KCBS Judging

bigjonsBBQ · 04-18-2011, 07:57 PM

Hey Everyone. I have been playing around with rubs and sauces, and also have searched the net, but I wanted to get firsthand experience, is sweet the way to go? I have read some like very sweet, with a little heat, others not soo sweet. I am guessing it is all per judge, even though the classes are supposed to show exactly what to look for. I have looked to take a class, but have not found any yet in the NJ area.

Any insight from competitors and/or judges would be appreciated.

NRA4Life · 04-18-2011, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjonsBBQ

even though the classes are supposed to show exactly what to look for.

You're off base here, the CBJ class does not tell the judge what they are supposed to look for regarding taste. The tenderness/texture of the meat is covered, but the taste is purely subjective.

bigjonsBBQ · 04-18-2011, 08:04 PM

Thanks NRA4Life, so when it comes to taste, it comes down purely to what the head cook wants to send in, whether sweet, heat, etc?

Arlin_MacRae · 04-18-2011, 08:14 PM

The way I was taught, the sauces and spices had to 'enhance the meat'. You didn't have to like it, even, but we all know if you were to spring an Alabama white sauce on an all-Texan judging crew, you'd probably not fair too well...

Alexa RnQ · 04-18-2011, 08:15 PM

Yes and no. It is supposed to be judged on its own merits -- if it is a great example of its kind, it should be rewarded.

BUT
If the head cook likes "spicy", and his idea of spicy is the judge's idea of "tastebud inferno", there's going to be trouble.

The idea is to find a unique profile that agrees with many palates.

NRA4Life · 04-18-2011, 08:40 PM

You want to "offend" the least amount of judges with your unique flavor profile at whatever random table your box hits while impressing them at the same time. But yes, whatever the head cook decides to send in as their entry that day, spicy, sweet, salty, etc.... Of course the same entry at different competitions could go from first to worst, due to no fault of the competition team...The scores you could receive even at the same table can have incredible variance as well. Good Luck!

bigjonsBBQ · 04-18-2011, 08:47 PM

Thanks everyone. For some reason, I was under the impression that a CBJ class also gives you a "flavor profile" to look for when items are turned in at a KCBS event.

I think I will go with what I have had, lil sweet with just barely a touch of heat. My 1st competition this upcoming May will only be my 3rd ever, hopefully, I can learn a lot more the more I do.

Hub · 04-19-2011, 07:49 AM

There is no such thing as a "flavor profile" and KCBS issues no standards for taste. The current trend is toward sweet but, like everything, that can be overdone. BALANCE is the name of the game. Judges should look for an entry to have a pleasing combination of flavor provided by the meat and smoke, the rub and the sauce (and injection or mop if used). No one thing should dominate. Easy to say and very hard to do!

Lake Dogs · 04-19-2011, 08:22 AM

^^^ +1

ModelMaker · 04-19-2011, 11:17 AM

Figuring out peoples tastes is a constant evolving moving target. There is no permanent flavor profile. It's not a sweet sauce, it's not a spicy sauce, it's nothing everytime.
You put it on a meat I taste it and give you my opinion with a numbered score.
It's just that easy.
Ed
P.S. All that being said, why do the top teams usally find their way to the top?

MoKanMeathead · 04-19-2011, 12:24 PM

I sort of agree with Hub above, although I'm not sure "current trend" is accurate. I would say that (at least around KC) that sweet has worked for a long time and I'm not sure it will change soon.

In addition to the above, I would say that many judges confuse or intertwine tenderness and taste. Many of our enteries score very similar or the same in both taste and tenderness. I think tenderness is equally as important as taste, even though officially taste is about twice as important. I am not judge bashing here...some of my best friends are judges!

04-18-2011, 07:57 PM	#1
bigjonsBBQ On the road to being a farker Join Date: 03-08-11 Location: Edison, NJ	KCBS Judging Hey Everyone. I have been playing around with rubs and sauces, and also have searched the net, but I wanted to get firsthand experience, is sweet the way to go? I have read some like very sweet, with a little heat, others not soo sweet. I am guessing it is all per judge, even though the classes are supposed to show exactly what to look for. I have looked to take a class, but have not found any yet in the NJ area. Any insight from competitors and/or judges would be appreciated. __________________ Big Jon Bubba Grills 250 Reverse Flow Backwoods Party Chargriller Offset [COLOR=Black]Maverick [/COLOR]PT100 Pen Maverick ET-732 Maverick ET-73 Late Night Hoggers Competition BBQ Team [URL="http://www.bigjonsbbq.com"]www.bigjonsbbq.com[/URL]

04-18-2011, 08:04 PM	#3
bigjonsBBQ On the road to being a farker Join Date: 03-08-11 Location: Edison, NJ	Thanks NRA4Life, so when it comes to taste, it comes down purely to what the head cook wants to send in, whether sweet, heat, etc? __________________ Big Jon Bubba Grills 250 Reverse Flow Backwoods Party Chargriller Offset [COLOR=Black]Maverick [/COLOR]PT100 Pen Maverick ET-732 Maverick ET-73 Late Night Hoggers Competition BBQ Team [URL="http://www.bigjonsbbq.com"]www.bigjonsbbq.com[/URL]

04-18-2011, 08:14 PM	#4
Arlin_MacRae somebody shut me the fark up. Join Date: 04-14-04 Location: Choctaw, OK	The way I was taught, the sauces and spices had to 'enhance the meat'. You didn't have to like it, even, but we all know if you were to spring an Alabama white sauce on an all-Texan judging crew, you'd probably not fair too well... __________________ Arlin MacRae Primo Oval Junior, Traeger Model 075 Pellet Pooper, Big Chief, Kingfisher Kooker 14" gas/wood combo, PBC Brethren Edition, Pit Boss NASCAR Tailgater Home Brewer, Murderer of Squirrels, Armadillo Inspector Flaming Pig Head Mod Certified KCBS Master BBQ Judge

04-18-2011, 08:15 PM	#5
Alexa RnQ is Blowin Smoke! Join Date: 09-12-07 Location: the Ninth Ring of Hell, cleverly disguised as Phoenix	Yes and no. It is supposed to be judged on its own merits -- if it is a great example of its kind, it should be rewarded. BUT If the head cook likes "spicy", and his idea of spicy is the judge's idea of "tastebud inferno", there's going to be trouble. The idea is to find a unique profile that agrees with many palates. __________________ . Don't practice until you get it right; practice until you can't get it wrong. Don't overthink or undercook. [url=http://www.rhythmnque.com]Rhythm 'n QUE[/url]

04-18-2011, 08:40 PM	#6
NRA4Life is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 07-07-09 Location: Newark, OH	You want to "offend" the least amount of judges with your unique flavor profile at whatever random table your box hits while impressing them at the same time. But yes, whatever the head cook decides to send in as their entry that day, spicy, sweet, salty, etc.... Of course the same entry at different competitions could go from first to worst, due to no fault of the competition team...The scores you could receive even at the same table can have incredible variance as well. Good Luck! __________________ - [B]Kevin[/B] Team: [B]Smitty's Real Pit BBQ[/B] KCBS CBJ [B]Superior SS-3[/B] - Courtesy of Gainesville Jaycees and Superior Smokers Custom Built Reverse Flow Stickburner [B]Weber[/B] 22.5" WSM [B]Weber[/B] 26.75" OTG [B]Weber[/B] Blue 2000 Stainless Performer [B]Weber[/B] Red 1998 Stainless Performer

04-18-2011, 08:47 PM	#7
bigjonsBBQ On the road to being a farker Join Date: 03-08-11 Location: Edison, NJ	Thanks everyone. For some reason, I was under the impression that a CBJ class also gives you a "flavor profile" to look for when items are turned in at a KCBS event. I think I will go with what I have had, lil sweet with just barely a touch of heat. My 1st competition this upcoming May will only be my 3rd ever, hopefully, I can learn a lot more the more I do. __________________ Big Jon Bubba Grills 250 Reverse Flow Backwoods Party Chargriller Offset [COLOR=Black]Maverick [/COLOR]PT100 Pen Maverick ET-732 Maverick ET-73 Late Night Hoggers Competition BBQ Team [URL="http://www.bigjonsbbq.com"]www.bigjonsbbq.com[/URL]

04-19-2011, 07:49 AM	#8
Hub Full Fledged Farker Join Date: 09-01-10 Location: Lincolnton, NC	There is no such thing as a "flavor profile" and KCBS issues no standards for taste. The current trend is toward sweet but, like everything, that can be overdone. BALANCE is the name of the game. Judges should look for an entry to have a pleasing combination of flavor provided by the meat and smoke, the rub and the sauce (and injection or mop if used). No one thing should dominate. Easy to say and very hard to do! __________________ [FONT=Impact][SIZE=3][COLOR=red]Committed Pellethead[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] KCBS MCBJ & CTC Memphis Advantage NOS American Made Traeger 075 Weber Performer Author of [I][FONT=Times New Roman]Burn It In The Back Yard[/FONT][/I] Grillin' and Smokin' like crazy for over 40 years :whoo: [COLOR=red][I]There's No Smoke Alarm In My Outdoor Kitchen![/I][/COLOR]

04-19-2011, 08:22 AM	#9
Lake Dogs Quintessential Chatty Farker Join Date: 07-14-09 Location: Lake Sinclair, GA Name/Nickname : Hance	^^^ +1 __________________ Hance - MiM/MBN/GBA CBJ and comp cook Lake Sinclair, GA (strategically about an hour from darn near anywhere) My competition daze are probably behind me now; I pretty much cook for family, friends, and frankly the peace and solitude I get from smokin' on an offset... Was Lang 84DX, now Bubba Grills 250R and many Weber grills

04-19-2011, 11:17 AM	#10
ModelMaker Quintessential Chatty Farker Join Date: 04-21-06 Location: Lake Ponderosa-Montezuma, IA	Figuring out peoples tastes is a constant evolving moving target. There is no permanent flavor profile. It's not a sweet sauce, it's not a spicy sauce, it's nothing everytime. You put it on a meat I taste it and give you my opinion with a numbered score. It's just that easy. Ed P.S. All that being said, why do the top teams usally find their way to the top? __________________ Designer of a custom drum smoker Customized Aussie gas passer Turkey fryer Extremely seasoned hand hammered Wok Pit Boss-HART BURN Competition BBQ Team KCBS certified judge And Your not the boss of me either!!

04-19-2011, 12:24 PM	#11
MoKanMeathead is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 05-02-05 Location: Grain Valley, MO	I sort of agree with Hub above, although I'm not sure "current trend" is accurate. I would say that (at least around KC) that sweet has worked for a long time and I'm not sure it will change soon. In addition to the above, I would say that many judges confuse or intertwine tenderness and taste. Many of our enteries score very similar or the same in both taste and tenderness. I think tenderness is equally as important as taste, even though officially taste is about twice as important. I am not judge bashing here...some of my best friends are judges!

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