Brisket slices back on smoker ---- Illegal?

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watertowerbbq

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I was talking to a friend this evening regarding brisket. During the conversation, I asked him what he thought about slicing brisket, coating it similar to burnt ends and returning it to the smoker. He stopped me in my tracks and said that was illegal, that I couldn't return brisket slices back to the smoker, but that it was ok for burnt ends. I told him he was crazy and that the only rule applied to pork. He said that at a contest recently, he was told that brisket slices could not be returned to the smoker, but cubes could be returned to the smoker to make burnt ends. This sounds really off the wall that a distinction like that could be made.

So tell me brothers, is it legal to slice the brisket flat, season and sauce and return to the smoker?
 
legal. parting being illegal is for pork only.

i can't say preparing the flat slices in the same fashion as the point is a good idea though.
 
boogiesnap said:
i can't say preparing the flat slices in the same fashion as the point is a good idea though.
Click to expand...
i agree. i was just thinking about new ways to come up with a solid product when he said it was illegal...........which i don't think it is
 
I think that part of the show for appearance in brisket is to let the judges see the smoke ring. How can you accomplish this if you coat the slices in sauce?
 
CarolinaQue said:
I think that part of the show for appearance in brisket is to let the judges see the smoke ring. How can you accomplish this if you coat the slices in sauce?
Click to expand...
That is not the question...........the question is whether it's legal or not to slice the brisket and return it to the smoker.
 
CarolinaQue said:
I think that part of the show for appearance in brisket is to let the judges see the smoke ring. How can you accomplish this if you coat the slices in sauce?
Click to expand...

Judges are told repeatedly not to judge the smoke ring at all since it can be chemically induced, so this shouldn't be a factor.
 
watertowerbbq said:
That is not the question...........the question is whether it's legal or not to slice the brisket and return it to the smoker.
Click to expand...

It depends.

If it's a KCBS sanctioned contest it's legal. They make a specific exception for Pork, but do not call out the other 3 meats. I’ve included the rule from the KCBS website below. (apologies in advance for including more information than you specifically requested – don’t harsh on me – but it may help to see the rule in context of all four meats):

10) The Four KCBS Meat Categories:
· CHICKEN: Chicken includes Cornish Game Hen and Kosher Chicken.
· PORK RIBS: Ribs shall include the bone. Country style ribs are prohibited.
· PORK: Pork is defined as Boston Butt, Picnic and/or Whole Shoulder, weighing a minimum of five (5) pounds. Pork shall be cooked whole (bone in or bone out) and shall not be separated during the cooking process. At no time shall the meat once separated be returned to a cooker.
· BEEF BRISKET: May be whole brisket, flat, or point. Corned beef is not allowed.

​
IBCA doesn’t seem to have any restrictions

PNWBA is the same as KCBS, except the judges can judge the burnt ends on appearance only.

You may wanna check the rules for yourself by checking with the sanction body or the event reps.
 
riblette said:
It depends.

If it's a KCBS sanctioned contest it's legal. They make a specific exception for Pork, but do not call out the other 3 meats. I’ve included the rule from the KCBS website below. (apologies in advance for including more information than you specifically requested – don’t harsh on me – but it may help to see the rule in context of all four meats):
10) The Four KCBS Meat Categories:
· CHICKEN: Chicken includes Cornish Game Hen and Kosher Chicken.
· PORK RIBS: Ribs shall include the bone. Country style ribs are prohibited.
· PORK: Pork is defined as Boston Butt, Picnic and/or Whole Shoulder, weighing a minimum of five (5) pounds. Pork shall be cooked whole (bone in or bone out) and shall not be separated during the cooking process. At no time shall the meat once separated be returned to a cooker.
· BEEF BRISKET: May be whole brisket, flat, or point. Corned beef is not allowed.

​
IBCA doesn’t seem to have any restrictions

PNWBA is the same as KCBS, except the judges can judge the burnt ends on appearance only.

You may wanna check the rules for yourself by checking with the sanction body or the event reps.
Click to expand...
It's for a KCBS contest. I'd never heard of such a rule for brisket and that prompted the question.
 
Riblette, nice post.

As a KCBS judge its unheard of judging burnt ends only on the appearance. It kind of gets off the subject some but Unfortunately whether it be a rule or not every judge will judge every piece of meat that is put in front of them. That goes for pork as well. Many times I've seen where one piece was great but the other wasnt so but Judges will grade them both and it will impact their score. Careful what you put in the box and what you believe to be true.

Joe
Hell's Grill bbq
 
riblette said:
It depends.

If it's a KCBS sanctioned contest it's legal. They make a specific exception for Pork, but do not call out the other 3 meats. I’ve included the rule from the KCBS website below. (apologies in advance for including more information than you specifically requested – don’t harsh on me – but it may help to see the rule in context of all four meats):
10) The Four KCBS Meat Categories:
· CHICKEN: Chicken includes Cornish Game Hen and Kosher Chicken.
· PORK RIBS: Ribs shall include the bone. Country style ribs are prohibited.
· PORK: Pork is defined as Boston Butt, Picnic and/or Whole Shoulder, weighing a minimum of five (5) pounds. Pork shall be cooked whole (bone in or bone out) and shall not be separated during the cooking process. At no time shall the meat once separated be returned to a cooker.
· BEEF BRISKET: May be whole brisket, flat, or point. Corned beef is not allowed.

​
IBCA doesn’t seem to have any restrictions

PNWBA is the same as KCBS, except the judges can judge the burnt ends on appearance only.

You may wanna check the rules for yourself by checking with the sanction body or the event reps.
Click to expand...


All texas bbq once it leaves the cooker, it goes in the turn in tray. It is a DQ, if you get caught, or slicing and returning to pit...all sauce/glaze must be cooked on, it cannot be added after it leaves the pit..
 
Kinda funny this was brought up. Reps came aroud this weekend with the "clock" while I was prepping ck. I don't know how but the conversation went south and I joked about a team that dropped their ck & washed it up & sauced it & put it back on the smoker......and WON last year at a comp.
The reps imediat comment was that it should have been DQ'd. .......After I thought about it for a minute I asked why. The answer was you can't return it to the smoker!!!....
After I let them know what the rules were & they kinda looked at each other n walked away...
After they got 30-40 feet away I said to my teamates,,,,OH MY GOD the KCBS Reps don't even know the rules!!!!!!!!!

Swear on my dear mothers grave on this. And they will be repping a Sam's regional in August.
 
INmitch said:
Kinda funny this was brought up. Reps came aroud this weekend with the "clock" while I was prepping ck. I don't know how but the conversation went south and I joked about a team that dropped their ck & washed it up & sauced it & put it back on the smoker......and WON last year at a comp.
The reps imediat comment was that it should have been DQ'd. .......After I thought about it for a minute I asked why. The answer was you can't return it to the smoker!!!....
After I let them know what the rules were & they kinda looked at each other n walked away...
After they got 30-40 feet away I said to my teamates,,,,OH MY GOD the KCBS Reps don't even know the rules!!!!!!!!!

Swear on my dear mothers grave on this. And they will be repping a Sam's regional in August.
Click to expand...



Scary.
 
watertowerbbq said:
That is not the question...........the question is whether it's legal or not to slice the brisket and return it to the smoker.
Click to expand...


Your question had been answered before I got to it, so I figured you didn't need a 3rd answer if the first two were correct. I was just trying to be helpful in regards to your idea that brought about the debate in the first place.
 
nthole said:
Judges are told repeatedly not to judge the smoke ring at all since it can be chemically induced, so this shouldn't be a factor.
Click to expand...

I understand that they're told that. But do you honestly expect me to believe that a judge is going to score a brisket with little to no smoke ring the same as one with a nice deep 1/4 to 3/8" smoke ring? If that's the case, then why would teams be using things like tenderquick to deepen the smoke ring? Yes, it may be artificial, but it looks better int he box.
 
redneck cooker said:
All texas bbq once it leaves the cooker, it goes in the turn in tray. It is a DQ, if you get caught, or slicing and returning to pit...all sauce/glaze must be cooked on, it cannot be added after it leaves the pit..
Click to expand...

Actually, the IBCA rule reads "[FONT=&quot] ...sauces and/or liquids may not be added once put into tray." [/FONT] The rule was modified a while back due to problems at turn in - i.e. sauce that was said to be cooked on but still tacky to the touch.

Lynn H.
 
CarolinaQue said:
I understand that they're told that. But do you honestly expect me to believe that a judge is going to score a brisket with little to no smoke ring the same as one with a nice deep 1/4 to 3/8" smoke ring? If that's the case, then why would teams be using things like tenderquick to deepen the smoke ring? Yes, it may be artificial, but it looks better int he box.
Click to expand...

You can beleive what you want but I for one do not judge Smoke Ring. I could care less if it has a smoke ring. But I'm just one judge.
 
INmitch said:
Kinda funny this was brought up. Reps came aroud this weekend with the "clock" while I was prepping ck. I don't know how but the conversation went south and I joked about a team that dropped their ck & washed it up & sauced it & put it back on the smoker......and WON last year at a comp.
The reps imediat comment was that it should have been DQ'd. .......After I thought about it for a minute I asked why. The answer was you can't return it to the smoker!!!....
After I let them know what the rules were & they kinda looked at each other n walked away...
After they got 30-40 feet away I said to my teamates,,,,OH MY GOD the KCBS Reps don't even know the rules!!!!!!!!!

Swear on my dear mothers grave on this. And they will be repping a Sam's regional in August.
Click to expand...

Wow.:doh:
 
rweller said:
You can beleive what you want but I for one do not judge Smoke Ring. I could care less if it has a smoke ring. But I'm just one judge.
Click to expand...


A better question I thought of:

The smoke ring does not factor into your mind or decision in the over all appearance of the brisket?
 
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