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-   -   Interesting article about the dreaded stall (http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=119209)

NapalmRunner 09-27-2011 03:23 PM

Interesting article about the dreaded stall
 
Not sure where i needed to post this, it's a pretty good read..

http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_tech...the_stall.html


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HeSmellsLikeSmoke 09-27-2011 04:00 PM

Very thought provoking as to why.

Doesn't change the fact that the stall is our friend and is when the magic is happening.

Thanks for the link.

expatpig 09-27-2011 04:34 PM

I've been trying to tell people that same thing for years, and they all thought I was crazy!...finally, validation.

landarc 09-27-2011 04:37 PM

The experiment as written is flawed fundamentally. In comparing a sponge to fat, and then to meat, the test essentially denies the effect of the collagen and how it encompasses the fibers of meat. If the collagen is not rendered, the moisture retained within the meat does not escape, as it is encapsulated within the collagen and cellular structure of the meat.

Further, a sponge in not similar to meat on several levels. While a great deal of moisture obviously is evaporated from the meat, and evaporative cooling is no doubt a part of the process resulting in the stall, it does not deny the roll that rendering the collagen is a part of the stall. I think the article, while interesting, does nothing to change the fact that it is best to start cooking early. And have a few pounds of vac-packed pulled pork in the fridge, ready to roll, just in case.

Cook 09-27-2011 04:46 PM

Stall? What is a stall?

Cook it till it's done and stop worrying about what happens between the time the meat goes on the pit and the time it comes off the pit.

It takes as long as it takes. Wanna speed it up? Cook at a higher temperature.

smokainmuskoka 09-27-2011 06:58 PM

Does injectng fluids into large cuts prolong the stall?

Cook 09-27-2011 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smokainmuskoka (Post 1801338)
Does injectng fluids into large cuts prolong the stall?

I will answer that by saying I can't answer that.

I have never injected a piece of meat. I like the taste of meat.

MilitantSquatter 09-27-2011 08:12 PM

I'll have to go back later and read it more carefully but I did a quick look... interesting..

speedrcer1 09-27-2011 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smokainmuskoka (Post 1801338)
Does injectng fluids into large cuts prolong the stall?

My experience is the opposite, but, I foil. And according to this article, that would be correct.

Jaskew82 09-27-2011 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landarc (Post 1801209)
The experiment as written is flawed fundamentally. In comparing a sponge to fat, and then to meat, the test essentially denies the effect of the collagen and how it encompasses the fibers of meat. If the collagen is not rendered, the moisture retained within the meat does not escape, as it is encapsulated within the collagen and cellular structure of the meat.

Further, a sponge in not similar to meat on several levels. While a great deal of moisture obviously is evaporated from the meat, and evaporative cooling is no doubt a part of the process resulting in the stall, it does not deny the roll that rendering the collagen is a part of the stall. I think the article, while interesting, does nothing to change the fact that it is best to start cooking early. And have a few pounds of vac-packed pulled pork in the fridge, ready to roll, just in case.

I think you missed the point...

The sponge was meant to simulate the meat but rather to show how evaporative cooling and moisture prolong temp stall (or even temp reduction).

And the author and Blonder both agree that the breaking down of collagen play a roll in the stall but simply reject the idea that they are the driving force. This is based on the premise that there is simply not enough fat and collagen to create such a deep stall.

I actually buy into Blonder's hypothesis and believe he is accurate. It makes sense with my own experiences and will effect how I cook in the future.

Mooner 09-27-2011 09:53 PM

That is so cool, evaporative cooling. Whowouldathunkit? Meat science rules!!

landarc 09-27-2011 10:54 PM

No, I understand the point. In science, at least as I understand it, if you are going to use an analog for testing, the analog only has validity if it recreats the basic properties of the material it is being use on. A sponge does not have the closed cellular structure like meat does and it does not entrain the moisture in such a manner as to mimic meat. He used a sponge as it is easy to illustrate the concept.

I do not reject the idea that evaporative cooling is a part of the stall, but, I question the methodology and conclusions. Since he has no idea, at least does not state that he tested for it, the amount of collagen in the meat, there is no idea whether or not he understands how many calories of heat were used in rendering the collagen, the fat and the water. In the end, he doesn't even have an understanding of how much water alone is in the meat.

I fail to see how his conclusions make a cogent scientific argument for how to adjust your cooking to manage a better product. It still seems to me the only way to get the job done is to apply heat and cook until the meat is done. Now, dry aging a piece of meat and then cooking it to see if the meat cooks faster through the stall, that might be interesting.

Sammy_Shuford 09-28-2011 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landarc (Post 1801548)

I fail to see how his conclusions make a cogent scientific argument for how to adjust your cooking to manage a better product.

I saw it as explanation of what happens, not as how to change anthing!

infernooo 09-28-2011 12:16 AM

This article nicely confirms the same belief as Nathan Myhrvold has on the plateau which I posted up some time ago (wet/dry bulb temperature and evaporation), I'm glad to see it in article form with some tests and data on the side! Nice to finally have some more credible information debunking the role (or should I say, lackthereof) of collagen in the stall.

TIMMAY 09-28-2011 12:36 AM

Interesting read. regardless of the reasons that were stated for why things happen, one thing is true. foil makes it get done faster.


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