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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind.


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Unread 10-15-2012, 03:42 PM   #1
hawg
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Default Cooker Entry Fee Check Bounced After Contest

I'm looking for advice and opinion on the following subject.

I am the promoter of a recent state championship event. One of the cooker's check bounced and we did not find out until the Monday after the event was over. On top of that, it was returned as being written on a closed account, so it was a deliberate act. This cooker also placed high in the results and won prize money. The prize money was paid in cash, and it was far more than required to cover the entry fee.

I have tried to call and email the cooker, for the past week, with no response. I did a google search of this person, and he has two prior arrests for hot checks that are public knowledge on the web.

This contestant entered using a team name that is also used by another person with the same last name - I have been told by third parties that this other person is his father. Searches of BBQ websites show his father has placed in several IBCA and KCBS contests in the past as well, and many in the south would recognize his name if it I published it.

Right now, I just want the money, but my only other course of action is to file the hot check with my county attorney - but the contestant lives in another county and I don't know how successful it will be.

Anyone have any advice or opinions? I hate to "out" the team name and contestant name, but I feel like other promoters and cookers should know this person for what he is. He has deliberately cheated me, and deliberately cheated other teams out of prize money.

Thanks in advance,
Hawg
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Unread 10-15-2012, 03:46 PM   #2
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I'd be sure to alert KCBS about it. Based on recent events they may sanction the team. Unfortunately, unless the person mans up, you're only route for getting payment will probably be a legal filing which is gonna cost you.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 03:53 PM   #3
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Contact your local police in your area. Should not cost you anything to prosecute the person.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 03:56 PM   #4
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I would also contact the father, if possible, and let him know that you intend to report their team to KCBS and IBCA, and that he might want to consider making good on his son's abuse of his team name.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 04:03 PM   #5
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Knowingly passing hot checks is a matter for law enforcement.
Been there on the receiving end.

If it was done as you stated, I would simply contact local law like Bull said and they will tell ya how to proceed.

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Unread 10-15-2012, 07:40 PM   #6
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If you call KCBS tell them he was wearing a fake penis apron when he gave you the check and they'll be all over it. Otherwise I don't think they'll get involved. But in most states it's a pretty serious crime so I'd go that route.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 08:03 PM   #7
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Quote:
This contestant entered using a team name that is also used by another person with the same last name - I have been told by third parties that this other person is his father. Searches of BBQ websites show his father has placed in several IBCA and KCBS contests in the past as well, and many in the south would recognize his name if it I published it.
Here's what to do. Send a letter of collection to the father saying that the check for his team bounced. Make the letter out to the Team Leader of that team, so it will make sense that you would be contacting him. Play dumb about the son. Bet the dad will fix things.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 09:37 PM   #8
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It doesn't cost a ton to have an lawyer write a letter. Show him your serious

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Unread 10-15-2012, 09:40 PM   #9
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Call the authorities and press charges.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 10:12 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landarc View Post
I would also contact the father, if possible, and let him know that you intend to report their team to KCBS and IBCA, and that he might want to consider making good on his son's abuse of his team name.
No offense, but I would not take any action against the father unless you have reason to believe that he was complicit in this action. When I worked for an identity theft remediation company, I had a coworker who had to legally change his name to prevent his father from commiting fraud in his name. Some times family members really aren't responsible for the others.

As some one who recently had to suffer consequences for the actions of another, I can tell you that it sucks, and isn't fair. Is it worth it to you (any one?) to ruin some one else's BBQ career for something that he may or may not have done? I'd contact the man and tell him what is son is doing. See what kind of response you get. I'd contact KCBS and/or IBCA and tell them the name of the individual, and if needed, the the team, but I would not bring in the father without cause. I can't speak for IBCA, but from my understanding, KCBS has gone through a good deal to ensure that the team on a given day is identified by the person serving as the head cook on that day. If the father wasn't there, it's not the same team.

That's just me. I would definitely call the cops and give them his address. If he has a record, he could likely do hard time over this.

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Unread 10-15-2012, 11:03 PM   #11
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Thanks for all opinions, that is why I posted the question. There are some very thoughtful responses here. Keep them coming if you have any further ones.

I am not concerned about the money so much as I am mad about the deliberate act, and the fact that this individual cheated some other teams out of recognition and money. We worked tirelessly for months to put on a first class event and did everything we could to cater to the teams, including paying out in cash instead of checks.

In the end, we will have to now revise our proceedures to protect ourselves. No entries will be accepted within two weeks of the event unless they are paid with cash or cashiers checks. That will cost us teams, but I cannot think of any other way.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 11:10 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmprantz View Post
No offense, but I would not take any action against the father unless you have reason to believe that he was complicit in this action. When I worked for an identity theft remediation company, I had a coworker who had to legally change his name to prevent his father from commiting fraud in his name. Some times family members really aren't responsible for the others.

As some one who recently had to suffer consequences for the actions of another, I can tell you that it sucks, and isn't fair. Is it worth it to you (any one?) to ruin some one else's BBQ career for something that he may or may not have done? I'd contact the man and tell him what is son is doing. See what kind of response you get. I'd contact KCBS and/or IBCA and tell them the name of the individual, and if needed, the the team, but I would not bring in the father without cause. I can't speak for IBCA, but from my understanding, KCBS has gone through a good deal to ensure that the team on a given day is identified by the person serving as the head cook on that day. If the father wasn't there, it's not the same team.

That's just me. I would definitely call the cops and give them his address. If he has a record, he could likely do hard time over this.

dmp
What I was suggesting was exactly to talk to the father and let him know what is going on. But, yes, I will go ahead and tell a father that his son stole from me, and that I will be coming after him and he might want to try clearing out of the way. Getting ripped off for my fees, this has happened more than once to me, buy some very well-funded companies. So, I have little tolerance or patience.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 11:11 PM   #13
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I would add, this is a good reason for cashing entry checks ASAP and for not paying in cash. Taking checks the day of, increases risk.
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Unread 10-15-2012, 11:28 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landarc View Post
What I was suggesting was exactly to talk to the father and let him know what is going on. But, yes, I will go ahead and tell a father that his son stole from me, and that I will be coming after him and he might want to try clearing out of the way.
I guess I misunderstood your use of pronouns, and for that I am sorry. I would tell the father, yes, but I don't think I would ask the father to make good on his son's debts. I would probably be sensitive to this and avoid getting the father mixed up at all (mentioning team name to sanctioning bodies), unless I had reason to suspect complicity.

This brings up an interesting thought to me: First, be careful on your two week limit, because I think account holders have longer to stop payment on a check. Next, regardless, credit cards might be a better option overall. While cardholders can always dispute a charge, and disputes cost you money, if the authorization goes through, the association and the issuing bank have guarenteed to fund the transaction. It's up to them to go after deadbeats who don't pay. You'd probably lose any dispute for a team who didn't show up though unless they signed a contract agreeing no refunds. There was a poll here not to long ago and the idea of credit card payments got a lot of traction. Merchant accounts with Google, Amazon, etc, are not that hard to get if you don't mind paying relatively high interchange rates.

I'd stay away from PayPal though, at least non CC transactions. There's a fair amount of fraud on that system, and if you aren't careful, your PayPal account can get frozen because some one else payed you fraudulently.

dmp
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Unread 10-15-2012, 11:39 PM   #15
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We used to shoot a lot of horse shows (with a camera!) and the deal was always that we had to shoot on weekends, and we never knew whether the checks we got were good or not. But, we never released final prints on day of show for check transactions. The woman I worked with, she would take the checks to each bank and cash them. This often meant 10 to 12 banks visits, but, once cashed, she had the money, no cancelled checks.

Best part of this story, one day, my sister-in-law comes up to me with an image I shot, with proof stamped on it. And she asks me to remove the proof stamp, so she can have the image enlarged. I told her no, that I don't get paid that way, you are ripping me off, she then yelled I charge too much.
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