Brisket bombed- so did chicken...

Theresa B

Theresa B

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OK, we used a rub recipe and method from a BBQ WC's cookbook. Rub was too salty and too peppery. Cooked the brisket to 205 degrees internal, pulled off smoker and wrapped in blanket. Totally tough and totally dry. Did chicken thighs from same cookbook, seperate rub (also too peppery) and three differant sauces (also too peppery). Smoker got away from me and over cooked it, however the skin still didn't crisp up.

I can adjust how I do the chicken but the brisket has me stumped.:mad:
 
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Sorry to hear about your cook today - believe me, we have ALL been there.
I find that most rub recipies are too salty and peppery for me too so I usually cut both of those by at least half. I rarely use salt - chicken, potatos, corn... I have found a lot of really good rubs out there that work great for me so I stopped making my own.
Now on to your brisket... temperature is only half the equation. You need to look for tenderness. What kind of cooker are you using and at what temp do you cook at?
 
Where were you reading temp from? When you put the thermometer in, did it go in with no resistance like a hot knife through butter? Why was 205 a magic number?
 
Do not cook brisket by temp, you'll screw it up every time. Use the probe method that bigabyte suggests.
 
Thank you all for your replies..using an Ok Joe offset, we were trying to use Myron Mixon's recipe from his book, the 205 came from the book We were cooking at 350. I know there is some controversy there. Hubby inserted the thermo and said it had a good deal of resistance.
 
Theresa B said:
We were cooking at 350. I know there is some controversy there. Hubby inserted the thermo and said it had a good deal of resistance.
Click to expand...

That's a good cook temp for chicken but needs to be lower for the brisket (225-250).
A "good deal of resistance" means it needs to cook longer.
 
Briskets are not done until they are tender, no matter who says what temp they are done. Other than that, he's got a good record so his methods should work fine. Saying all briskets are done at 205 is just ridiculous though.
 
You really can't go by a book. The process of turning a cheap, tough piece of meat like brisket into tender, juicy goodness happens when it wants to happen -- and it takes time.

I have never done "hot and fast" brisket, so I can't comment on that. Brisket is a real challenge, and in my personal experience, the brisket needs to hit a certain temperature, where the connective tissue starts to break down, and then it needs to have enough time to complete that process. That may happen at 185, or may not happen until well over 200.

Also, what do you mean by, wrapped it in a blanket?" I wrap mine in foil and stuff it in a cooler, with towels stacked on top of the foil-wrapped meat to fill up the empty space when I rest my meats. What, exactly, did you do?

Again, brisket is not easy -- at least not for ordinary cooks like me. It is more art than science, IMO. Don't give up.

CD
 
@Casey- brisket was in an aluminum pan covered in foil the we wrapped it in a blanket to keep it at temp until we were ready for it.

I'm still a little confused...if it can be tender at 185 or 200+ is the probe method trully the best method to tell if it's done? So start probing at 185?
 
Theresa B said:
@Casey- brisket was in an aluminum pan covered in foil the we wrapped it in a blanket to keep it at temp until we were ready for it.

I'm still a little confused...if it can be tender at 185 or 200+ is the probe method trully the best method to tell if it's done? So start probing at 185?
Click to expand...

Yep - I start probing around 190 or so.
 
Sorry to hear about your disappointment

I found every off the shelf rub to be too salty or just full of paprika and other spices I don't care for. I just scour for homemade rubs and don't add salt in the rub but I add it on the meat directly and found it is perfect since I control what is going on the meat. YMMV though.

I still haven't done a brisket so I'm a little intimidated but looking forward to the end result no matter how bad it may turn out.
 
Theresa B said:
I'm still a little confused...if it can be tender at 185 or 200+ is the probe method trully the best method to tell if it's done? So start probing at 185?
Click to expand...
Exactly!:thumb: Brisket becomes tender and juicy when the collagen in it breaks down into gelatin. There is not the same amount of collagen in each brisket, and the conversion of collagen to gelatin is based on a combination of heat, moisture and time. Any change in these three variables can cause a difference in the time it takes to get there or the temp at which it all breaks down and becomes tender. This is why briskets are not done at a specific temp, because one that does not have as much collagen to begin with may break down and get tender at 190 while another might take until 205.

I'm going to guess that with Myron cooking at high heat and wrapping, he is expecting the temp to ride out and finish the brisket, but obviously, this won't work every time. In this particular case it never got done. In another case, it might get overcooked and be too tender and fall apart on you.
 
Theressa.......................;}-

Here's how I do a Brisket,first I spread CBP/S all over the Brisky just before placing it in a 220-225*f ,heated smoker.I use small hand size chunks to feed when I see a temp. drop of 10*-20*f(I know,a lopt of a$$ time,but well worth it).I leave the meat in the CLOSED-no peeky for 1.5hrs. heat to weighti.e.=10#in for 15hrs. I know,it's a pain but babysitting your brisket will yeild a better piece of meat.
I know you opened it several times and wasted a lot of BTU's,seeing if it was doing well-well,it will if you let the atmosphere in the pit closed.No one is going to sneak up and get it,and it won't walk away.Just be patient and when you near the prescribed time,then open and check.The smell should give a hint and keeping that constant heat on it will give a great Bark.
Betty014.jpg

When doing a bunch,I average the time and go from there;the seceret is in the "PATIENCE":rolleyes: Hot and fast might be for some of the instant gratification smokers,but as for me,I'll sit and enjoy my company and let it melt down.
Good luck and ...
 
I'm with you on the salt Theresa. Here is a wet rub I use not only with brisket, but with any big hunk of beef, including whole short ribs.

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]3 TBSP dark brown sugar, packed
2 TBSP paprika
1 TBSP cayenne pepper
1 TBSP table salt
1 TBSP onion powder[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]
1 TBSP freshly ground black pepper
1 TBSP ground cumin
1/2 tsp granulated garlic
4 TBSP Worcestershire sauce
1 TBSP Tabasco sauce[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]Combine all ingredients thoroughly to form a thick paste. The amount of liquid ingredients can be adjusted to achieve the desired consistency. Substitute 3-4 cloves of crushed fresh garlic for the granulated garlic if you like.[/FONT]
 
There is not single method or technique that will yield perfect BBQ. You can cook a brisket at 350F and it can be made tender assuming you understand the collagen equation Bigabyte referred to as well as have the attention to cook at a higher temperature. I have now been using the 'hot and fast' method for brisket over a couple of years and many briskets. It still takes patience to get through the stall, however, everything happens a little (or a lot) faster once you get through the stall in particular. You have received the information you need above though. Even at higher temps, the key is that a skewer or thermometer probe slides in with very little resistance.

As for rubs, I am more sensitive to pepper and salt than many, I have my own recipes but, the key is thickness of application. For brisket, I prefer a recipe that looks something like this.

1 part medium grind black pepper
1 part kosher salt (must be kosher salt for proportions to work right)
1/4 part each of chile powder, paprika, herb mix (I use Todd's Dirt), dry mustard

Note that there is no sugar, no exotic herbs and no odd ingredients that cannot be found most anywhere.
 
plenty of great commercial rubs out there.
Most are best sprinkled rather than caked on.
Remember it's just a layer of flava.
 
Just remember you got this under your belt, you've learned a lot, and can use that knowledge next time - that's how it goes for all of us! :thumb: Keep at it and I know for a fact you will get to where you want to be with it! :thumb:
 
when probing the brisket, i prefer a butter knife to a thermometer probe. for me, the probe was small enough that it sometime gave me a false "feel". with the butter knife, it's larger and i've had better results.
 
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