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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind.


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Unread 09-07-2013, 04:03 PM   #1
TeamRamRod
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Default Judge average score

We are relatively new to the bbq scene! We are still trying to understand the new score sheet! What does the Judge average score mean and how do they get it? How can I learn more from it? Everyone says you get so much information out of it, but where? Thanks!!
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Unread 09-07-2013, 04:28 PM   #2
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The judge average score is their average score for the 24 scores that they gave in all 4 categories.
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Unread 09-08-2013, 08:22 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
The judge average score is their average score for the 24 scores that they gave in all 4 categories.
Just to clarify, it will be the average for ALL 'KCBS' categories including side, dessert, etc. using that same table and seat number.
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Unread 09-08-2013, 08:52 AM   #4
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Does KCBS have some type of tutorial out on the new scoring system? Thanks
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Unread 09-10-2013, 03:19 PM   #5
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So that means that everyone's judge average score is the same if their chicken was judged by that judge? Some of this must be the new math.

From my spreadsheet on my chicken score

Calculated Score28.5635.4432.5629.702828.5629.7028



My total is 184.5256

From the score sheet they have the same numbers
28.5635.4432.5629.702828.5629.7028

but a total of 155.9656

Where does that number come from?



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Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
The judge average score is their average score for the 24 scores that they gave in all 4 categories.
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Unread 09-10-2013, 03:52 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akoda View Post
So that means that everyone's judge average score is the same if their chicken was judged by that judge? Some of this must be the new math.

From my spreadsheet on my chicken score

Calculated Score28.5635.4432.5629.702828.5629.7028



My total is 184.5256

From the score sheet they have the same numbers
28.5635.4432.5629.702828.5629.7028

but a total of 155.9656

Where does that number come from?
They drop the lowest score of the 6
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Unread 09-10-2013, 03:59 PM   #7
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OK, thanks for that, I have been tweaking all of my equations trying to find out WTF :)


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Originally Posted by fnbish View Post
They drop the lowest score of the 6
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Unread 09-10-2013, 04:00 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akoda View Post
So that means that everyone's judge average score is the same if their chicken was judged by that judge?
Yes.

The "Judge Average Score" you see listed on your Team Detail Report is showing you how that specific judge was scoring for every entry for every category he/she judged at that contest.

For example, if judge X was presented with six entries each for the four main meat categories and they also judged 5 sauces and 3 desserts, their average would be computed like so:

JAS = (Total of all scores) / ((4 * 6) + 5 +3)


Really all the JAS does is give you a vague handle on whether that judge was "hot" or "cold" for that contest. Because the ancillaries are included in the calculation, it isn't terribly useful for that either, IMO.
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Unread 09-10-2013, 04:06 PM   #9
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Thanks, your speaking my language with equations :), I love the handle CivilWarBBQ too .. my great great grandfather was at Appomattox the day our side lost ..

Quote:
Originally Posted by CivilWarBBQ View Post
Yes.

The "Judge Average Score" you see listed on your Team Detail Report is showing you how that specific judge was scoring for every entry for every category he/she judged at that contest.

For example, if judge X was presented with six entries each for the four main meat categories and they also judged 5 sauces and 3 desserts, their average would be computed like so:

JAS = (Total of all scores) / ((4 * 6) + 5 +3)


Really all the JAS does is give you a vague handle on whether that judge was "hot" or "cold" for that contest. Because the ancillaries are included in the calculation, it isn't terribly useful for that either, IMO.
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Unread 09-10-2013, 07:08 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CivilWarBBQ View Post
Yes.

The "Judge Average Score" you see listed on your Team Detail Report is showing you how that specific judge was scoring for every entry for every category he/she judged at that contest.

For example, if judge X was presented with six entries each for the four main meat categories and they also judged 5 sauces and 3 desserts, their average would be computed like so:

JAS = (Total of all scores) / ((4 * 6) + 5 +3)


Really all the JAS does is give you a vague handle on whether that judge was "hot" or "cold" for that contest. Because the ancillaries are included in the calculation, it isn't terribly useful for that either, IMO.

lulz...so you mean to say that it is even more useless than I originally thought it was. Thank you for the clarification.
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Unread 09-10-2013, 07:49 PM   #11
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At my last contest in Blue Springs the average was for just the four main categories. The rep made the tables in the 100s for the sides sausage and dessert entries. So it was more accurate since all them judges scores go up on them dessert scores.
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Unread 09-10-2013, 08:25 PM   #12
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Now that's interesting.

I think we can expect more changes in how KCBScore is deployed for the next year or so as Reps test the possibilities for how to configure the program at live events. It's also likely that some of these mods will be officially shot down by the KCBS Board while some will be embraced and even result in incorporation in future versions of the software.

This is a Good Thing! Software is supposed to evolve, not remain stagnant for decades like the old scoring system.
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Unread 09-11-2013, 07:20 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CivilWarBBQ View Post
Yes.

The "Judge Average Score" you see listed on your Team Detail Report is showing you how that specific judge was scoring for every entry for every category he/she judged at that contest.

For example, if judge X was presented with six entries each for the four main meat categories and they also judged 5 sauces and 3 desserts, their average would be computed like so:

JAS = (Total of all scores) / ((4 * 6) + 5 +3)


Really all the JAS does is give you a vague handle on whether that judge was "hot" or "cold" for that contest. Because the ancillaries are included in the calculation, it isn't terribly useful for that either, IMO.
Something else to consider on the judge average score is if there was a DQ at the table, that would skew the average all to he!!.
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Unread 09-11-2013, 07:53 PM   #14
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One thing I've been wondering, is I see people say things leading me to believe they know who else's entries were at their tables. Do they get this info just by talking to other teams, or am I missing the way to determine that?
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Unread 09-11-2013, 09:49 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midwest_kc View Post
One thing I've been wondering, is I see people say things leading me to believe they know who else's entries were at their tables. Do they get this info just by talking to other teams, or am I missing the way to determine that?
They have to ask the teams.


To me the value of the average score is to answer the question "Did my food suck?"


Before KCBScore...a low score would mean my food could be bad, or the judging could be bad. So one could take up that grand BBQ tradition of blaming the judges.

Now if I see the average score for a judge, and my ranking on the table, I can infer some things from that. If my score was above the judges average score, and I won the table, but had a low placement in the contest, it's possible it was a low scoring table. With that result, I might not change my entry, but try it again at another contest to see how it fares.

If I didn't win the table, or a lot of judges scores my entry below their average, I can infer that it's more than likely there was a problem with my entry that I need to work on.

That's a useful insight I didn't have before. Is it a magic bullet? No. It's an incremental improvement in the scoring system. Not perfect, but nice to have.
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