Kevin James
Full Fledged Farker
As the title suggests, I need some help with my brisket which I'm not really happy with how it's turning out. With most things I like to figure it out myself through trial and error because I feel like it's more rewarding when you finally get it right, but with how expensive brisket is, I feel like I may be better off just asking for some help.
So first, I'll try to get as detailed as possible about my process, then I'll explain how they are turning out, and last I'll explain some of the things I've heard or read that just seem to add to my confusion .
My process:
The briskets I'm using are prime grade ranging from 10-14 lb's prior to trimming, rubbed with 50/50 salt and pepper plus a little granulated garlic, injected with beef broth.
I'm using a WSM 22.5, with brisket on the top rack, fat cap down, no water in the pan, but a large foil pan on the lower rack to catch drippings.
Charcoal is Royal Oak briquetes (I will be switching to Royal Oak Lump going forward which I just tried on ribs and found that I like it better, I haven't tried it on brisket yet).
I'm using white oak for smoke flavor, in medium chunks to mini split in size, buried in the charcoal.
I'm cooking at 275, and no wrap because at 275 with briskets in this size range they seem to finish in 8-10 hours or less. If I did wrap, I would use pink butcher paper, not foil.
I don't touch it for the first two hours, then I spritz with beef broth once an hour after the two hour mark.
I probe in the thickest part of the flat usually at the 4 hour mark to ensure it's above 140.
I've been pulling when the thickest part of the flat hits 203-205.
I'm wrapping in two layers of foil, two towels, and into a cooler to rest for anywhere from 2-4 hours depending on what time it is and when I want to eat.
The turn out:
I'm a little frustrated because the flat seems to always be dry, while the point is way too tender... to where it can't even be sliced, it just falls apart. That sucks because slices off the point are my favorite part, and i'm NOT looking for shredded point. Also, the flat does pass the pull test, but not the over the finger bend test. The frustrating part is that I have been trying to judge doneness by when the flat is probe tender, but it never seems to get to the point I hear people describe where it's like a knife going in to warm butter. No matter how long I let it go the flat just doesn't ever seem get to that tenderness. If I had to describe the probe tenderness I get in that flat it's more like what I expect to feel probing the interior of a medium rare tri-tip or a thick steak. I say the interior because with a tri-tip or steak puncturing the surface has some resistance which this does not have, but the inside of the meat feels the same.... if that makes sense.
Adding to my confusion:
At face value, the answer would seem simple... that the whole brisket is over cooked since the flat is dried out but passes the pull test and the point falls apart when trying to slice, and I should be pulling it much earlier. But I have heard and read more than once that generally if your flat is dry it is more than likely under cooked, not over cooked. So then it seems my point is just finishing way before the flat is, and short of cooking them separate which I do NOT want to do, I don't know how the heck to get them both cooked to the proper doneness.
I have also heard various numbers for target internal temps to use as a guide, and a couple different ways to probe.
So I guess the other question, is when it comes to the probe tenderness of the flat, is the "like a knife through warm butter" just an exaggeration that's not really accurate? My point feels that way for sure, but not the flat. I'm wondering if maybe that is the problem and I just don't really have the correct understanding of what I should really be feeling for with the flat.
If left to my own devices, my next attempt I would probably try fat side up so see if that changes anything, and try pulling somewhere between the point hitting 205 and the flat hitting 190. That will probably fix my issues with the point but might result in a really tough flat, or it might actually solve my problem... I don't know.
Anyways, sorry for the ridiculously long post, but I wanted to give as much information as possible.
So first, I'll try to get as detailed as possible about my process, then I'll explain how they are turning out, and last I'll explain some of the things I've heard or read that just seem to add to my confusion .
My process:
The briskets I'm using are prime grade ranging from 10-14 lb's prior to trimming, rubbed with 50/50 salt and pepper plus a little granulated garlic, injected with beef broth.
I'm using a WSM 22.5, with brisket on the top rack, fat cap down, no water in the pan, but a large foil pan on the lower rack to catch drippings.
Charcoal is Royal Oak briquetes (I will be switching to Royal Oak Lump going forward which I just tried on ribs and found that I like it better, I haven't tried it on brisket yet).
I'm using white oak for smoke flavor, in medium chunks to mini split in size, buried in the charcoal.
I'm cooking at 275, and no wrap because at 275 with briskets in this size range they seem to finish in 8-10 hours or less. If I did wrap, I would use pink butcher paper, not foil.
I don't touch it for the first two hours, then I spritz with beef broth once an hour after the two hour mark.
I probe in the thickest part of the flat usually at the 4 hour mark to ensure it's above 140.
I've been pulling when the thickest part of the flat hits 203-205.
I'm wrapping in two layers of foil, two towels, and into a cooler to rest for anywhere from 2-4 hours depending on what time it is and when I want to eat.
The turn out:
I'm a little frustrated because the flat seems to always be dry, while the point is way too tender... to where it can't even be sliced, it just falls apart. That sucks because slices off the point are my favorite part, and i'm NOT looking for shredded point. Also, the flat does pass the pull test, but not the over the finger bend test. The frustrating part is that I have been trying to judge doneness by when the flat is probe tender, but it never seems to get to the point I hear people describe where it's like a knife going in to warm butter. No matter how long I let it go the flat just doesn't ever seem get to that tenderness. If I had to describe the probe tenderness I get in that flat it's more like what I expect to feel probing the interior of a medium rare tri-tip or a thick steak. I say the interior because with a tri-tip or steak puncturing the surface has some resistance which this does not have, but the inside of the meat feels the same.... if that makes sense.
Adding to my confusion:
At face value, the answer would seem simple... that the whole brisket is over cooked since the flat is dried out but passes the pull test and the point falls apart when trying to slice, and I should be pulling it much earlier. But I have heard and read more than once that generally if your flat is dry it is more than likely under cooked, not over cooked. So then it seems my point is just finishing way before the flat is, and short of cooking them separate which I do NOT want to do, I don't know how the heck to get them both cooked to the proper doneness.
I have also heard various numbers for target internal temps to use as a guide, and a couple different ways to probe.
- The most common is probe the thickest part of the flat and pull the brisket when it hits 205. When my flat hits 205, it's dry... and the point falls apart when sliced.
- The second most common is probe the thickest part of the flat and go by feel, pulling it when it feels like a knife through warm butter which could be all the way up to 210 or higher. For me, the flat never seems to get to that tenderness, and even taking it to 205, the point gets over done and falls apart when slicing.
- Aaron Franklin's book says probe the thickest part of the flat and that the magic number is usually 203. I tried that, it made no difference, the flat was still dry and the point fell apart when slicing.
- Myron Mixon says he doesn't probe the flat, he probes the end of the point, and pulls when the point hits 205. That probably would fix my issues on the point, but when I tried it the flat didn't feel tender enough so I didn't pull it out of fear of my flat being too tough.
- I read somewhere that if cooking at higher temps, pull the brisket when the flat hits 190. I'm cooking at 275, and wondering if this is my issue. But at 190 the flat doesn't feel probe tender, although the point is probably perfect or just about. It seems that using this method would totally depend on the flat getting more tender during the rest period wrapped in foil and in a cooler... but I don't know.
So I guess the other question, is when it comes to the probe tenderness of the flat, is the "like a knife through warm butter" just an exaggeration that's not really accurate? My point feels that way for sure, but not the flat. I'm wondering if maybe that is the problem and I just don't really have the correct understanding of what I should really be feeling for with the flat.
If left to my own devices, my next attempt I would probably try fat side up so see if that changes anything, and try pulling somewhere between the point hitting 205 and the flat hitting 190. That will probably fix my issues with the point but might result in a really tough flat, or it might actually solve my problem... I don't know.
Anyways, sorry for the ridiculously long post, but I wanted to give as much information as possible.
