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Competition BBQ *On Topic Only* Discussion regarding all aspects of Competition BBQ. Experiences competing or visiting, questions, getting started, Equipment, announcements of events, Results, Reviews, Planning, etc. Questions here will be responded to with competition BBQ in mind. |
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01-25-2011, 12:22 PM | #16 |
Quintessential Chatty Farker
Join Date: 11-03-06
Location: Chi-Town
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It slows teams down... what if they made the inspection at 11:00, 11:30 or at 12:30, right before pork is to be turned in?? Let's face it. This is not a perfect sport for enforcing rules. But if you put up road blocks, it stops some from cheating... Will it stop everyone? No. But a society that is built on following the rules and specifics, it doesn't make sense not to do it...
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01-25-2011, 12:34 PM | #17 |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 01-15-09
Location: Salisbury, NC & Savannah, GA
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I think it really depends on the accuracy and use of their terminology.
The info below comes from official ECE document on pork cuts. I know we're not in Europe... but the cut below sounds like a butt to me. Now I have no idea whether or not this is what Snake River is selling. (Where are the buthers when you need them?) ================================================== =============== Collar butt – Special Trim * 4245 Collar butt or butt – special trim is prepared from shoulder upper half bone in (Item 4059) by the removal of the ribs, thoracic, cervical vertebrae and the shoulder lower half. The collar butt is the dorsal portion remaining after the shoulder lower half has been removed. All bone and cartilage is removed. The skin is removed from the collar butt surface. A strip of fat is retained on the lateral surface of the cut running parallel to the dorsal edge the length of the collar butt. Specify the width and thickness of the strip of fat to be retained. To be specified: · Specify fat cover requirements · Specify fat trim level · Specify length of tail distance from eye of meat *Trade descriptions can be shown as Butt or Collar Butt – Special Trim.
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01-25-2011, 12:46 PM | #18 |
is Blowin Smoke!
Join Date: 04-14-07
Location: Lakeland Florida
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IMHO inspections are not the answer. If it's made clear at the cooks meeting that a pork collar is illegal, then would people still use it? I don't think so. Now if somebody does use it then shame on them. Cheating to win just isn't part of this sport. Stretching the rules because it's not specifically stated may be considered cheating by some and not by others.
No way to stop parting or putting pork back on. Too easy to cheat if you really wanted. Bad rule. Cuts of meat - good rule. No microwave - good rule but with trailers, motorhomes, and ezup's with 4 sides down who know what is happening. Still a good rule. If people want to cheat they will. Some day they will slip up and end up out of the sport for 2 years with their record now in question just like the steroid boys of baseball. And all you northerners need to take a vacation and come down to Florida and cook a contest just to relax.
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01-25-2011, 01:00 PM | #19 |
Babbling Farker
Join Date: 04-22-10
Location: NEW ENGLAND
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yikes!
this wasn't my intention at all. i was just unfamiliar with the cut "collar", and i glazed right over the 4#'s. but, if what scottie said is true, about ToY teams using SRF collar, then...fark.
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01-25-2011, 02:44 PM | #20 |
Take a breath!
Join Date: 02-22-08
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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How does a pork collar cook differently? Is it an advantage? The only advantage I see is one would be paying for 4 #'s of Berkshire instead of 8-9 #'s. Hmmmm..... actually after googling some pictures it looks like it's the part of the butt w/ the money muscle and no bone. I'll stick with commercial pork since the Hampshire and Berk butt's I've cooked have been excessively fatty. Slices of MM with a thick vein of fat isn't appealing to too many people.
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01-25-2011, 05:09 PM | #22 |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 12-08-09
Location: Littleton, CO
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One idea to solve things...keep meat in original packaging until the meat (and cut) has been inspected by a meat inspector. The meat inspector should also have some background in "meat". I guess there's no way to completely avoid someone from swapping out meat, but it might help.
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01-25-2011, 05:38 PM | #23 | |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 02-03-06
Location: tulsa oklahoma
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Quote:
I want to trim my meat at home. Many do.
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01-25-2011, 07:53 PM | #24 | |
is One Chatty Farker
Join Date: 10-26-04
Location: Saint Petersburg, Florida
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But if the seller specifies it as a collar then it's not a butt or a picnic and besides it's not five pounds. Anybody who uses it is cheating. This kind of creative interpretation is a real problem.
Quote:
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01-25-2011, 10:22 PM | #25 | |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 01-15-09
Location: Salisbury, NC & Savannah, GA
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Quote:
But to say that a label has to say "boston butt" ("picnic", or "whole shoulder") specifically is a bunch of whoey. I've bought butts and picnics that just said "pork shoulder" on the labels, others (butts) have said "Boston blade roast" (this one says boston, but not butt) or "pork shoulder - butt" (this one says butt, but not boston). I've also bought whole shoulders that also said "pork shoulder". Did it need to specify 'whole'? Lots of meat cut names change by region. You should go into the country with some 'good ole boys' and help slaughter hogs and hear what they are calling different cuts. As I said in the post above, I have know idea what SRF is selling. I've never bought one from them. So I'm not saying what they are selling is legal. All I'm saying is from the description of what a "collar butt" (above), that it would appear that it should be legal (if over 5 lbs) because it is just a trimmed up upper shoulder just like a "boston butt". It is part of the shoulder, not meat that is from near the shoulder.
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01-25-2011, 10:40 PM | #26 |
Full Fledged Farker
Join Date: 04-17-09
Location: Louisville, KY
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People Cheat????? Well Son Of A $%^&*@,, What is this Sport Coming Too
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01-26-2011, 05:57 AM | #27 |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 04-21-09
Location: Marietta, Ohio
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I do not plan on using them, BUT.
I would argue that the only thing that makes them illegal would be that they are under 5 lbs. You get a hold of a "pork collar" according to the description above and it's over 5 lbs it is perfectly legal. Aside from it being the very definition of a bone out boston butt, if it is any part of a whole shoulder that weighs at least 5 pounds, it's legal. We cannot "part", but we certainly can trim...as much as we want as long as we stay above 5 lbs. Doesn't matter who does the trimming.. you or the butcher.. if it was a legal piece of meat to start with and you did nothing illegal to it.. it's still legal. It is neither outside the letter or spirit of the rule. What is stamped on a package does not make a piece of meat illegal if the cut inside it is legal. As above.. I don't know exactly what SRF is selling, but if it conforms to the above description, it's only illegal because of weight.
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01-26-2011, 06:26 AM | #28 |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 07-03-07
Location: Chandler,OK
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You would be better off doing training yourself like our government will do when they train the secret service when looking for counterfeit paper money. Study the real thing and get to know it and ask questions to the owner and you (as a rep) have the right to be explained all the "why's" a piece of meat is cut the way it is to quarntee it is a butt, picnic, or whole shoulder.
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01-26-2011, 06:57 AM | #29 |
is One Chatty Farker
Join Date: 10-26-04
Location: Saint Petersburg, Florida
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I guess we just need some more rules to clear this up either way because I see it clearly but a good amount of others don't see it the same way so it must be confusing as written.
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Ray Lampe Dr. BBQ The Honey Badger of BBQ. I just don't give a sh!t. |
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01-26-2011, 07:23 AM | #30 |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 01-23-04
Location: DFW, San AntonioTx
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The rules clearly specify the legal cuts. At no point does it say "or parts thereof" or anything like that. You can cook Boston Butt, Whole Shoulder, or Picnic.
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