turn in his rib box with the meat upside down. I really felt he was telling me the meat just didnt look good so he would turn them in upside down. It was a part of his story.
I have never heard it put quite like that before, interesting. Do you tend to score a more full box better than one only containing 6 pieces?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ModelMaker View Post
As a judge I am impressed when a box comes in and the ribs look like one piece from the whole rib. It means you are confident enough to not pick thru 6 different racks of ribs in hoping you can find 6 good ribs.
I guess thats my goal.
ModelMaker
even though you know they are cut you would rather they look like they aren't?
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