Thinking about sponsoring a comp. need thoughts

Smokin' Hicks · Sep 11, 2011

i am thinking of sponsoring a comp.....it will be judged by CBJ's but the CBJ's will also be certified executive chefs and/or master chefs.....do you think this would turn teams off or attract more teams? seems to me if you have judges with educated pallets the judging would be alot more sensible across the board.....thoughts?

motoeric · Sep 11, 2011

It wouldn't make a difference to me at all.

BTW, I believe that you are way off about chef's providing better judging. From what I've seen and from what I've heard from others, chef's are often much more critical than non-chef's.

Eric

carlyle · Sep 11, 2011

I agree with motoeric in regards to quality of judging. It is one of those ideas that sound nice in theory. Would not want this at our contest.

Smokin' Hicks · Sep 11, 2011

critical comments from highly educated pallets is what you want isn't it? would you rather hear your food is good from a certified chef or master judge or by a couple of judges who judge BBQ once or twice a year...its not the critical i mind its the lack of consistency that sucks, and a educated pallet, a professional chef, would help with that consistency...thats kinda elementary thinking to me...most people i have found that don't want this is because they don't want that educated pallet to be to hard on their food and that is just weak reasoning...everyone says this is suppose to be the Professional level of BBQ cooking and not the backyard level so why not let professionals judge the food, it may be intimidating to some but it the way to get better

Balls Casten · Sep 11, 2011

I wouldn’t want another/different set of judges to have to figure out. I don’t really care who it is. But I do what some semblance of a stationary target.

If “educated” judges is what you’d like to see then educate the judges we have.
Just a thought.

motoeric · Sep 11, 2011

If you're chefs are experienced CBJ's who have judged a number of events prior to this, then I would concede the point. If not, I have never seen any evidence that a chef is more conversant with the flavor profiles of BBQ than experienced BBQ judges.

In addition, the chef's that I have dealt with that have judged have been considerably out of the norm in scoring. They consistently score lower than the rest of the table.

But to reiterate, it wouldn't influence my decision on whether or not to compete at all.

Eric

Hub · Sep 12, 2011

What makes you think that a "certified" chef (not sure what that is but I understand your intention) would make a better judge? If I were cooking in your contest I'd presume this was eyewash. Judges need to be educated concerning standards and rules. After that, there will be subjectivity and I doubt if chefs have any less of it than the general population.

tmcmaster · Sep 12, 2011

I would be totally into this. I think that having someone judge your entrys that tastes food for a living would be able to offer better, more direct and reasoned comments than the average CBJ, who has a life and career outside of food.

Smokin' Hicks · Sep 12, 2011

tmcmaster said:
I would be totally into this. I think that having someone judge your entrys that tastes food for a living would be able to offer better, more direct and reasoned comments than the average CBJ, who has a life and career outside of food.

AMEN.....what more do i need to say? you hit the nail right on the head

Lake Dogs · Sep 12, 2011

Finding 50 seasoned CBJ's (of any sanctioning body) who also work professionally in the food industry is going to be pretty tough, isn't it?

Smokin' Hicks · Sep 12, 2011

well.....i can definitely get the chefs and master chefs....that is not the issue...we just got to get them certified which should not be much of a problem....i have 38 for sure already and am making arrangements to have a judging class and have them all certified....then there will be no excuses to the legitimacy of the comp. ......ball is rolling

Three porks · Sep 12, 2011

I'd rather see a comp with every cbj in attendance having at least cooked one comp.

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Lake Dogs · Sep 12, 2011

Smokin' Hicks said:
well.....i can definitely get the chefs and master chefs....that is not the issue...we just got to get them certified which should not be much of a problem....i have 38 for sure already and am making arrangements to have a judging class and have them all certified....then there will be no excuses to the legitimacy of the comp. ......ball is rolling

Seriously, best of luck with it. I for one would enjoy the competition where all CBJ's were chefs and master chefs. I think the better competitors not only appreciate critical judging, they should expect it. No one wants to be glad handed a 9 for presenting mediocre Q. It would be interesting to see how the competition (particularly the judges) do a few years from now, after they've judged 10 or 20 competitions.

E Mellow · Sep 12, 2011

I like this idea. I always feel that cooks truely appreciate all of the hard work that goes into the cooking process.

Smokin' Hicks · Sep 12, 2011

Hub said:
What makes you think that a "certified" chef (not sure what that is but I understand your intention) would make a better judge? If I were cooking in your contest I'd presume this was eyewash. Judges need to be educated concerning standards and rules. After that, there will be subjectivity and I doubt if chefs have any less of it than the general population.

they taste and prepare food for a living...they have a trained pallet...and really, how in the hell could it be worse than the judging system now? worth a shot IMOP

CMALANGA · Sep 12, 2011

I honestly could care less either way. If it's convenient in location, I have the money, and the timing is right I'm willing to compete. I pretty much assume none of the judges will like what I cooked. Keeps me from loosing my mind later when I get 5s mixed in with 8s and get comments like the chicken was raw when it was the smoke coloration from the smoke reacting with the meat. I'm sorry I blacked out for second...doen't matter either way.

Rich Parker · Sep 12, 2011

Have you ever seen Hell's Kitchen? My favorite challenge is when they blind fold the chefs and ask them to identify the food that Ramsey has them taste. It is amazing how wrong these chefs are at identifying the food.

I understand you think this will make the scores more consistent but even trained chefs are going to be inconsistent between themselves on taste and appearance which i think are the two most subjective criteria's.

Good luck, I look forward to hearing the results.

timzcardz · Sep 12, 2011

Smokin' Hicks said:
critical comments from highly educated pallets is what you want isn't it? would you rather hear your food is good from a certified chef or master judge or by a couple of judges who judge BBQ once or twice a year...its not the critical i mind its the lack of consistency that sucks, and a educated pallet, a professional chef, would help with that consistency...thats kinda elementary thinking to me...most people i have found that don't want this is because they don't want that educated pallet to be to hard on their food and that is just weak reasoning...everyone says this is suppose to be the Professional level of BBQ cooking and not the backyard level so why not let professionals judge the food, it may be intimidating to some but it the way to get better

Smokin' Hicks said:
well.....i can definitely get the chefs and master chefs....that is not the issue...we just got to get them certified which should not be much of a problem....i have 38 for sure already and am making arrangements to have a judging class and have them all certified....then there will be no excuses to the legitimacy of the comp. ......ball is rolling

Interstingly nowhere do you say that they are BBQ chefs, and the fact that you are arranging for a judging class indicates that they aren't BBQ judges either.

I would much rather have experienced BBQ judges than chefs whose expertise in not BBQ.

I can't help but think about the executive chef (Paul Peterson?) that was on BBQ Pitmasters and couldn't figure out how to succesfully cook competition BBQ.

True professionals know their area(s) of expertise, practice within it, and know that expertise doesn't necessarily carry over to other areas.

Three porks · Sep 12, 2011

timzcardz said:
Interstingly nowhere do you say that they are BBQ chefs, and the fact that you are arranging for a judging class indicates that they aren't BBQ judges either.

I would much rather have experienced BBQ judges than chefs whose expertise in not BBQ.

I can't help but think about the executive chef (Paul Peterson?) that was on BBQ Pitmasters and couldn't figure out how to succesfully cook competition BBQ.

True professionals know their area(s) of expertise, practice within it, and know that expertise doesn't necessarily carry over to other areas.

Very well said!!!!!

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Matt_A · Sep 12, 2011

I know many professional chefs, many are EXCELLENT in their area of expertise, some are chef in title only and can't cook Kraft Macaroni & Cheese. I have worked as a professional chef and this doesn't by default qualify you to be a BBQ judge. Even among acknowledged masters you get different opinions about any single dish. Just watch Chopped a few times. Zakarian will say "I really couldn't get past the texture of your polenta." Conant says, "The texture of the polenta was excellent." :crazy: Honestly, I don't think that a stable of trained chefs will give any more consistent results than what we already get at a competition, especially if a third of them will be judging for the first time.

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