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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind.


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Unread 05-21-2008, 08:10 AM   #1
mds2
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Default Lets talk about garnish

Ok, so I have a question that i've been wondering about for a while. When a judge scores appearance, are they scoring the appearance of the meat or the appearance of the garnish? If it is the later would it be better for a team to forgo the garnish because it is optional?

And arent judges only supposed to score it on how it is presented to them? Or would a team get scored down because a judge might think "it would look better with garnish".

I dont want to turn this into the age old debate about weather or not KCBS should drop garnish. I just want to hear from some CBJs to know what their opinions are.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 08:25 AM   #2
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This is a fight for the ages! According to my judging class, you are suppose to judge the appearance of the meat. However, everytime someone post a picture of their entry you are bound to read people that scored down becuase of garnish or make a comment of the garnish.

BTW - I use garnish for all my entries.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 08:43 AM   #3
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Same here you are not suppose to judge the garnish but when they open the container you have to admit most will look inside as a whole garnish and meat.

i also always use garnish that the wife painstakingly arranged
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Unread 05-21-2008, 08:49 AM   #4
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It is a MEAT contest. You are supposed to judge the appearance of the MEAT.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 08:52 AM   #5
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Garnish....the necessary evil
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Unread 05-21-2008, 08:54 AM   #6
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It's called human nature - regardless of whether garnish is not to be judged, to the observer, it makes the meat look better. I always use a picture frame analogy. Put the Mona Lisa in a Wal Mart frame and it's still the Mona Lisa and looks great but put it in an expensive, extravagant frame and it's gonna look better. You may not even realize the frame makes it stand out but it does. Same goes for the green around the meat. It makes the meat stand out in the tray because of the contrast in colors. And the better care you take to make that "frame" a fancy one and not a "Wal Mart" frame, the better your entry will look. Yes, it's a meat contest but human nature comes into play, just like you teach judges how a rib is "supposed" to be cooked by KCBS standards and yet ribs that are cooked ALMOST fall off the bone score better because that's typically how the public likes them.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 09:01 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff_in_KC View Post
It's called human nature - regardless of whether garnish is not to be judged, to the observer, it makes the meat look better. I always use a picture frame analogy. Put the Mona Lisa in a Wal Mart frame and it's still the Mona Lisa and looks great but put it in an expensive, extravagant frame and it's gonna look better. You may not even realize the frame makes it stand out but it does. Same goes for the green around the meat. It makes the meat stand out in the tray because of the contrast in colors. And the better care you take to make that "frame" a fancy one and not a "Wal Mart" frame, the better your entry will look. Yes, it's a meat contest but human nature comes into play, just like you teach judges how a rib is "supposed" to be cooked by KCBS standards and yet ribs that are cooked ALMOST fall off the bone score better because that's typically how the public likes them.
Thanks, this is probably the best analogy I have heard. It is just frustrating when you read or hear comments about losing a point because the garnish was uneven or something, when it is the meat that is supposed to be being judged.

I have used garnish in every box I have turned in, and I put a lot of time into trying to make them look good. I just didnt know what exactly was being looked at.

Has anyone ever forgone the garnish in a KCBS event? If so, how did it score? I'd be curious to try it, but with only one shot to try to get it right i'll probably keep using it.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 09:07 AM   #8
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It's a meat contest.......hmmmmmm
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Unread 05-21-2008, 09:13 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mds2 View Post
Has anyone ever forgone the garnish in a KCBS event? If so, how did it score? I'd be curious to try it, but with only one shot to try to get it right i'll probably keep using it.
We have turned in pork without garnish - used a bed of pulled pork to support the sliced pork - looked really good and got a 2nd out 60+ teams the firs time. After that we never did very good and went back to using garnish.

I hate garnish but regardless of KCBS rules and judges instructions entries with nice looking garnsh will score better. You absolutely will get scored low for sloppy garnish so don't just throw it in the box.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 09:57 AM   #10
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I look at it this way from a cook and cbj stance..its optional so if you choose to use t it should look good and not sloppy ..
as a judge I use it as part of thye appearance because the fact that the cook used it I have to assume they WANT it part of appearance. On the other hand I wouldnt score anyone down strictly because they didnt use garnish
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Unread 05-21-2008, 11:56 AM   #11
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I have seen boxes without garnish get 9's. However the boxes were very full so no white was showing. If a box is neat, all meat the same size and full so no white box shows you can score well.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 11:59 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoKanMeathead View Post
You absolutely will get scored low for sloppy garnish so don't just throw it in the box.
100% agree with Wayne... it's a matter of perception - "the cook was sloppy with the garnish so they're sloppy with the meat as well" ... or "carelessness with the garnish probably means carelessness in cooking". It may not be true but perception is reality.
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Unread 05-21-2008, 10:06 PM   #13
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I think yous guys aut to leave sloppy out of this fight, sloppy never scored well without garnish and come to think of it never did great with it but if you are going to use garnish put together the best possible presentation you can. Speaking from a CBJ point of view I judge the meet first but seeing a great presented box sets the meat apart from others, take it for what it is but don't be sloppy.
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