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When did BBQ become sweet? (video)

Bigmista

somebody shut me the fark up.
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Check out the video and let me know what you think!

[ame]http://youtu.be/8Mo15UfFCK0[/ame]
 
I know what you're talking about, I've had it too as a kid and try to make it that way for myself. As to the question of when did it change? I think it changed when BBQ became competitive, and over the years the sauces have been made sweeter. What I like, and (what I think you like) probably wouldn't win in competition, and I think that's why it's all but disappeared.
 
Good question. I grew up in East TN, where "barbecue" was what we called pulled pork. The choices for sauce were hot and mild - all vinegar based and a little tomato if I recall correctly. That was it.

I'm not sure when the sweet stuff started creeping in, but I've noticed when I'm doing fundraiser cooking, most people seem to prefer the sweet sauce on their sammiches over the other stuff. I personally don't get it, but if that's what they want, they can have it.I always throw in some vinegar and woosty so it isn't just sweet - it's got to have at least a little tang. The vinegar/pepper sauce I like seems to be a little much for them. Could be a California thang, I don't know.

I do like sweet for glazing MOINKs, 'cause I cut it with jap jelly and the sweet/heat thing is nice, but that's about all I use sweet for.

I don't know any TX sauce recipes, but I got some interesting (not to mention delicious) stuff in Arkansas from a place called Craig's, and there's a chance you might get a hold of some this weekend. :spy:
 
Thats EZ
Sweetness has gone up with Internet BBQ's popularity. You joined when there was less than 1500 users here. Hell I remember the post still when you had'nt cooked a brisket yet. Back then it was different in more ways than 1. The biggest two differences are the flavors have gone sweet and the definition and concept of Low and Slow have went to I can get a packer done in 5 hrs. Internet BBQ wont be going away anytime soon though so I better get back to work. Im inventing the first BBQ Smokerwave. It combines the Taste from a pit with the speed of a Microwave.
 
This might shed some light on the subject. Start reading at page 18 - A New Look at Old Time BBQ

http://www.smokesignalsmagazine.com/SSM/Issue9/index

Here is an excerpt -

The Sauce

Herman Melville wrote in his classic novel Moby Dick “Also, that in Henry VIIIth's time, a certain cook of the court obtained a handsome reward for inventing an admirable sauce to be eaten with barbecued porpoises, which, you remember, are a species of whale.” If that account is true, and there is no reason to believe it isn’t, that has to be one of, if not the, oldest accounts of an award winning barbecue sauce.

First of all, the vinegar, salt, pepper mixture that we are so often told was the “typical” barbecue sauce of the 19th century wasn’t a barbecue sauce at all. It was actually a basting liquid. The barbecue cooks would baste the meat with the peppery liquid while the meat was cooking. It’s hard to say how many actually served the basting liquid with the meat. However, knowing how barbecue cooks do things today, I bet that if the meat was on the dry side some of that “sauce” made it to the table.

But, that’s not the whole story about 19th century barbecue and the sauce that was served on it. Mary Randolph often served spicy and otherwise richly seasoned foods. She routinely calls for garlic and at least sixteen other herbs in the recipes listed in her book. She has a curry powder recipe that calls for turmeric, coriander, cumin, nutmeg, mace, and cayenne pepper. Her book includes recipes for tarragon vinegar, for mushroom catsup, and tomato marmalade calling for black pepper, and garlic that she claimed is excellent for seasoning gravies. It is clearly documented that Virginia foods in the 18th and 19th centuries, at least among the wealthier classes, was richly seasoned.

Besides the spices and herbs used in 18th and 19th century cooking, the upper classes also used sugar. It was a way to show off their wealth. Mary Randolph’s barbecued pork recipe calls for “browned” sugar. The Kentucky Housewife has a barbecued beef recipe that calls for rubbing the meat with molasses before barbecuing it. That book was published in 1839. I’m sure the recipe is much older. The same book also has a recipe for cooking barbecued venison after rubbing it with brown sugar and another for barbecuing rabbit that included vinegar, mustard, and currant jelly or brown sugar. Sounds a lot like what’s going on nowadays, doesn’t it? The poorer classes and slaves couldn’t afford sugar or expensive spices and herbs. Therefore, we read so much about the vinegar and pepper mixture. But, it’s clear from the recipes in the cookbooks written by the three women mentioned above, all from relatively wealthy Virginia families, that sugar and barbecue have been companions for a lot longer than we have been told by historians. In Housekeeping in Old Virginia there is a recipe for a “meat-flavoring” that consists of vinegar, salt, pepper, red pepper, mustard, turmeric, celery seed, and brown sugar. Isn’t that interesting? Sounds like a modern barbecue sauce.

There are also some other references to sweet barbecue “sauces” in the 19th century. For example, in an 1863 edition of the Holmes County Farmer there is an account of a barbecue held in South Carolina where it says “a barbecue consisting of twelve roasted oxen and numerous barrels of molasses” was served. Notice that beef, not pork, was served at a South Carolina barbecue. However, what’s most interesting is the reference to molasses. By the same token, at the wedding of Abraham Lincoln’s parents, it is recorded that there was “syrup in big gourds; peach-and-honey; a sheep that the two families barbecued whole over coals of wood burned in a pit.” Now, the writers of those accounts never come right out and say that the molasses, peach syrup, and honey were served with the meat to be eaten like a sauce. But, is that really necessary? In my family every year at Thanksgiving we always have cranberry sauce. But, you know what we end up doing with it? We put it on the turkey! We don’t call it turkey sauce. But, that’s where we put it when we eat it. I am convinced that those sweet syrups were served to go on the meats at those barbecues.
 
Great post, and I agree with slow-smoker about that competition aspect. Ribs used to be one of my favorite things in the world to eat, but since we started competing, I barely touch them anymore. A lot of that is due to all the practice cooks, but I think it also has a lot to do with all of the honey, brown sugar, agave, etc. that is almost required in KCBS.

I also agree with GTR. I grew up with BBQ meaning pork, and usually chopped fine on a hamburger bun. If there was any sauce, it was mostly vinegar with some spices.
 
Commercial BBQ sauces started the sweet trend IMO. Go look at your local grocery store shelf and check the labels. The majority of them have lots of high fructose corn syrup. Sweet isn't just a product of competition BBQ.
 
I use no sauce on my barbecue and my rub has no brown sugar. Had more than one person tell me they liked my stuff cause it didn't take like every other barbecue place....
 
Neal, in response to your request in the video, here is a Texas Barbecue Juice recipe by Meathead that was inspired by Cooper's in Llano, TX.

I have yet to try it, but it looks as if it would be pretty close to the stuff I tasted there. Cooper's key is continually dipping meat into the pot of sauce.

http://amazingribs.com/recipes/BBQ_sauces/texas_BBQ_mop-sauce.html

I agree with your sentiments regarding that old school BBQ taste. I want it to be just like Sutphin's was in my childhood back in Borger, TX - savory, smokey and not sweet.
 
Neal, in response to your request in the video, here is a Texas Barbecue Juice recipe by Meathead that was inspired by Cooper's in Llano, TX.

I have yet to try it, but it looks as if it would be pretty close to the stuff I tasted there. Cooper's key is continually dipping meat into the pot of sauce.

http://amazingribs.com/recipes/BBQ_sauces/texas_BBQ_mop-sauce.html

I agree with your sentiments regarding that old school BBQ taste. I want it to be just like Sutphin's was in my childhood back in Borger, TX - savory, smokey and not sweet.

I made this the first time I did a brisket. Saved an otherwise overtrimmed, dry rookie attempt. It's good.
 
Dont care to hijack but my question is related, when did bacon become sweet??
or sausage? I know the Jimmy Dean maple flavors are big sellers but none goes in my cart.
 
I was always to understand that vinegar based pork BBQ in slow smokers originated on the Easters coast, and sweet based beef BBQ cooked over a smokey open n pit was from the central and southcentral US. As far as them stretching to other parts of the country that's just how trade has expanded the industry.

I think the 'wet' look of the ribs is a result of the judges in comps.
 
Here ya go Mista. When I was growin' up this was bbq sauce in central Arkansas. Seemed most every joint used this or a clone. This has been posted here a couple of times before.

http://www.ibdjohn.com/shack/

Shack BBQ Sauce

Wet Stuff


Mix in a large bowl:

3 - 24 ounce bottle of ketchup (catsup)
Use the plastic ones, we will refill after making sauce.

Fill with hot water, swoosh around and dump contents into bowl.
Folks have asked: HOW MUCH WATER? Fill all three bottles, and dump all into 'Wet Stuff'
(For original recipe use Grapette from Wal Mart- see 'additional notes').

Pour in plain ole cheap vinegar. "THE" recipe calls for just less than a quart, do not sweat this. use anywhere from a pint to a quart, strangely, this amount has scant effect on final product.

Put "wet stuff' in a LARGE pan, put heat on "high"
by the time it is approaching a boil, you will have "dry stuff' prepared.



Dry Stuff:


Since you dumped wet stuff out of bowl, why not use for 'dry'?
Into bowl, dump:

1 - 4 ounce can of chili powder
1 - 4 ounce can of black pepper
1 - 4 ounce can of garlic salt (SALT, NOT garlic powder!!!)
1/2 cup - sugar (is the ORIGINAL amount, why not TRY that, and adjust to your very own taste after 'brewing' mess up...likewise with Tabasco. See below)
1 - small Tabasco (anywhere from 1 to 4 ounces..start with about 1 oz...you can 'play' to taste after whole mess is completed.
1 - small mustard (size of an apple, just regular ole smear on a hotdog yeller mustard)

Stir
...btw, easier to put the mustard in last, and just swirl around till it looks like chocolaty brown tar.



Simmer


Dump all this stuff into pan on stove now approaching a simmer if you have been quick, and if you rinsed out the catsup with HOT water;-)

stir enough to make it evenly liquid...bring to a boil and immediately lower heat to a simmer.

30 minutes, (stir fairly often to avoid sticking).. during which the vinegar will bring sweat to your forehead, and tears to your eyes...think ventilation here.



Finish


That is it.
Remove from heat, pour back into bottles you saved, unfortunately, you will have an excess of sauce. Improvise, all life has dry rot.

You now have a LOT of sauce. I always do, and find it MOST welcome as a gift.

BTW, there is no need to refrigerate your sauce supply, even if you inhabit hot and humid southern climes! Apparently mischievous microbes refrain from causing problems in gratitude for being immersed in this tomato based necter, or are immobilized by the ingredients rendering them deliciously inert.



Additional Notes


Do it this way the first time, later, you may substitute Grapette, for the water (seriously) SHACK DID for several decades ... for total authenticity you can obtain Grapette from Wal Mart

I add about a cup of sugar to my sauce, but this is heresy, and practice has strong adherents and detractors.

Likewise minced onions, NOT authentic, but can be pleasant.

Do NOT futz with the amount of black pepper. I KNOW it sounds like a lot. Trust me on this.

Also remember garlic SALT, not garlic powder!! several folks got this wrong, actually the sauce wasn't bad, but they were not fit as shipmates for WEEKS.

Do NOT judge 'heat', as in taste, by sipping off spoon from pot, even if you were stingy with the Tabasco. Dunk a piece of bread into sauce and sample that way.

Should you screw up your courage and actually MAKE this stuff and after having your friends, co-workers and mistress try it, drop me an e-mail with comments : click dp
 
Here's a couple more that have Texas roots you might be interested in.

First is Bigwheel's version of Smitty's BBQ Sauce

To a non reactive pot add this:

1 big jug of ketchup 46oz size
1 small bottle Lea n Perrins Wooster Sauce
2 T. chili powder
2 T. granulated onyawn
1 T. granulated garlic
1 small can grapefruit juice (Sacramento Brand if you can find it) BW once said any kind of juice but Smitty used grapefruit as a mystery ingredient.
2 t. cayenne (or however much suits your taste)
1 big ketchup jug full of water

Put it in the coolest part of the pit and let it chuckle away all day without a lid. Serve it on the side.

The next one was called Tom & Mary's Sauce when I found it somewhere or the other.:oops: Think it was National BBQ News.

Saute 3/4 cup of onion and 2 or more cloves of garlic in oil of your choice. Pour off the oil (or not) and add these ingredients -

3/4 cup ketchup
3/4 cup water
1/3 cup vinegar (I used Apple cider vinegar)
3 tblsp sugar (I used turbinado)
3 tblsp Worchestershire sauce (go ahead - I can't spell either)
3 tblsp Mustard (plain old yellow)
2 tsp Salt (I used kosher)
1 tsp Pepper (Fresh ground)
1 8 oz can tomato sauce

Simmer until your happy with the thickness. This was the Taste of Texas to me as a child.
 
The amount of sugar in BBQ sauce is directly proportional to the price and availability of sugar. People have always liked sweet foods but only in the last 100 years or so in the U.S. have most people been able to afford sugar in large quantities.

Remember, sugar used to be to the world what oil is today. It was rare and costly and was a symbol of prosperity.

"Old fashioned barbecues" gave way to barbecue and ice cream meetings around the 1890s. That's also when you began to see the hot dog and hamburger stands showing up and even at barbecues. Not long after, barbecue sauces for the masses began to get sweeter and sweeter.

But, wealthy people used sugar on barbecue for decades before others could afford it.

The current central Texas tradition came along almost as its own thing. People working at meat markets in central Texas started cooking meat for themselves to eat for lunch/dinner. They used salt and peper on the meat to cook it because that's all they thought they were doing was cooking lunch and dinner for themselves. Customers found the aroma very appetizing and began asking if they could buy some. Next thing you know, the meat market/butcher was in the barbecue business selling roasted meat. That practice spread throughout the region.
 
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