Problems with Pitmaker vaults and safes

jmoney7269 said:

You are correct, I never had a problem with mine when I had it Becaise it was made how I wanted it. Don't likE using briquettes Becaise they have cedar, lumber scraps, borax and god knows what else in them, sorry I'm a lump kinda guy. I read alot on stuff before I buy it, and most of the time know how to operate it before I even get it. It's a shame that people had to suffer a $3k+ pocketbook wallop to find out their pit can't hold temps without Doing a bunch of stuff to it.

Click to expand...

I don't know what you're talking avout, my vault hold its temp just fine, without any customization.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2

I have to agree with Kenny Rogers. I dont have any issues with my safe. I also had a stickburner for years [ A Klose ] and that was a great smoker but you were flirting with disaster if you tried to leave it unattended. I have gone out shopping run errands with out a problem. The longest I have been away from the safe is 6-8 hours. for me it pretty much runs like a WSM

They look so well built and the capacity is why I wanted it, to buy it I'd have to sell my 08 trx 450. And I would be extra pissed If that pit needed mods

Jmoney, I like your idea of a ball valve on the intake instead of the slides. The slide on my vault has a very loose fit and it's pretty difficult to fine tune running a dry pan. It will go through a rack of fuel in about 6 hours with water and is difficult to keep below about 300 because of all the inlet air and draft on top if running dry. I wrap the slide in foil and use a guru sometimes. Valve is really good idea.

jmoney7269 said:

Yes, ok, so your able to load the charcoal basket up, throw in some lit charcoal, few chunks of wood, chunk the brisket on @225 for a l&s and come back tomorrow morning and know its still gonna be @225 with no fear of loss of fire or a huge temp spike from overfueling. With a daisy chain method, how many hrs do you get out of the cooker with water In it? I know water almost doubles the fuel consumption.

Click to expand...

I have cooked on many pieces of equipment, the MOST economical is my BGE, I love it! With the stoker on my BGE I can get a load of lump charcoal to cruise at 225 for about 48 hours! That's amazing! HOWEVER... the cooking capacity of the BGE is extremely limited!
The PM vault is insulated (like the bge) with 2" rigid insulation, so it doesn't slide down the walls with time and travel.
After I preheat my cooking chamber, I can load up my basket (around the edges in a U shape) with briquettes and some chunks of wood, light the start of the coals, and it WILL cruise at 225 - 250 for many hours, unattended.
The water will help it maintain a stable temperature, as I said, just like a WSM, only on a larger scale. Yes, it does take energy to heat water... if you do it while you're preheating your chamber, it will last you a long time.
For example: In Stevensville, MT earlier this year I preheated the cooking chamber and preheated the water in the water pan for a friend that was going to use my vault for a charity cook. I didn't put any charcoal in the basket, figuring he had his own. When I went to bed, the pit was cruising at 275... when I woke up 7 hours later, and went out, I discovered he did not use the pit... after sitting all night the pit was STILL at 225!! The ambient temperatures were around 35 degrees, there was even some frost on the windshield. There was NO fuel in the pit!
Is the vault customizable? Yes! Does it NEED customization to make it work? NO! You can add a guru, and get many more smoking hours out of your fuel, it's true. So if you wanna run the vault like a BGE, it IS possilbe.
I do not run lump in my vault, I DO run lump in my BGE. Why? Because I find it effects the flavor of my food in the BGE (because it's so small) but NOT the food in my vault.
There are MANY major competitions that have been won with the PM vault, and this unit has been proven a winner time and time again. I'm happy with mine... sorry you weren't happy with yours. I have a question... what unit ARE you happy with? if any....

If you ever want to sell it, let me know. I got a buddy with serious lust issues and Pitmaker. A reasonably priced used one might push him over the edge.

Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk 2

WhiskeyPigBbq said:

I have 2500 reasons why I want to love my safe, but in truth and out of earshot of my wife I curse everytime I use it. I broke down and bought a weed burner in hopes I could preheat the smoker and use less wood getting it up to temp. This was somewhat successful. Next smoke I am going to go all natural and leave my new Cyber Q in the closet and see what happens. I am planning on making a new charcoal basket because 3-4 hours at best is no good. Its going to start getting cold in Chicago and the last thing I want to do is have to sit on top of my smoker while freezing my butt off.

Click to expand...

I have a Safe. It has a slide door for air intake. I use a Guru every time I cook and can control my temp at 230° with no water in the pan. I do have a diffuser plate in the firebox below the water pan. Try this Whiskey...check your slide door, it needs to be really tight. If it is loose take a ball peen hammer and lightly hammer the door "track" inside the firebox against the slide door to "pinch" it down to a really snug fit. You almost need to tap mine with something to adjust it from outside. A really snug fit here will greatly improve your ability to control temp. Jmoney is correct on closing down on the exhaust while running the Guru. I close my down to about 20%. With a full load of lump and wood (about 50/50) I can get temp up to and maintain 230° for 14 hours without adding anything. And yes it produces the thin blue smoke from clean combustion. Good luck.

I have to close down my dual exhaust a bit to make it run right on my Lg Spicewine, which is very similar to the Lg Safe. I wonder if this is an inherent trait on most vertical insulated smokers similar to these?
Dave

I sold my Vault after 6 months. I prefer an ofset, but they are very well built.

Hook'n Bull said:

I have a Safe. It has a slide door for air intake. I use a Guru every time I cook and can control my temp at 230° with no water in the pan. I do have a diffuser plate in the firebox below the water pan. Try this Whiskey...check your slide door, it needs to be really tight. If it is loose take a ball peen hammer and lightly hammer the door "track" inside the firebox against the slide door to "pinch" it down to a really snug fit. You almost need to tap mine with something to adjust it from outside. A really snug fit here will greatly improve your ability to control temp. Jmoney is correct on closing down on the exhaust while running the Guru. I close my down to about 20%. With a full load of lump and wood (about 50/50) I can get temp up to and maintain 230° for 14 hours without adding anything. And yes it produces the thin blue smoke from clean combustion. Good luck.

Click to expand...

Thanks....for the suggestions. This afternoo I pulled the guru off completely and preheated the safe with a weed burner (which is just fun). I also filled a 5 gallon buckler full of hot water from the bathtub. I made a ring of lump a round the outer edge of the charcoal basket which had chunks of wood as well and started it at the end. We will see how it all works.:noidea::noidea:

WhiskeyPigBbq said:

Thanks....for the suggestions. This afternoo I pulled the guru off completely and preheated the safe with a weed burner (which is just fun). I also filled a 5 gallon buckler full of hot water from the bathtub. I made a ring of lump a round the outer edge of the charcoal basket which had chunks of wood as well and started it at the end. We will see how it all works.:noidea::noidea:

Click to expand...

Fail.........temp down below 200 from 275 and close to half the lump its gone after less than 2 hours. Intake half open and exhaust fully open.. Back to three drawing board tomorrow.

I haven't tried the charcoal in a ring. I just place a big split of hickory and the rest of the space with lump. I leave a small space in one corner that joins up to both the wood and lump. After preheating the chamber and starting a small amount of lump in a chimney, I add the well started lump to the empty corner and close it up.
I open the in and out vents wide open to establish a good flow through the reverse flow in the safe. Then I adjust the vents to my pre established settings for the temp that I want. Then wait..........

I've been following this thread since the beginning because I am considering a Safe in the future. The one thing that stands out to me is you trying to heat 5 gal of water and expect your temps to stay at 275, and your chewing through the lump at a high rate. Your using all the BTUs from a small fire to heat 5 gal of water. This is like putting a large stock pot on the cook top filled with water and putting the burner on med low and wondering why it wont boil to cook your pasta. I've watched the Video on the Pitmaker site, the pan is dry the exhaust is full open, the intake is barely cracked open and it is running at 255. This pit is just a super efficient UDS because of the insulation. I think you problem is fire management.
Fill the basket with charcoal and drop in a few chunks of wood remove a hand full of charcoal from the left rear corner of the basket( the furtherest from the intake) light this in a chimney and drop it back in the empty space close the door and open the intake and exhaust all the way when the temp gets to 175 close it 1/2 way, when the temp hits 230 close it to 3/4 closed at 250 close it to 1/8 open. Run the pan empty, once it settles in adjust the intake to your cooking temp.

When I picked mine up at Pitmaker I asked if they ever used the water pan. The answer was no, but it was there for those who wanted it.
I added a tuning plate between the fire and the bottom of the water pan just to keep direct heat away from it.

Bludawg said:

I've been following this thread since the beginning because I am considering a Safe in the future. The one thing that stands out to me is you trying to heat 5 gal of water and expect your temps to stay at 275, and your chewing through the lump at a high rate. Your using all the BTUs from a small fire to heat 5 gal of water. This is like putting a large stock pot on the cook top filled with water and putting the burner on med low and wondering why it wont boil to cook your pasta. I've watched the Video on the Pitmaker site, the pan is dry the exhaust is full open, the intake is barely cracked open and it is running at 255. This pit is just a super efficient UDS because of the insulation. I think you problem is fire management.
Fill the basket with charcoal and drop in a few chunks of wood remove a hand full of charcoal from the left rear corner of the basket( the furtherest from the intake) light this in a chimney and drop it back in the empty space close the door and open the intake and exhaust all the way when the temp gets to 175 close it 1/2 way, when the temp hits 230 close it to 3/4 closed at 250 close it to 1/8 open. Run the pan empty, once it settles in adjust the intake to your cooking temp.

Click to expand...

I bought this with a water pan with the intention of using it with water. Without water the temps spiked. Granted I was not running a ring.

WhiskeyPigBbq said:

I bought this with a water pan with the intention of using it with water. Without water the temps spiked. Granted I was not running a ring.

Click to expand...

These pits are so well insulated they cook moist w/o water. I've cooked both ways and now prefer no water--dont like having to add as it evaporates. Consider unglazed ceramic tiles or low fire terracotta clay in place of the water. Doesnt evaporate and serves as a heat sink like the water does.

Are the safe and vault reverse flow type of cookers?