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-   -   Last 3 Briskets, help! (http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=154938)

Khyu80 02-27-2013 09:10 PM

Last 3 Briskets, help!
 
Heya all,
I usually foil and always had a tender flat on the surface and the inside. However, I ditched the foil for the last three cooks and the surface of the flat gets hard. It's to the point where putting a skewer into the flat is tough, kinda makes that stretching noise when trying to bust through the surface of the flat. I usually run 275-300 and might be wondering if it's the quality of the brisket or whatnot. As for rub, I went light on S&P.
Is this a sign of drying out way too much? I probe when flat hits 190 and it stays tough like this well into 205 where I panic and just pull it. Waterpan, no waterpan, it's still the same. Briskets were choice, however, a lot of hard fat, maybe 1/4 to 1/2 of it was hard fat. They were 8lb, 15lb, 15lb.
Please advise!

Daggs 02-27-2013 09:26 PM

I usually probe tender between 205-207 on my cab briskets in my uds. I use butcher paper at 165* no problems here

Bludawg 02-27-2013 09:38 PM

Are you wrapping once you remove it from the pit that will help to soften the bark. I have never used foil during a cook and just recently taken to using butcher paper with great results. I cook at 300 grate temp. I remove all hard fat from the exterior. S&P is the only rub I use on my briskets. I don't take temps i cook by feel.
This was a 15 lb choice packer cooked unwrapped and tented on the counter with foil at probe tender until the IT dropped to 150. cook time was 6.5 hrs 2 hr rest
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...1/DSCF0017.jpg
slice from the flat
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...1/DSCF0019.jpg

Wampus 02-27-2013 10:09 PM

Bludawg is wise.


Just sayin. :becky:

GrillsGoneWild 02-27-2013 10:12 PM

Be patient Danielson.....
Cooking at 275-300 your finishing temp is going to be higher than when cooking low and slow. Don't panic and take off at 205. Just keep checking it until it probes tender.

landarc 02-27-2013 10:17 PM

I agree that if you are cooking at hotter temps and not foiling, you will find you need to cook to a higher temperature. That being said, you also want to wrap and rest as well.

Or, you could go back to what you were doing, and happy with.

DriverWild 02-27-2013 10:36 PM

This sounds like an issue a friend had with his pellet cooker. The fire comes from below and he cooked it fat side up. He said it was so dry he had to cut half the brisket away. In my experience put the fat cap between your fire and the brisket. If the meat isn't drying out and is just tuff, I would either lower the temp and let it ride out for a longer cook or let it rest for a couple hours and see if the muscles relax and become probe tender.

AustinKnight 02-27-2013 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wampus (Post 2386848)
Bludawg is wise.


Just sayin. :becky:

Indeed he is.

BigBellyBBQ 02-28-2013 01:38 AM

I see you are from Texas, so outside ambient air temp should not be an issue, however a few years ago (I am in Buffalo = cold) I was using an un insulated cooker (converted oil tank) and since it was 5 degrees outside, I had to burn lots of wood..I feel the amount of fuel used meant there was LOTS of air traveling through the cooker...drying my meat out...as soon as I switched to an improved design my food was a lot better...just passing on my experience..
also I use a layer of brown sugar and keep fat towards the heats

Pitmaster T 02-28-2013 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khyu80 (Post 2386763)
Heya all,
I usually foil and always had a tender flat on the surface and the inside. However, I ditched the foil for the last three cooks and the surface of the flat gets hard. It's to the point where putting a skewer into the flat is tough, kinda makes that stretching noise when trying to bust through the surface of the flat. I usually run 275-300 and might be wondering if it's the quality of the brisket or whatnot. As for rub, I went light on S&P.
Is this a sign of drying out way too much? I probe when flat hits 190 and it stays tough like this well into 205 where I panic and just pull it. Waterpan, no waterpan, it's still the same. Briskets were choice, however, a lot of hard fat, maybe 1/4 to 1/2 of it was hard fat. They were 8lb, 15lb, 15lb.
Please advise!

Thanks for writing us, and this is only my opinion from cooking essentially enough briskets over the last decade to equal the weight of a house.

First thing... totally resist the urge to use a therm.. even for probing. One reason is, even for me, its hard to IGNORE , the Internal Temp when you are probing. That being said, IGNORE the fact that I am using a quick them to probe my brisket (it was melted in my oven so it was worthless).

Second, you are simply experiencing the unique principles of the brisket.

Take a look at this video where I am cooking the first brisket on the UDS and a bit nervous...


at 1:42, after all my supposed experience, I let the brisket "freak me out" for a second

Let take a better look


Brisket cooked at 230 over direct coals 9 hours

As you see, like many, I thought it was burned. Had it been in my regular smoker, the Brazos or the Meat Mama, I wouldn;t even have checked it. But nervous about my new equipment, I got all weird about it.

Now I will warn you.... if I had NOT wrapped the brisket it STILL would have ended up this good and jiggly at the end... but it shows that ,many of these briskets that people come in here saying they screwed up.... are simply not ready yet.



From this video (which features my famed the Tri Level Rub Process)


My Large cook is represented here...


I hope someone is guided well by this information

Khyu80 03-04-2013 01:54 PM

Thank you all for your responses. I think I figured out why my crust was getting like that. I remember that the rub was 30% sugar based for two of the briskets. This is probably why the crust was out of control, no? It was given to me by a friend who taught me the foiling method. I'm guessing the abundance of sugar was charring my crust.

Also, I noticed the corners getting tender like butter but the thick flat isn't. Am I supposed to wait for the thick part of the flat to feel like this before pulling or will there be a little more resistance there than the corners? It stayed this way for a while until the corner turned hard again but the thick flat was still pretty tough when probed. Maybe the sugar was not allowing me to feel the tenderness?

Def gonna have to run Pit's night train tonight.

Bludawg 03-04-2013 02:42 PM

I shoot for probe tender in the thickest part of the Flat. If the thickest part is probe tender the rest of the brisket will be amazing. Don't over think the process. Forget all that BBQ pitmaster comp Bull Feces nonsense. it has ruined more good meat by inexperienced cooks than I have raised in 10 years. It is really a simple process Constant temp, meat & time. I learned from My Grand dad and My Dad there was no thermometers, foil, injections and 30 ingredient rubs. Post oak & Mesquite, salt & pepper, Time & meat. Really that is all you need and some coldbeers to pass the time. There was a time when I went rouge and tried all that silly Snake oil and dropping my temps to the ridiculous 225. I was chasing rainbows and exposed me to all sorts of unnecessary problems. Once I came back to the basics I saw how stupid I really had been. K.I.S.S.

Haveuseen1? 03-04-2013 03:05 PM

I cook them at 260 until they are done. Salt,Pepper, and Garlic powder for a "rub". I only foil them after I pull them and then let the rest in the cooler.

By the way, whole choice packers at Sams this last weekend were 2.38 per pound.

pigdog 03-04-2013 04:30 PM

B Dawg

Are you wrapping in butcher paper and continuing to cook or wrapping only for the hold?

Bludawg 03-04-2013 04:35 PM

I wrap at 4 hrs into the cook and I don't see it again until I'm ready to eat.


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