Stickburners and reverse flow smoker help!

Smokin Turkey · 03-10-2010, 06:38 AM

I'm building a reverse flow with some new innovations to make better use of the space available and the heat being generated. I need some help from you guys out there with stick burners and hopefully anyone with a reverse flow stick burner like a lang or meadow creek.

I have some guesses as to what the exhaust temp will be in relation to the chamber temp but I wanted to see if anyone has either ever checked it or could check it on their next "Q."

I'm looking to add something which I can explain better later but I need to see what is involved and temp is a concern. I would most often run the pit 220-250 most often or at least when this "MOD" is in operation.

All help is appreciated!

kickassbbq · 03-10-2010, 08:06 AM

Just exactly where do you want that temp taken? Near the exhaust?
I could take some temps for you on March 20th. That will be the next time I crank my 84.

Divemaster · 03-10-2010, 08:31 AM

Yea, let me know where you want the temps taken and I'll do it this weekend...

I'm assuming that you want to know what the temps are in other areas of the cooker as well... Just let us know where....

barbefunkoramaque · 03-10-2010, 09:54 AM

I can take temps on my Brazos which has twins on the week of the 15th as I will be doing so with a full load.

PM me with details. If its a holding Box I made on on a pit like the Brazos which used the heat from the stacks PLUS a valve that bypassed hotter gasses directly from the firebox through the box... it even had a forced outside air fan as well for cold smoking. I could do anything from fish to pizza in that farker.

deguerre · 03-10-2010, 09:56 AM

Shouldn't this be in Q-talk? Seems like a legitimate Q&A thread.

Arlin_MacRae · 03-10-2010, 10:02 AM

Yep. Moved.

Smokin Turkey · 03-10-2010, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arlin_MacRae

Yep. Moved.

Thanks! Wasn't sure since it could have been seen as possibly commercial.

Anyway, If you could take the temp of the gasses leaving the stack and if possible, the temp of the metal stack. I'm anticipating in a chamber say at 230F, the exhaust should be within +/- 10F. The stack may end up being 210 which still would work well for this MOD.

I'm going to begin building my pit very soon as I finally was able to find a donor propane tank (a free 100lb) which gives me a chamber to start with roughly 14.5" x 46". I probably will keep it to one rack inside and concentrate on all my add-ons from a custom logo sign, grates, counter weight and latches, possibly a prep sink and some other stuff.

I know it seems small which works for my needs right now. Just barely large enough to compete on, large enough to get more than a few racks of ribs or butts even a couple briskets, and small enough to either make it towable or able to slip into my motorcycle trailer. It's a dual purpose - show off my products and building skills and finally make myself a pit!

barbefunkoramaque · 03-10-2010, 02:37 PM

Oh I am out then. I am doing pork butts and will be rushing them at 250-270 degrees. If I was doing brisket where I set the ring at 220 for a coupel of hours I'd me glad to do it. Let me know if my temp will work though.

Divemaster · 03-10-2010, 03:29 PM

Not a problem, I'm planning on doing a 25# ham and about 50# of Chuckies around the 225 mark... I'll try to get you the temps you need...

barbefunkoramaque · 03-10-2010, 03:33 PM

yeah I have a 100 ham order but I am not doin hams until april 31 . i am doing them at the 225-230 mark though

Smokin Turkey · 03-10-2010, 05:29 PM

Really any temp would work as long as I know the chamber temps also so I can get a basis for how the 2 numbers (or 3 if I also get the stack steel temp also) work together. I'm looking to build a water heater MOD and the stack seems like the best place to get a temp safe for the water. I dont want to generate steam. I'm figuring if I build a manifold and wrap about 4 - 1/4" copper pipes around the stack it would give me ample hot water for a prep-station. I'm looking at how to use copper wrapper around the steel stack and not suffer from the corrosion caused by electrolisis. I'm also trying to decide if I should go with a storage tank (6-15 gallons) and a small rv water pump (1.5 gal per min) and make it also with a stepdown pressure regulator like in an RV so I could also plug in a water source. Just thoughts I've had in this build.

Any thoughts are welcome and I already know this is going way overboard when getting something like a coleman on demand hot water is available and simple but then that isnt fun!

barbefunkoramaque · 03-10-2010, 05:47 PM

Oh, well I can save you some time... stacks will not produce the heat neccesary to give you water at a temp a health dept is gonna want to pass. If they do you are gonna spend more in winds than just going for the firebox heat.

You need what I built on my Perseverance long ago. I had maybe 4-5 black pipe sleeves welded through the firebox to act as protection for the copper inserts going through it. A pump to re-circulate it. I have seen some attached to the sides of fireboxes with steel sheets protecting them and no heat exchanger. The system wasn't "closed" as you just filled a
reservoir and it recycles the water. Water to the tap is gravity fed.

I think maybe I had a 10 gallon reservoir but could have uses more.

I did a test once on the Funkotorium to see how many windings (I tossed some rolled copper tube in the firebox with my on demand pump rounded to it) to see if I could meet the demands of my shower, bath, kitchen and everything from only a cold water supply (this means that unlike the example above the water would not recirulate until it got hot.

It suprisingly was extremely hot even with the pit at only 250 Chamber degrees (remember it was from the firebox I had the coils connected to)

I could get hot water just as fast as with the orginal heater (which came with the camper and was burned out). I addition, is was hot enough to HEAT the camper as well, but I could not cofirm before I sold it whether it woudl do both.

Finally, I also connected a 12 recirculating pump to the same coils and ran them through a BOAT hot water heater (some Motor Campers have these too) and was able to heat water by running it through the heat transfer routing. I did need a blow valve for that one but antifreeze helped. Motor campers and boats get heat from the engine to make hot water while underway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smokin Turkey

Really any temp would work as long as I know the chamber temps also so I can get a basis for how the 2 numbers (or 3 if I also get the stack steel temp also) work together. I'm looking to build a water heater MOD and the stack seems like the best place to get a temp safe for the water. I dont want to generate steam. I'm figuring if I build a manifold and wrap about 4 - 1/4" copper pipes around the stack it would give me ample hot water for a prep-station. I'm looking at how to use copper wrapper around the steel stack and not suffer from the corrosion caused by electrolisis. I'm also trying to decide if I should go with a storage tank (6-15 gallons) and a small rv water pump (1.5 gal per min) and make it also with a stepdown pressure regulator like in an RV so I could also plug in a water source. Just thoughts I've had in this build.

Any thoughts are welcome and I already know this is going way overboard when getting something like a coleman on demand hot water is available and simple but then that isnt fun!

Smokin Turkey · 03-11-2010, 12:32 AM

I can respect your opinion on the thought that the stack would not provide enough heat transfer as I have my doubts also but a serious concern with using the heat from the firebox directly (through copper tubes protected by steel) would be from scaling inside due to the increased amount of heat and water at events and from my tap would be enough mineral content to scale. Also the potential to cause steam or scalding water when not in use. Steam could cause a major problem in itself from burns to an explosion.

I looked again at a few things from a few dept of health websites and all of them seem to say a hand washing station hot water temp needs to be set no higher than 110F. If I am relying on low pressure from a 12v rv pump or even a gravity fed system, the boiling temp in the system will be between 212F and 220F. If the water sits in the coil wrapped tightly on the stack possibly suspended also in a neutral PH solution to help transfer the heat better to the copper, and the water is slowed by the use of either going to a larger pipe size for the heat exchanger or a few of the same size at the exchanger inlet, the possibility for a low flow heat transfer for small volumes of water being heated to a suitable temp should be achievable.

I'm definitely not saying "screw you, im doing it anyway" but I think with having the soft copper laying around here and doing a new build anyway, this really can't hurt to try.

One last reason I wouldnt want to use the direct heat from the firebox is I planned to use the top of the box to pre-heat my lumber and also use the heat when warming foods or boiling water in pans. I love having the large, flat top to use as a makeshift stove! I used the firebox of a guys pit at a comp last year to cook my breakfast on a pan and used my mini smoker to melt butter and caramelize butter. I can't wait to have this completed although I am looking forward to the build itself!

Smokin Turkey · 03-11-2010, 07:11 AM

Gawd i was tired last night when I typed that! I meant melt butter and caramelize onions! lol.

Derek · 03-11-2010, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barbefunkoramaque

I can take temps on my Brazos which has twins on the week of the 15th as I will be doing so with a full load.

PM me with details. If its a holding Box I made on on a pit like the Brazos which used the heat from the stacks PLUS a valve that bypassed hotter gasses directly from the firebox through the box... it even had a forced outside air fan as well for cold smoking. I could do anything from fish to pizza in that farker.

Drolling on the awesome smoker.

03-10-2010, 06:38 AM	#1
Smokin Turkey is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 07-28-08 Location: Huntingdon, PA	Stickburners and reverse flow smoker help! I'm building a reverse flow with some new innovations to make better use of the space available and the heat being generated. I need some help from you guys out there with stick burners and hopefully anyone with a reverse flow stick burner like a lang or meadow creek. I have some guesses as to what the exhaust temp will be in relation to the chamber temp but I wanted to see if anyone has either ever checked it or could check it on their next "Q." I'm looking to add something which I can explain better later but I need to see what is involved and temp is a concern. I would most often run the pit 220-250 most often or at least when this "MOD" is in operation. All help is appreciated! __________________ Cooking for the love of it.

03-10-2010, 08:06 AM	#2
kickassbbq is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 10-20-05 Location: mn	Just exactly where do you want that temp taken? Near the exhaust? I could take some temps for you on March 20th. That will be the next time I crank my 84. __________________ Smoke On!!!!!! [URL="http://www.kickassbbq.com"]www.kickassbbq.com[/URL]

03-10-2010, 08:31 AM	#3
Divemaster somebody shut me the fark up. Join Date: 09-23-07 Location: North Side of Chicago Illinois	Yea, let me know where you want the temps taken and I'll do it this weekend... I'm assuming that you want to know what the temps are in other areas of the cooker as well... Just let us know where.... __________________ Jeff CBJ# 23376 Stockcar BBQ Race Fast, Cook Slow, and Enjoy Life! If it don't come off a smoker, it's just a side dish! Lang 60 Patio (The Mistress), Black Stainless Lang 36 (Little Princess), Large BGE (Ramona), Big Green UDS (Cottage Cooker), Brinkman SnP Pro (Little Bubba-Retired), 8 Burner Gasser, 3 - 22.5" & 1 - 18" (circa 1975) Weber Grills, & a Weber Smoky Joe.

03-10-2010, 09:54 AM	#4
barbefunkoramaque Babbling Farker Join Date: 11-11-07 Location: Gone	I can take temps on my Brazos which has twins on the week of the 15th as I will be doing so with a full load. PM me with details. If its a holding Box I made on on a pit like the Brazos which used the heat from the stacks PLUS a valve that bypassed hotter gasses directly from the firebox through the box... it even had a forced outside air fan as well for cold smoking. I could do anything from fish to pizza in that farker. __________________ Popdaddy is Dead - 1933-2011 - Pitmaster T is a free agent Last edited by barbefunkoramaque; 04-03-2011 at 02:31 PM..

03-10-2010, 09:56 AM	#5
deguerre somebody shut me the fark up. Join Date: 07-15-09 Location: Memphis, TN...Formerly of Decatur, AL	Shouldn't this be in Q-talk? Seems like a legitimate Q&A thread. __________________ Guerry [FONT=Book Antiqua]Pit Beeatch for Team Munchkin[/FONT] [FONT=Book Antiqua][B]Avatar by Northwest BBQ [/B][/FONT]"...In nature, there are predators. I believe the common denominator of the universe is not harmony, but chaos, hostility and murder..." Werner Herzog

03-10-2010, 10:02 AM	#6
Arlin_MacRae somebody shut me the fark up. Join Date: 04-14-04 Location: Choctaw, OK	Yep. Moved. __________________ Arlin MacRae Primo Oval Junior, Traeger Model 075 Pellet Pooper, Big Chief, Kingfisher Kooker 14" gas/wood combo, PBC Brethren Edition, Pit Boss NASCAR Tailgater Home Brewer, Murderer of Squirrels, Armadillo Inspector Flaming Pig Head Mod Certified KCBS Master BBQ Judge

03-10-2010, 02:37 PM	#8
barbefunkoramaque Babbling Farker Join Date: 11-11-07 Location: Gone	Oh I am out then. I am doing pork butts and will be rushing them at 250-270 degrees. If I was doing brisket where I set the ring at 220 for a coupel of hours I'd me glad to do it. Let me know if my temp will work though. __________________ Popdaddy is Dead - 1933-2011 - Pitmaster T is a free agent

03-10-2010, 03:29 PM	#9
Divemaster somebody shut me the fark up. Join Date: 09-23-07 Location: North Side of Chicago Illinois	Not a problem, I'm planning on doing a 25# ham and about 50# of Chuckies around the 225 mark... I'll try to get you the temps you need... __________________ Jeff CBJ# 23376 Stockcar BBQ Race Fast, Cook Slow, and Enjoy Life! If it don't come off a smoker, it's just a side dish! Lang 60 Patio (The Mistress), Black Stainless Lang 36 (Little Princess), Large BGE (Ramona), Big Green UDS (Cottage Cooker), Brinkman SnP Pro (Little Bubba-Retired), 8 Burner Gasser, 3 - 22.5" & 1 - 18" (circa 1975) Weber Grills, & a Weber Smoky Joe.

03-10-2010, 03:33 PM	#10
barbefunkoramaque Babbling Farker Join Date: 11-11-07 Location: Gone	yeah I have a 100 ham order but I am not doin hams until april 31 . i am doing them at the 225-230 mark though __________________ Popdaddy is Dead - 1933-2011 - Pitmaster T is a free agent

03-10-2010, 05:29 PM	#11
Smokin Turkey is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 07-28-08 Location: Huntingdon, PA	Really any temp would work as long as I know the chamber temps also so I can get a basis for how the 2 numbers (or 3 if I also get the stack steel temp also) work together. I'm looking to build a water heater MOD and the stack seems like the best place to get a temp safe for the water. I dont want to generate steam. I'm figuring if I build a manifold and wrap about 4 - 1/4" copper pipes around the stack it would give me ample hot water for a prep-station. I'm looking at how to use copper wrapper around the steel stack and not suffer from the corrosion caused by electrolisis. I'm also trying to decide if I should go with a storage tank (6-15 gallons) and a small rv water pump (1.5 gal per min) and make it also with a stepdown pressure regulator like in an RV so I could also plug in a water source. Just thoughts I've had in this build. Any thoughts are welcome and I already know this is going way overboard when getting something like a coleman on demand hot water is available and simple but then that isnt fun! __________________ Cooking for the love of it.

03-11-2010, 12:32 AM	#13
Smokin Turkey is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 07-28-08 Location: Huntingdon, PA	I can respect your opinion on the thought that the stack would not provide enough heat transfer as I have my doubts also but a serious concern with using the heat from the firebox directly (through copper tubes protected by steel) would be from scaling inside due to the increased amount of heat and water at events and from my tap would be enough mineral content to scale. Also the potential to cause steam or scalding water when not in use. Steam could cause a major problem in itself from burns to an explosion. I looked again at a few things from a few dept of health websites and all of them seem to say a hand washing station hot water temp needs to be set no higher than 110F. If I am relying on low pressure from a 12v rv pump or even a gravity fed system, the boiling temp in the system will be between 212F and 220F. If the water sits in the coil wrapped tightly on the stack possibly suspended also in a neutral PH solution to help transfer the heat better to the copper, and the water is slowed by the use of either going to a larger pipe size for the heat exchanger or a few of the same size at the exchanger inlet, the possibility for a low flow heat transfer for small volumes of water being heated to a suitable temp should be achievable. I'm definitely not saying "screw you, im doing it anyway" but I think with having the soft copper laying around here and doing a new build anyway, this really can't hurt to try. One last reason I wouldnt want to use the direct heat from the firebox is I planned to use the top of the box to pre-heat my lumber and also use the heat when warming foods or boiling water in pans. I love having the large, flat top to use as a makeshift stove! I used the firebox of a guys pit at a comp last year to cook my breakfast on a pan and used my mini smoker to melt butter and caramelize butter. I can't wait to have this completed although I am looking forward to the build itself! __________________ Cooking for the love of it.

03-11-2010, 07:11 AM	#14
Smokin Turkey is One Chatty Farker Join Date: 07-28-08 Location: Huntingdon, PA	Gawd i was tired last night when I typed that! I meant melt butter and caramelize onions! lol. __________________ Cooking for the love of it.