billygbob
Knows what a fatty is.
What comment would you expect for an average/6? "It was average"? "It could have been better"? Are you looking for the judge to tell you how you should have cooked? Judges are instructed to not do that in comments.
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working on DNS.. links may break temporarily.
Comment Cards?
- Thread starter Candy Sue
- Start date
What comment would you expect for an average/6? "It was average"? "It could have been better"? Are you looking for the judge to tell you how you should have cooked? Judges are instructed to not do that in comments.
billygbob
Knows what a fatty is.
I see (way too many) judges finish scoring six entries in less than five minutes. I doubt more time between turn ins is going to change things for/from them.
Edited to add: I like that more Reps are requiring all judges to stay at the table until they are all done judging. Unfortunately, I haven't seen that make the "speed judges" take any more time actually judging the entries.
Smitty250
Full Fledged Farker
I like comment cards but they are only as good as the judge! Last comp I turned in 8 slices of brisket flat - no burnt ends and all slices from same brisket. I received 2 commet cards. First one said Great flavor but under cooked, Second one said No Flavor and over cooked!
The Judge who said it was under cooked needs some serious re-training! That brisket needed some duck tape to hold it together!!
The Judge who said it was under cooked needs some serious re-training! That brisket needed some duck tape to hold it together!!
Rich Parker
Babbling Farker
No way! If this judge thinks that an excellent rib should be scored an 8 for taste and an 8 for tenderness I am completely ok with that as long as they judge all entries in that manner. Yes, I would have liked an 99 for it but what can you do.
This is my favorite comment because it is the only one I have received that was positive.
Rich Parker
Babbling Farker
Problem with that comment is that the judge is trying to tell you how to cook it which no cook likes to hear. Judges should comment on the entry and not try to guess on what the cook did or didn't do.
DawgPhan
is Blowin Smoke!
I love that most of you are 100% certainly how 1000's of judges would respond to a change in the judging procedure. The reality is that anyone saying that mandatory comment cards would result in judges only giving out score above the cut have no clue how the judges would respond to the change.
Comment cards could be valuable for cooks, but also for KCBS to learn more about how judges score. That information could be used to identify areas where the actual methods used to judge are deviating from the intended method as described by KCBS.
Judges that would respond to the comment card by caring less about the scores they give dont need to be judging. KCBS should be actively working to root out those judges and make sure that they are not damaging the integrity of their contests.
Comment cards could be valuable for cooks, but also for KCBS to learn more about how judges score. That information could be used to identify areas where the actual methods used to judge are deviating from the intended method as described by KCBS.
Judges that would respond to the comment card by caring less about the scores they give dont need to be judging. KCBS should be actively working to root out those judges and make sure that they are not damaging the integrity of their contests.
Arlin_MacRae
somebody shut me the fark up.
Well, for one, I don't expect comment cards, I give them. A six is miles from a nine and the team deserves to know why I marked them down. Just telling them their six was "average" or their four was "poor" helps nobody. I tell them exactly what's wrong with it. Undercooked, overcooked, gray in color, etc.
You say you haven't "seen" the speed judges take any more time judging their samples... I'm curious, are you one of those guys who lines up to watch the judges through a window or tent flap? Those guys creep me out! :laugh: Honestly, you're as likely to get rid of poor judges as you are cooks who cheat. Ain't happening. The good judges (and there are far more of those than poor ones, in my experience) take the newbies under their wings and teach them how to judge right. The poor judges couldn't be bothered to teach anyone anything.
Candy Sue
is one Smokin' Farker
Anyone who cares to chime in actually.
Candy Sue
is one Smokin' Farker
Bragger. My opinion, I've never gotten a comment card that told me anything useful...
Candy Sue
is one Smokin' Farker
I've made no secret that I, personally, think comment cards are a waste of time. I still voted to pursue a plan to make them work.
It is 100% absolutely a bad idea to make comment cards mandatory at any given score. What that does is force scores up to the "no comment card" range. Comment cards can be recommended at a certain score or below, but not required.
Candy Sue
is one Smokin' Farker
Are you willing to push the awards back so this can happen? Sorting and attaching comment cards takes beau coup time to do it right.
Candy Sue
is one Smokin' Farker
How would KCBS know? In the past the comment card was stapled to the individual team detail sheet. KCBS does not record that info anywhere. There was a suggestion last board meeting to put comments on back of score card -- there'd have to be a spot for 6-8 comments on the back of the card (relating to how many samples the judge gets to judge). That way KCBS would get the comments AND the comment would (hopefully) be identified with the correct team.
Bentley
Babbling Farker
Is it my responsibility as a judge to make a team better at cooking BBQ? Of course not.
If I judge a teams entry below average, is it my responsibility to articulate to them why...of course it is.
Until a judge has that mentality, making comment cards mandatory or not is pointless.
I am sorry I don't know how to tell you how to get a judge to that point, for me it was many years and competitions, both judging and cooking.
If I judge a teams entry below average, is it my responsibility to articulate to them why...of course it is.
Until a judge has that mentality, making comment cards mandatory or not is pointless.
I am sorry I don't know how to tell you how to get a judge to that point, for me it was many years and competitions, both judging and cooking.
Q-Dat
Babbling Farker
It wouldn't bother me a bit, but I don't speak for everyone, so I see your point. Why not send the comment cards out via email or traditional snail mail the next day?
Gowan
is One Chatty Farker
As a cook I value comment cards. Even those I think are ridiculous give me an insight into the thought processes of that judge and help me understand their scores.
As a judge I can't remember a recent contest where I have *not* submitted at least one comment card, usually I average two or three.
I don't have a specific set point where I use them, rather I will fill out a card when I feel my scores may require some explanation. For example I might make a comment on a 9-9-7 score to advise the cook that a rib was excellent with the exception that there was a bit of membrane overlooked that brought down the tenderness score.
As a judge I can't remember a recent contest where I have *not* submitted at least one comment card, usually I average two or three.
I don't have a specific set point where I use them, rather I will fill out a card when I feel my scores may require some explanation. For example I might make a comment on a 9-9-7 score to advise the cook that a rib was excellent with the exception that there was a bit of membrane overlooked that brought down the tenderness score.
bbq.tom
is Blowin Smoke!
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I've been saying this for years! Require a comment on EVERY score so that not only does the team know why they got the score they received, but so that KCBS can see how ALL judges score and why. Make the comment part of the scorecard.
This would require an hour between turn-ins, but would improve the judging and the understanding of the teams.
If there are some judges who don't like this, FINE, there are plenty of judges like me who want to improve relations between judges and teams! More are being trained every week.
DawgPhan
is Blowin Smoke!
Obviously they would need to collect the data and then look at it.
KCBS needs to have a clear vision for competition BBQ, they are the gold standard, and they need to support and reinforce that vision at every turn.
Collecting data, analyzing it, and identifying cooks, judges, and organizers who are not supporting that and then course correcting along the way.
MarleyMan
is one Smokin' Farker
We have only 3 comps under our belt, however we were left scratching our heads after a 7th place chicken call and the following comp a 32nd using the same recipe and technique. Everyone has bad days or there may have been that one bad piece of chicken we were unaware of. However without a comment card, we do not know what the issue was.
So in short yes, I think they are a valuable tool to new and established teams on the circuit.
So in short yes, I think they are a valuable tool to new and established teams on the circuit.
kenthanson
is one Smokin' Farker
That's what we do up here in the PNWBA, pork at 11, brisket at 12, chicken at 1, ribs at 2, awards at 4. At the comp two weekends ago we received a comment card from just about every judge in every category....but we also received 9,9,9,8,7,4 for brisket tenderness
