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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind. |
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10-18-2018, 03:48 PM | #1 |
Got Wood.
Join Date: 07-30-14
Location: San Diego
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bbqscores.com and bbqdata.com data
Does anyone know how these sites pull their data from KCBS? I reached out to KCBS and they don't have a public API and I am trying not to reinvent the wheel as I am tired of doing this manually.
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10-18-2018, 03:54 PM | #2 |
is One Chatty Farker
Join Date: 09-14-12
Location: Springfield, MO
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Screen scrape, but I wouldn’t waste my time on that right now. KCBS is working on a new system that will put all results behind a paywall thereby changing the structure of what you need to do. In all likelihood, you’ll have to work out a deal with KCBS to get data. Hopefully an API of some sort is included in the new system, but I doubt it’s free.
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10-18-2018, 05:27 PM | #3 |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 01-23-04
Location: DFW, San AntonioTx
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It's their data/IP. You can scrape it for now. I expect them to monetize it, as they should as a business (fully understanding the 501 status). I can see cases for exceptions, which benefit BBQ in general as well as KCBS.
If you are looking to generate revenue, I wish you luck. If you are looking to promote BBQ and/or KCBS I hope there are exceptions made. More importantly I hope the data is treated as the resource that it is.
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You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline - it helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. --Frank Zappa Keeping Valspar in BBQ, one cook at a time. Recipient of a Huggies box! Shut up, and cook!!!! |
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10-18-2018, 06:04 PM | #4 |
Babbling Farker
Join Date: 02-27-07
Location: Northern VA
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IANAL but as I understand it scores aren't IP (remember you can't copyright a game) and even if they were considered such they would fall under the news exception so once they were published under any form distribution as news would apply. Plus if KCBS chooses to require payment for results the teams that have trademarked their names will be knocking on the door since you can't fee publish a trademarked/copyrighted item without due compensation.
This is a huge can of worms and not the best use of our membership money. It will only serve to further alienate the membership.
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Aporkalypse Now Competition BBQ team Thanks to our sponsors: Wusthof Trident USA, Creekstone Farms, Myron Mixon Smokers & The BBQ Guru MABA 2014 Team of the Year Spicewine Tandem - "The Beast", 2 Vulcan V33's & 1 V9 Brinkman modified upright, Weber Kettle(s); Meadow Creek Pr-24, Super Stealth Mode black & Night Vision Red Thermopens ----------------- MABA - (Mid Atlantic BBQ Association) President KCBS Certified Judge - #23289 |
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10-18-2018, 07:18 PM | #5 | |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 01-23-04
Location: DFW, San AntonioTx
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Quote:
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You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline - it helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. --Frank Zappa Keeping Valspar in BBQ, one cook at a time. Recipient of a Huggies box! Shut up, and cook!!!! |
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10-19-2018, 07:56 AM | #6 |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 01-23-04
Location: DFW, San AntonioTx
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After reading my posts again this morning, I was tired yesterday.
This being a can of worms is an understatement. I believe that KCBS needs to protect their IP, and we can debate what that is all day long....or someone else can. I believe that there needs to be a liberal license policy. If it benefits BBQ the license is granted, period, end of discussion. To not do so raises potential conflicts with 501 status. Unless I've missed a change KCBS still has 501c4, and not 501c3, status. To me the line is pretty simple. Is someone looking to generate revenue? If they are, but their intended use is acceptable license the data for a fee. Are they looking to promote BBQ, and at most generate revenue to cover costs? Grant the license for a limited time at no cost, and renew or rescind the license as needed. For those that disagree I'll have my back to the creek, and some Shiner on ice 11 hours east of DFW this time next week. Stop by.
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You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline - it helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. --Frank Zappa Keeping Valspar in BBQ, one cook at a time. Recipient of a Huggies box! Shut up, and cook!!!! |
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10-19-2018, 09:45 AM | #7 | |
is One Chatty Farker
Join Date: 09-14-12
Location: Springfield, MO
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We have a 300 pound gorilla in the room. Our hobby is dying on the vine. Contests are dying, organizers don’t make any money, teams can’t afford to compete, and honestly, nobody really cares when they do compete because there is zero public interaction. Stifling innovation because the innovators might make a buck seems like the wrong tack at this point to me. KCBS will generate much more revenue by having healthy contests and a large pool of teams than they will by trying to police that extra 50 cents BBQData might make after expenses. Open the API. Encourage innovation. If someone makes a boatload of money off KCBS scoring data, that’s a good thing for KCBS, not bad. That means enough people actually care about competition BBQ to generate revenue somehow which ensures KCBS growth. Just my 2 cents.
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10-19-2018, 09:54 AM | #8 |
is One Chatty Farker
Join Date: 09-14-12
Location: Springfield, MO
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I had this conversation with Sterling Ball of Big Poppa Smokers just the other day and these protectionist policies are very similar to how Microsoft operated 15-20 years ago. They lost a ton of market share because of them. Google (or Bing, I guess!) “Sterling Ball Microsoft” for a good dive down open source versus protectionist policies.
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10-19-2018, 11:22 AM | #10 |
Got Wood.
Join Date: 07-30-14
Location: San Diego
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Thanks everyone for the information... would of sucked to do some work to have to redo it later. As for my intent with the data, I am just a tech geek looking to automate my personal data gathering and possibly do some big data analytics on a larger subset of data for learning purposes.
I did reach out to KCBS directly and was told there is no current public API and they were considering it in the future. No mention of cost, or sounds of monetizing that revenue stream. Hopefully they are just figuring out the logistic of how to open it up while keep the site secure and not adding additional load. |
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10-19-2018, 11:50 AM | #11 | |
is Blowin Smoke!
Join Date: 07-31-11
Location: Beaumont, CA
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Any chance of crunching the numbers, and letting me know why I can't cook ribs to save my life???
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[I][COLOR=Red][B]Green Card Q[/B][/COLOR][/I] - Pitmaster (term used loosely) KCBS MCBJ & CTC Humphrey's Long Weekender, UDS, Red Box Smoker, SJS/Tamale Pot Smoker, Weber Performer, Weber 18.5 OTS, Alton Brown Flower Pot Smoker (died), Blue Ember Gasser (died} Member of the Hall of Zero's (Noobians v. Veterans Throwdown) |
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10-19-2018, 11:55 AM | #12 |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 01-23-04
Location: DFW, San AntonioTx
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Try steaming them first.
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You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline - it helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. --Frank Zappa Keeping Valspar in BBQ, one cook at a time. Recipient of a Huggies box! Shut up, and cook!!!! |
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10-19-2018, 03:33 PM | #13 | |
Full Fledged Farker
Join Date: 01-29-14
Location: Corona, CA
Name/Nickname : Bob
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Quote:
Did I miss something... Thought you took 1st place with those ribs just recently... Hi Hi ;)
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KCBS, Operation BBQ Relief |
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10-19-2018, 03:34 PM | #14 | |
is Blowin Smoke!
Join Date: 07-31-11
Location: Beaumont, CA
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Quote:
Sadly, I did not do an adequate job of replicating those ribs last weekend in Temecula
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[I][COLOR=Red][B]Green Card Q[/B][/COLOR][/I] - Pitmaster (term used loosely) KCBS MCBJ & CTC Humphrey's Long Weekender, UDS, Red Box Smoker, SJS/Tamale Pot Smoker, Weber Performer, Weber 18.5 OTS, Alton Brown Flower Pot Smoker (died), Blue Ember Gasser (died} Member of the Hall of Zero's (Noobians v. Veterans Throwdown) |
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10-22-2018, 03:07 PM | #15 |
is One Chatty Farker
Join Date: 07-05-11
Location: Pierre, SD
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I would think that it would be in the best interest of KCBS to keep the results, points etc as public as possible and allow sites like bbqdata access to an API to further dive into stats etc. That's free promotion for KCBS to have a site doing that.
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