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-   -   Legal Help wanted, what shall I do when I meet a cheater from BBQ-Brethren (

woodpelletsmoker 07-17-2012 10:19 PM

Legal Help wanted, what shall I do when I meet a cheater from BBQ-Brethren
A member of bbq-brethren bought my controller and gravity feed burner from eBay on June 04.2012. I sent out the goods on June 07,2012.
As he paid sea and land mail cost, I sent the goods by sea and land mail, which will usually take 8 weeks.
This buyer left negative feedback on eBay.
I do not know the secret trick of his deal, but today eBay told me that his fund is not available, and I am forced paying back US$328 to eBay.
This means this buyer paying nothing to get my Burner and Controller.
What can I do it.
Personally I would pay for anything I can afford to to fight the bad people
e-commerce needs a clean environmental to grow healthily.
At this time, I do not publish his ID.

For the time being I hide his full email and tel. no.

Business Name:

Business Contact Information

Customer Service URL: http://www.*****
Customer Service Phone:

Total refund amount:
-$328.00 USD
PayPal fee refund:
$13.09 USD
Refund from your account:
-$314.91 USD

07:43:03 PDT

PayPal has placed a temporary hold while we're reviewing it. We'll contact you shortly with further information.

Ron_L 07-17-2012 10:22 PM

You need to work this out through eBay. If he's somehow withdrawn his payment he is in violation of the agreement between buyer and seller. eBay has a process for this.

woodpelletsmoker 07-17-2012 10:44 PM

find the trick.
The buyer asks for refund by "not receiving the goods"

My Spit Motor, 3 Skewer Rotisserie, Smoker, Burner are heavy metal things while the value is lower. Air mail cost will be prohibitive.
Usually I send surface mail (sea and land).
Unfortunately Surface mail takes 8 weeks.
I state these clearly in my eBay description.

But this bad people takes use of this and tries to get free things from me.

I am doing e-commerce since 1997 and main market is American.
It is oil painting (, which is sent by air mail.
Usually air mail takes 2 weeks. Even un-deliverable, the parcel will be sent back to me within 5 weeks. If after 5 weeks, the buyer or I fail to get the parcel, it means the parcel is lost. It happens one or two times a year. In this case I send second piece to buyer.

The base of e-commerce is trust and honest.
I am trusting American so many years and American are so honest.
e-commerce save cost, and buyers can pay much less than buying from a local retailer. and I can also earn a little extra

But today I get hit so much.

mytmouz 07-17-2012 11:51 PM

Exactly why I stopped selling on Ebay. I saw the hand writing on the wall when they would no longer allow sellers to leave negative buyer feed back. They decided that sellers were their 'employees' and they make the rules. Rule #1 is the customer is always right. You must make the customer happy, and they side with the buyer in most every case. Funny thing is though, the sellers are not their 'employees' but their customers...

woodpelletsmoker 07-18-2012 12:34 AM

Does eBay know that the bad buyers are ruining eBay.
I am chinese in Beijing China, still I understand the word of "mutual"

woodpelletsmoker 07-19-2012 12:15 AM

What a sad result. The bad man is reading my post
I find from the "active visitors", that ID is reading my posts.
He may be smiling by successfully stealing from China and I can do nothing toward him.
He left ugly negative feedback on eBay and I can not argue, and I can not leave negative feedback to him.
I am written an request to track the parcel. When I receive officially reply, I must send post cards to his neibhours, local newspaper, police station, and local school. What what do you recommend.
Today I meet second bad buyer from eBay, not member here.
Bad people are ruining the e-commerce one day.

timzcardz 07-19-2012 07:14 AM

Woodpellet, I have to question why this is even posted here, as in my mind it really has nothing to do with the Brethren, other than you did businerss with someone, somewhere elase, who also happens to be a Brethren.

However, what did you expect to happen?

You SHOULD know Ebay/PayPal rules.

Buyer bought on June 4.

You shipped on June 7.

Under PayPal rules, buyer has 45 days to file a claim.

It appears that buyer waited almost all, if not all of those 45 days.

If you can't prove delivery, PayPal finds in favor of Buyer and refunds. You KNOW that, or at least SHOULD KNOW that if you are doing business.

If buyer doesn't file a claim, and never receives merchandise, then the buyer is out of luck. Again, YOU should know that.

Buyer may very well issue you payment again, once merchandise is received. Time will tell.

Whether it is right or wrong, YOU are the one that willingly chose to engage in the Ebay/PayPal business model, so you really have no right to complain about the outcome, which by the way, is still to be determined.

The buyer has played by the rules that you chose to integegrate into your business, and may have taken the required steps within the system that YOU CHOSE to protect their financial interests. That's called good business.

To come here and allege that a Brethren is a cheat, because they are engaging in a business transaction in accordance with the rules that YOU CHOSE, in my mind is just wrong.

I would expect that if the merchandise is finally delivered, and you receive a new payment, that you will come back and explain that you jumped to the wrong conclusion.

woodpelletsmoker 07-19-2012 11:23 AM

People are social lives.
I know it is stupid and helpless. But I feel relief to speak out.
I state very clearly about delivery time of 8 weeks in the description.
It has nothing to do with the 45 days protect if he knows the delivery time of 8 weeks and still places the order

deguerre 07-19-2012 11:30 AM

Personally, I would have waited the 8 weeks, and then contacted YOU directly if it hadn't arrived yet instead of reporting it to the website first.

timzcardz 07-19-2012 11:33 AM


Originally Posted by woodpelletsmoker (Post 2141413)
It has nothing to do with the 45 days protect if he knows the delivery time of 8 weeks and still places the order

Actually it has everything to do with it, because regardless of the 8 weeks delivery time, you still agreed to PayPal terms when you agreed to take payment in that manner.

Wait and see how it turns out in the end. You really don't have another choice anyway.

timzcardz 07-19-2012 11:44 AM


Originally Posted by deguerre (Post 2141426)
Personally, I would have waited the 8 weeks, and then contacted YOU directly if it hadn't arrived yet instead of reporting it to the website first.

Guerry, I may have also, but that doesn't mean that someone that doesn't is a cheat. Remember, we are only hearing one side.

Business is business.

I have bought several things, OK, sportscards, from sellers in Asia. What I have found is that I can get them at a significanlty better price because buyers are wary of time required to get them. I've never had a problem, but I have also been very careful about following Ebay/PayPal rules to be sure that I am protected in the event that there is an issue.

The seller gets to set the rules, by their choice of selling venue in this case. I certainly can't fault a buyer for playing by those rules.

I am assuming that the buyer is using the rules to protect themself and not to work the system for free stuff. Time will tell if that is a valid assumption or not.

deguerre 07-19-2012 11:48 AM

Oh, I wasn't questioning your logic at all Tim. Perfectly understandable. Here's hoping everything works out for both.

Squeal Appeal 07-19-2012 12:04 PM

Wood Pellet Burner Transfer Grill BBQ Smoker to Automatic Pit, burn charcoal too

trustedinventer ( 203
95.4% Positive feedback pellet-pits

More than 10 available / 9 sold

Item location:

Ships to:


If purchsaed today this is how your delivery time is stated,,, There is nothing stated about 8 weeks....Also i am Not a Theif or a cheat,,, and for you to come on this forum and post my info and making the statements you have made is SLANDER.... I also request that you be removed from these forums for making these posts and statements......all i have done is protect myself in my purchase as other members have stated. I still have not received my product...............I will be sending all of your post to ebay and paypal requesting you be removed from there sites as a seller, if you continue to SLANDER and make threats about me....THIS SHOULD NOT BE OUT HERE>>> This is between you , me and PAYPAL...:evil:

Squeal Appeal 07-19-2012 12:06 PM

Item condition:

More than 10 available / 9 sold

Item location:

Ships to:

Estimated between Fri. Aug. 17 and Thu. Aug. 30 Estimated delivery dates [newWindowTxt] include seller's handling time, and will depend on shipping service selected and receipt of cleared payment[newWindowTxt]. Delivery times may vary, especially during peak periods.

Squeal Appeal 07-19-2012 01:36 PM

Nuf Said !!!:boxing:

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