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Q-talk *ON TOPIC ONLY* QUALITY ON TOPIC discussion of Backyard BBQ, grilling, equipment and outdoor cookin' . ** Other cooking techniques are welcomed for when your cookin' in the kitchen. Post your hints, tips, tricks & techniques, success, failures, but stay on topic and watch for that hijacking. |
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11-22-2010, 10:46 PM | #1 |
Babbling Farker
Join Date: 05-04-08
Location: Boise, Idaho
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To Brine Or Not To Brine? (illustration)
To Brine Or Not To Brine?
Being turkey season, the internet is seriously abuzz at this time of year with folks who are investigating the notion of brining their holiday bird. It seems people are on a seemingly never-ending quest for a better bird. The common refrain from people I talk to is, "So, what's the deal with this brining thing? Does it really make that big of a difference?" In this post I hope to help explain why brining really is a very good thing indeed. Let's face it, most of us probably grew up eating holiday turkey that was dry and generally lacking in the flavor department. I think this is why my grandfather always shunned the balsa-wood-like white meat for the far more moist and flavorful dark stuff. To this day I am firmly in the dark meat camp, but I digress. Brining is all about pure science, but it's certainly not rocket surgery. Let's break it down and, as a favorite preacher of mine often said, put the cookies on the shelf where the kiddies can get to them. The entire process of brining can be described by the scientific axiom that nature abhors a vacuum. When you submerge meat in a solution of water, salt and sugar, you have created a vacuum that nature simply must remedy. See, nature likes to have things in a nice balance called equilibrium. She doesn't like you gumming up the works. You've created an imbalance where the concentration of the water, salt and sugar outside the meat is much higher than that inside the meat. Given this situation, nature goes to work trying to reestablish its required equilibrium. The cells inside the meat are surrounded by a semi-permeable membrane. Small molecules like water, salt, and sugar can pass through this membrane, but larger molecules like proteins cannot. Through a process of osmosis by diffusion, the cell moves water, salt and sugar in and out of the cells trying to get things back into balance with the surrounding liquid. Also, since most brines contain flavorings in the solution, the cell unwittingly seasons itself as it allows the brine into the cells. But wait, there's more. As the salt in the cell increases, it causes some of the tightly-wound proteins to unravel, or denature, and relax a bit. This allows the cell to take on even more of the solution. Some proteins in the cell actually denature completely and are liquefied. Here's a crude illustration that I've drawn to show what I've described. The magic of brining continues during cooking. When the meat is heated, the proteins bind with one another and squeeze out moisture. However, brining adds 10% or more moisture weight to the meat. So, even though the cooking will cause a 20% weight loss in moisture, we started 10% or more ahead of the game, so the actual moisture loss is cut in half, resulting in more moist meat. Also, remember those proteins that were completely denatured? Well, those proteins are no longer available to do the protein-binding mambo, so the meat is more tender. I hope this gives you a better understanding of how brining works, and why it's a wonderful way to let nature help you cook a much better bird. Tips:
John |
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11-22-2010, 11:05 PM | #2 |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 01-21-10
Location: Denver, NC
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Thanks John, I'm trying your brine this year for the bird I'm smoking. Good post by the way.
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[B][COLOR=black]Bill[/COLOR][/B] [COLOR=black][COLOR=red][B]Red[/B][/COLOR] [/COLOR]Performer 1993 Green Performer 1998 22.5 OTG 22.5 OTS UDS Mini WSM Super Fast [COLOR=red][B]Red[/B][/COLOR] Thermapen :thumb: [B]Got butt ? Smoke it !![/B] |
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11-23-2010, 06:53 AM | #3 |
Knows what a fatty is.
Join Date: 09-28-10
Location: katy, tx
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thanks!! nice explanation - reminds me of Alton Brown's approach of things
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UDS: http://www.flickr.com/photos/54510022@N04/ - Gasser: Model BQ06042-1 |
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11-23-2010, 09:06 AM | #4 |
Got Wood.
Join Date: 01-31-10
Location: Prosper, TX
Name/Nickname : Jeff
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Thank You! Count me in as another first time briner this year.
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BGE |
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11-23-2010, 09:50 AM | #5 |
Full Fledged Farker
Join Date: 02-28-10
Location: Houston, TX
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In the words of Chef....chilren..looks like a bunch a voodoo hoocha-ma-fudge...
BTW, nice explanation.
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Bowl Bound and B-B-Q-in! Sic Em Bears! |
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11-23-2010, 10:12 AM | #6 |
On the road to being a farker
Join Date: 01-18-10
Location: Tustin, CA
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OK- Here's a question:
If you are using an enhanced bird, why cut the salt content in half? Afterall, you are just seeking an equilibrium. In fact, cutting the salt content in half may just drive the equilibrium in the other direction (i.e. salt and water in the cells flow outside). This year we happen to have a bird that is enhanced with an 8% solution, so I'm not sure whether I should brine or not. Lots of conflicting info out there. I agree with your equilibrium hypothesis, but if that is the case, it shouldn't matter if your bird is enhanced or not. All it would mean is that less salt/water would get into the bird since equilibrium would be acheived earler. What do you think? |
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11-23-2010, 10:37 AM | #7 | |
Babbling Farker
Join Date: 05-04-08
Location: Boise, Idaho
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Quote:
John |
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11-23-2010, 11:06 AM | #8 |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 01-14-06
Location: At home on the range in Wyoming
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From a long time briner, or brinist... or one that brines..... Great information in this thread, and the linked one discussing brining an enhanced bird.
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~thirdeye~ Barbecuist ~ Charcuterist ~ KCBS Master Judge & CTC Big Green Eggs, Big Drum Smokers, Big Chiefs, Weber Smokey Joe "Custom Tall Boy" Oil Patch Horizontal, SnS Deluxe Kettle Visit my Cookin' Site by clicking HERE Barbecue is not rocket surgery “The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it's hard to verify their authenticity” ~ Abraham Lincoln
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11-23-2010, 11:12 AM | #9 |
somebody shut me the fark up.
Join Date: 06-05-09
Location: Mooresville, IN
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Thanks for the post. You explain it MUCH better than I do (and.....err........probably more technically correct too). I started brining & smoking our Holiday turkeys a few years back......will never do it another way again. Gonna dunk 2 late tonight!!
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[COLOR="Blue"][B]"Oh, I don’t reject Christ. I love Christ. It’s just that so many of you Christians are so unlike Christ." -Mahatma Gandhi[/B][/COLOR] |
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11-23-2010, 12:08 PM | #10 |
Babbling Farker
Join Date: 04-16-09
Location: Lake Charles La
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Mine should be thawed when i get home this afternoon and in the brine it goes
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11-23-2010, 12:15 PM | #11 | |
On the road to being a farker
Join Date: 01-18-10
Location: Tustin, CA
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Quote:
Brine 1: 1 cup of salt/gallon Brine 2: 1/2 cup of salt/gallon In this example, regardless of the amount of salt in the turkey (with the assumption that the turkey contains less salt concentration than the brine solution), Brine 1 will produce a turkey that has more water (and salt) than Brine 2, because the equilibrium will occur at a higher salt concentration. If the salt concentration in the turkey is higher than the concentration in either Brine 1 or 2, then you would still get an equilibrium, but this time, the salt/water movement would go from turkey to brine. At this equilibrium, you would actually increase the salt content of the brine. I'm going to make up some numbers here to make an example: Unbrined Turkey 0.16% Salt Brine Solution: 0.30% Salt Brined turkey (at equilibrium): 0.23% Salt Enhanced Turkey: 0.27% Salt Brine Solution: 0.30% Salt Brined turkey (at equilibrium): 0.285% Salt Unbrined Turkey: 0.15% Salt Brine Solution: 0.15% Salt Brined turkey (at equilibrium): 0.15% Salt Enhanced Turkey: 0.27% Salt Brine Solution: 0.15% Salt Brined turkey (at equilibrium): 0.21 % Salt So, depending on what the real numbers are, you might increase the saltiness of an enhanced bird, or you might not. It appears that in the real world, reducing the amount of brine by half is still enough to maintain a higher concentration in the bird, without overbrining. But, the more I think about it, the more I am thinking that you do not achieve a true equilibrium. I basically pulled these numbers out of my a$$, but used as a starting point the approx amount of sodium based on the cooks illustrated article you referenced in your other thread (roughly 0.2%). If salt weights about 10 oz/cup, then adding 10oz in 1 gallon (128 oz) is almost 8% salt solution, not the 0.3% that I used in my example to make the numbers work out. Therefore, while equilibrium helps explain why you are brining, I think it doesn't provide a full explanation for what is going on. However, I've tried a few of your recipe's with great success (especially your tri-tip recipe), so I am definately willing to take your advice on brining. Anyway, I hope this helps. Last edited by f308gt4; 11-23-2010 at 12:19 PM.. Reason: fix typos |
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11-23-2010, 12:57 PM | #12 |
Full Fledged Farker
Join Date: 06-30-09
Location: Richmond, VA
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Thanks for the post! I will also be using your brine this turkey-day for the first time. I can't wait!
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11-23-2010, 01:55 PM | #13 |
is one Smokin' Farker
Join Date: 07-07-09
Location: Paradise, CA
Name/Nickname : Chris
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I usually get a 12 lb enhanced bird and brine 9 hours, which is 45 minutes per lb as you suggest.
The more I read about brining the more I see people brining for 24 hours or more. Yesterday I picked up an 18 lb fresh, non-enhanced bird. I know they say not to smoke a bird larger than 12-14 lbs, but since I ramp it up to 325-350 I figured a bigger bird wouldn't be a problem. Especially in the UDS. My question is, do you think it will be okay to brine this bird for a full 24 hrs with a base of 1 cup salt, 1 cup sugar per gallon without it becoming too salty? And how long ideally should I let it air dry in the fridge once rinsed? Thanks in advance. |
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11-23-2010, 03:20 PM | #14 |
Full Fledged Farker
Join Date: 05-12-10
Location: towaco,nj
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Do you think the pilgrams new all this? Mabey they brined in the ocean.
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11-23-2010, 03:54 PM | #15 |
Babbling Farker
Join Date: 04-03-10
Location: Cypress TX
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Thanks for the post, I will be starting my brine tomorrow!
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