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Q-talk *ON TOPIC ONLY* QUALITY ON TOPIC discussion of Backyard BBQ, grilling, Equipment and just outdoor cookin' in general, hints, tips, tricks & techniques, success, failures... but stay on topic. And watch for that hijacking.


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Unread 04-14-2011, 12:22 PM   #31
deepsouth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-Dat View Post
I foil butts to get the fat and juices to render out so that I can pour it back into the meat after pulling.

during or after the cook?
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Unread 04-14-2011, 02:57 PM   #32
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I never foil while the meat is on the smoker and I spritz once every hour. At 190* I pull the butt and spritz one last time before foiling and then into a towel lined cooler. I still get good bark but it is not as crunchy.

The juice left in the foil is one of the main reasons I like to wrap before it goes to rest. I will mix the drippings with a small amount of my spritz and spray the meat as I pull it.

My butt is never dry. Mainly because the bayou floods everytime a cricket takes a leak.
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Unread 04-14-2011, 02:59 PM   #33
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I'm pretty happy with my foil less results. I'm also happy not spending a ton of money on foil. I will note though that I cook my butts at 275, I decided that a longer cook time did nothing but dry them out.
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Unread 04-14-2011, 04:31 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lake Dogs View Post
Yep. That's why i foil. I know others dont, and that's certainly their choice, and they're happy with their results. I/we foil because:

1. Moisture retention. We compete and we cook for ourselves. For competitions especially it needs to be as moist as possible.

2. Bark (appearance as well as taste). Need it to be more reddish brown (described as a mahogany) than towards the black. Also the
blacker the bark the more bitter the taste.

3. Whole shoulder must be great; not just pieces. When we compete it's more likely to be MBN; judges will be right there in our campsite.
The shoulder must be perfect in every way, not just a few select pieces. Also, we can't separate the money muscle from it. None
of the hard bark / outside stuff is acceptable. None.

We get less loss due to burn, or over-smoke, or dryness, etc.

I'm not saying others dont get great results without having to foil. We dont.
totally agree
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Unread 04-14-2011, 04:33 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Babin2k View Post
I never foil while the meat is on the smoker and I spritz once every hour. At 190* I pull the butt and spritz one last time before foiling and then into a towel lined cooler. I still get good bark but it is not as crunchy.

The juice left in the foil is one of the main reasons I like to wrap before it goes to rest. I will mix the drippings with a small amount of my spritz and spray the meat as I pull it.

My butt is never dry. Mainly because the bayou floods everytime a cricket takes a leak.
I hear ya. I never had a dry butt either.
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Unread 04-14-2011, 04:38 PM   #36
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Also it according what you cooking with. If you cooking with all wood you going to get a good bark and the flavor will be there . I have been using alum pan best of both worl they have the juice plus a good color and bark on time and not as much waste.
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Unread 04-15-2011, 10:42 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthwestBBQ View Post
Actually, it get's the meat through the stall faster. It's a must in competition.
So what are those idiot judges looking for that makes foil a must in comp? Just like having to scrape chicken fat from the skin...or form a chick thigh into some abnormal shape to get good scores...how trains these lain brains?
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Unread 04-15-2011, 11:06 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cook View Post
So what are those idiot judges looking for that makes foil a must in comp? Just like having to scrape chicken fat from the skin...or form a chick thigh into some abnormal shape to get good scores...how trains these lain brains?
Depends on sanctioning body.

Like in MBN, they come in your camp; on-site. We have to provide/supply a whole pork shoulder. They sample different pieces from different regions of the shoulder. No pre-pulling, pre-separation, etc. Black outside dont cut it. Hard crusty crust dont cut it. Slightly dry dont cut it. Sauced, generally dont cut it.

Chicken would be a KCBS thing. Almost all sanctioning bodies have rules and judges are instructed that if it's in the box it's to be sampled/eaten. Therefore rubbery skin must be tried/eaten. That's why if you're going to do skin on a chicken, you'd better scrape it. As to the abnormal shape; that's simply a beauty in the eye of the beholder thing, and what's appetizing to one person may not be appetizing to another... Damned people.
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Unread 04-15-2011, 11:34 AM   #39
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LOTS of variables contribute to the final product:

kind of smoker, water/sand pan or magic saucer in pan (if wsm), the actual meat itself, how full the smoker is, temp spikes, the rub, amount thereof, basting/spritzing/leavin' it the hell alone, flipping/rotation/leavin' it the hell alone, dry/drowned wood, age of wood, kind of wood, amount of wood, method of using the wood, placement of wood, charcoal used, appetite of cook, mood of cook, sobriety of cook, time meat rested, temp rested at, time cook rested...... Blah, blah, blah

With all that, it's hard to definitively say that foiling helps in EVERY situation, but it might work for YOU.

It definately makes the meat cook faster and more predictably, and obviously protects the bark from excessive smoke, so I'm not surprised it's used by competitors. It's also a way to add some a little more flavor, and yes, you can always open the foil to firm up the bark on the final product. Blah, blah, blah...sorry

Funny when you think about it, but it's probably the best route for the novice and pro competitor alike. However, I usually get just as good a product on my wsm by not foiling until resting. The wsm water pan makes for a very moist environment (think softer/less bark) and I cook around 250*...butts on the bottom (more forgiving) and brisket on the top grate.
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Unread 04-15-2011, 03:24 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lake Dogs View Post
Therefore rubbery skin must be tried/eaten. That's why if you're going to do skin on a chicken, you'd better scrape it.
I never have been able to figure out what the problem is with getting bite-thru skin. I've never really had a problem with it, but then I don't comp. cook so I don't overly complicate things. Not knocking anything, please keep that in mind. I think watching what comp. cooks do is intriguing...just glad I don't have to worry about the same things...I just cook.
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Unread 04-15-2011, 04:20 PM   #41
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Dave Russell...I don't think it can be explained any better than that my friend!!!

Jim
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Unread 04-15-2011, 10:55 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RAZORBACK JIM View Post
Dave Russell...I don't think it can be explained any better than that my friend!!!

Jim
Thanks for the kind words, Jim. I must've had my coffee already. I'm just a backyard bbq guy that's too multi-task challenged to actually be a cook.

I've learned a LOT about bbq from this forum, and books too, but over the last few years I've learned more from each particular cooker I was using. Sure, "it's not the cooker, it's the cook"...but you need to know your cooker and you learn it by trying different things and by seeing what works best in different situations/cookers.
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Unread 04-15-2011, 11:26 PM   #43
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POINT...well said!!!!

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