Smoking plateau - 6# - 13.5 hrs (so far)

[Cook]

This was a long cook.

[Cook]

Originally Posted by OL' Timer

What I will say is the meat was in the danger zone for way to many hours and not safe to eat according to HACCP guide lines...Anyone who is HACCP certified will tell you this.

If you don't mind, could you post those HACCP guidelines? Thanks, I'd love to hear what HACCP has to say.

[blackdog043]

Quote:
Originally Posted by OL' Timer
What I will say is the meat was in the danger zone for way to many hours and not safe to eat according to HACCP guide lines...Anyone who is HACCP certified will tell you this.

Originally Posted by Cook

If you don't mind, could you post those HACCP guidelines? Thanks, I'd love to hear what HACCP has to say.

I'd like to see what there cooking guide lines are also. Not the safe handling before and after cooking. USDA told me all is good as long as the cooker is 225* or greater during the cook, no matter how long it takes. If nobody comes thru I mave have to email HACCP to see what there advice is compared to the UDSA info I received.

[Cook]

Originally Posted by blackdog043

Quote:
Originally Posted by OL' Timer
What I will say is the meat was in the danger zone for way to many hours and not safe to eat according to HACCP guide lines...Anyone who is HACCP certified will tell you this.




I'd like to see what there cooking guide lines are also. Not the safe handling before and after cooking. USDA told me all is good as long as the cooker is 225* or greater during the cook, no matter how long it takes. If nobody comes thru I mave have to email HACCP to see what there advice is compared to the UDSA info I received.

I think the cat has their tongue.











Every individual who establishes a HACCP plan makes their own guidelines (to an extent). HACCP is a method of record keeping that helps you monitor critical controls (abbreviated explanation).

[Smoothsmoke]

I'm HACCP certified. However I deal only with seafood. Seafood guidelines differ vastly from beef/pork products. We set our own critical control limits/points, however, we do so using the guidelines established by the FDA.

I see that the meat in question is thought to be in a danger zone, however one must ask. Can this harmful bacteria thrive in a 225F ambient temperature cooker? According to the USDA official, no. I'm not sure if the harmful bacteria that affect beef/pork have any time vs temperature issues as does seafood eg scombrotoxin poison. According to the USDA official, no, because he said it does not matter how long it takes as long as it's 225F in the cooker. Interesting to say the least.

[jazzybadger]

Lmao I'm laughing so farking hard right now.
I'm not HACCP certified but I've been a General Manager at most Pepsico/Yum INC fast food stores A&W Burger excluded, and I can honestly say after those 12 years of Hell I'd take my chances with any kind of meat stuck in a grill that's been at 225 degrees any day of the week before I went and bought any kind of anything from any kind of fast food restaurant/pizza chain.

That's a whole level of trust I'm just not willing to give to the random throng of people behind those counters these days. No sir.

My vote? Tombstone Pizzas!

[Cook]

So your Yum! Brand stores did not have a HACCP plan in place or was it just not enforced?

[jazzybadger]

I wasn't affiliated with Yum! After my time.
As far as I can remember there was no such plan in place. I remember the MSDS and Servsafe, but this was well over a decade and I'm out of that business so for all I knew there was one and it completely slipped my mind.
I can tell you this much, most of the plans in place are NEVER enforced, at least in any of the franchise/corporate stores I was involved in. The MSDS was a joke, nobody had any idea what to do with anything. I tried setting up a paid for day to actually teach people what did what and why you don't use degreaser on the farking pizza pans, my DM freaked at me, hours hours hours, can't blow labor, and come pay day I'm having people sign the MSDS "training sheet" for their checks.
Really turned me off the whole going out to eat.. anywhere.

[Dave Russell]

Originally Posted by DaveMW

150 degrees @ 9:26PM (15 hrs after first placed 6.06# butt on preheated smoker)

I don't see how this is even remotely possible, assuming the smoker maintained a cooking temp (of even as low as 200* F, give or take). I'd sure like to know what the deal was, though.

[jestridge]

What type of smoker ?? It also been windy today that will hurt a cook. Next time try cooking around 275 -300. BTW some of the people telling you not to eat ,it will eat a raw steak at 135 degree so go figure.

[FltEng]

Originally Posted by DaveMW

I also have agrate level thermo (also brand new) that states 225 degree temps too.

If your grate level thermometer is now saying 225 and the other thermometer is now saying 300; for the last 13+ hours you have not been at even 200 degrees at the grate level.

[blackdog043]

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackdog043
Quote:
Originally Posted by OL' Timer
What I will say is the meat was in the danger zone for way to many hours and not safe to eat according to HACCP guide lines...Anyone who is HACCP certified will tell you this.




I'd like to see what there cooking guide lines are also. Not the safe handling before and after cooking. USDA told me all is good as long as the cooker is 225* or greater during the cook, no matter how long it takes. If nobody comes thru I mave have to email HACCP to see what there advice is compared to the UDSA info I received.

I think the cat has their tongue.











Every individual who establishes a HACCP plan makes their own guidelines (to an extent). HACCP is a method of record keeping that helps you monitor critical controls (abbreviated explanation).


HAHA Thanks Cook
I guess nobody has any guidelines in writing from HACCP, I'll go by the USDA guidelines, that I have in writing.

[Cook]

Originally Posted by jazzybadger

I can tell you this much, most of the plans in place are NEVER enforced, at least in any of the franchise/corporate stores I was involved in.

In my current life I am the GM of a fast-casual, regional restaurant chain. We have a HACCP plan in place and follow them to a "T". When our bi-yearly inspection comes around the inspector pulls our log books and checks the past six months...PAGE BY PAGE. If anything is not done, we lose inspection points. We check time/temp three times a day...every day. I know of some restaurants that do time/temp as much as five times a day. I'm not sure if things have changed in the industry since you've been out, but I can say in my company's franchise locations we do everything by the book and, as responsible managers, we make sure everything is done every single day.

This is my first experience with a chain-type restaurant. I've owned a couple of restaurants and been in the industry for a decade. I've learned as much in the past year as I did in the previous 10. I'm glad I landed in a spot where I can actually manage responsibly and learn "corporate standards" at the same time.

[Johnny_Crunch]

Eat it!

[Lake Dogs]

Originally Posted by FltEng

If your grate level thermometer is now saying 225 and the other thermometer is now saying 300; for the last 13+ hours you have not been at even 200 degrees at the grate level.

Exactly. The guys above are debating the 220/225 can bacterial grow
thing. I'm not certain that they didn't miss the whole point. It's HIGHLY
unlikely he was cooking at 220. I'll be it was somewhere around 180 or
possibly a little lower.