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Bigmista
10-25-2010, 09:43 PM
I am toying with the idea of turning in drumsticks this year. I did an experiment the other night and this is what I came up with...

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j67/bigmista/chicken%20experiment/SDC10869.jpg

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j67/bigmista/chicken%20experiment/SDC10874.jpg

I am happy with the color but I am not happy with the way the skin rolled back. I think that I would have to buy leg quarters and cut the drummies myself so I could leave extra skin to wrap over the top. I also need to pull back on the rub because it was too spicy.

You see here that the meat was juicy and it was quite flavorful...

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j67/bigmista/chicken%20experiment/SDC10880.jpg

I'll give more updates as I experiment.

What do you think?

nthole
10-25-2010, 10:02 PM
Me think me eat...you know my address.

5-0 BBQ
10-25-2010, 10:21 PM
I get my best looking drums when I use my Bayou Classic Leg and Wing Rack. I thought about doing drums for comps I just worry about being different. I did a beautiful whole bird 2 years ago and got a comment card for excellent use of whole bird but got killed on my score. Go figure.

swamprb
10-25-2010, 10:23 PM
We have a few chicken leg turnerinners up here that do very well.
You might want to try to trim what you can from the joint or use leg quarters like you said. I've also trimmed the tendons when pulling back the skin.
Cooked so many legs I'm sick of them!

Sylvie
10-25-2010, 11:55 PM
Practice, practice, practice.

Big George's BBQ
10-26-2010, 07:31 AM
I will be glad to be a taste tester

chambersuac
10-26-2010, 07:32 AM
looks good from here.

G$
10-26-2010, 08:37 AM
Neil, 25% chance we turn in drumsticks this weekend. We've never done it.

IF we do ... I'll let you know the feedback.

DawgPhan
10-26-2010, 10:06 AM
meh.

Buster Dog BBQ
10-26-2010, 10:35 AM
I wish I had the balls to turn in drumsticks. I would save so much dang time from trimming chicken.

Gore
10-26-2010, 10:38 AM
They look great, but WHAT was the experiment?

LGHT
10-26-2010, 10:42 AM
In all honesty I think it would be a mistake. Even the best leg will fail in comparrison to an average thigh. Bottom line is the meat just isn't the same tenderness or texture. Legs are good eating don't get me wrong, but I never really cared for them much when comparred to a thigh. Because a leg is somewhat of a tough lean piece of meat, if put side by side cooked to the same level of tenderness and they both have the same flaovor the thigh will always win in my book.

carlyle
10-26-2010, 11:30 AM
Great looking pictures. Made my mouth water!
Good discussion, would be very interested in how they turn out and how they do in competition.

I have encountered drums a number of times when judging. Have scored some higher than some of the thighs in the same batch. It is not consistent however.
Because of the differences noted between thigh and drum meat, drums are less
forgiving to the variables in cooking.

Good luck with your experiment, keep us posted.

Rookie'48
10-26-2010, 01:22 PM
In all honesty I think it would be a mistake. Even the best leg will fail in comparrison to an average thigh. Bottom line is the meat just isn't the same tenderness or texture. Legs are good eating don't get me wrong, but I never really cared for them much when comparred to a thigh. Because a leg is somewhat of a tough lean piece of meat, if put side by side cooked to the same level of tenderness and they both have the same flaovor the thigh will always win in my book.

I tend to dissagree with LGHT on this. First of all, in KCBS comps at least, there isn't suppossed to be any comparitive judging; each entry is judged on it's own merits. You're not suppossed to judge leg against thigh against breast meat.
Each one of these entries should be judged by asking the question "Is this a good example of what the cook was trying to accomplish?" You should be able to (in theory) give 9s across the board to any cut of meat that is presented to you. I have had drummies, thighs, sliced breast meat, wings and pulled white / dark meat mixed come across the judging table, all with varying results.
A friend of mine used to turn in 6 Cornish Game Hen hind quarters every once in a while with good results. It makes a very full box and if done right can be in the money on taste & tenderness, too.

I say "Go for it, Neil!" :thumb:

Jeff Hughes
10-26-2010, 01:50 PM
I had a decent run with legs a few years ago. That run went dry...

I'm a much better chicken cook now, and may give them a shot again next spring...

Bigmista
10-26-2010, 02:21 PM
In all honesty I think it would be a mistake. Even the best leg will fail in comparrison to an average thigh. Bottom line is the meat just isn't the same tenderness or texture. Legs are good eating don't get me wrong, but I never really cared for them much when comparred to a thigh. Because a leg is somewhat of a tough lean piece of meat, if put side by side cooked to the same level of tenderness and they both have the same flaovor the thigh will always win in my book.

But as a judge, aren't you taught not to compare but to judge each entry on it's own merit even if it isn't your favorite piece?

Bigdog
10-26-2010, 03:06 PM
But as a judge, aren't you taught not to compare but to judge each entry on it's own merit even if it isn't your favorite piece?

Teacher speaking here: There is a difference between what is taught and what is learned and remembered. :tsk:

JiveTurkey
10-26-2010, 03:27 PM
Judges are taught to not judge the garnish either and we know how that worked out.

LGHT
10-26-2010, 03:39 PM
But as a judge, aren't you taught not to compare but to judge each entry on it's own merit even if it isn't your favorite piece?

Of course, but it's difficult to get a leg tender is my point. I'm sure it may be just as good if not better then some thighs, and you might be able to get it just as tender of a thigh, but the bottom line is your going in trying to pull of something that is going to be harder than cooking a thigh. The skin will be harder to perfect and the meat is not as tender from the get go.

pigmaker23
10-26-2010, 04:36 PM
Go For it Neil, better yet why not try it at Stagecoach next year :-P

LGHT
10-26-2010, 05:00 PM
Go For it Neil, better yet why not try it at Stagecoach next year :-P

hahaaha that and the raspberry rib rub right?

INmitch
10-26-2010, 06:11 PM
Of course, but it's difficult to get a leg tender is my point. I'm sure it may be just as good if not better then some thighs, and you might be able to get it just as tender of a thigh, but the bottom line is your going in trying to pull of something that is going to be harder than cooking a thigh. The skin will be harder to perfect and the meat is not as tender from the get go.

I disagree about the leg skin. My thighs are wrapped 2/3 of the way around with leg skin. It's very thin with little to no fat. I score the remainder. Bite thru everytime. 9 calls out of last 10 contests. By the way I start out with leg quarters then trim & cuss & p!ss & moan & trim till they're done.

LGHT
10-26-2010, 07:04 PM
I disagree about the leg skin. My thighs are wrapped 2/3 of the way around with leg skin. It's very thin with little to no fat. I score the remainder. Bite thru everytime. 9 calls out of last 10 contests. By the way I start out with leg quarters then trim & cuss & p!ss & moan & trim till they're done.

Wow that's a great idea why don't you start cooking legs and see if you get that many calls? I'm dying to know how the judges score those legs :becky:

bigdogphin
10-26-2010, 08:06 PM
I switched to legs this year with great success! I buy the cheapest ones I can find that have extra skin. Scrape or trim the little bit of tough fat on the end of the skin or anything that doesn't look good. I never have been scored down for the skin not covering the whole leg. Keep spraying the chicken during cooking to get bite thru and its all gravy. The ease of trimming is a bonus and personally I like legs over thighs.

Meat Burner
10-26-2010, 09:10 PM
Got a 1st in chicken with legs at a KCBS comp last year. Thinking about doing them again.

Funtimebbq
10-26-2010, 09:20 PM
Neil,

I would try the legs. I received 13th (of 53) at Viejas with my first try. I did trim (frenched) the meat off the legs and made them look like popsicles. This allows the skin to be pulled over the the meat end (insert jokes here). The leg bone was hidden under the parsley so the judges could only see the meat. I received very good scores from 5 of the 6 judges. The 6th judge gave me a 9 for appearance and then two 6s for taste and tenderness. I think I was punished once that particular judged discovered the meat was legs. The other scores varied from 7 to 9.

Good luck, Benny

jbrink01
10-26-2010, 09:27 PM
I've been thinking drummies, hmmm...I dont like legs, but dont like thighs either and I just trimmed 12 of them tonight......:mad:

Captain P.J.
10-26-2010, 10:17 PM
I have also been trying out the legs. I agree with you on the skin issue. I even fired up the smokey joe and let my 3.5 year old son take a crack at a few legs... he did a pretty good job! Maybe in a few years I can turn that category over to him....probably have a better chance at getting a call. :-D

INmitch
10-26-2010, 11:22 PM
Wow that's a great idea why don't you start cooking legs and see if you get that many calls? I'm dying to know how the judges score those legs :becky:

I was just being honest in what I've been doing & you've got to be a smarta$$. Did I do something wrong? Ive worked long & hard to get where I've gotten with chicken & I was just sharing my secrets (as some would call it). Sorry it won't happen again.:thumb:

INmitch
10-26-2010, 11:59 PM
LGHT I've got to appoligize. After reading some of your other replies on other threads I realize that you aint got the picture yet. Hang in there you'll catch up. Just takes time & determination.:icon_blush:

LGHT
10-27-2010, 12:20 AM
Apologize? I was serious when I said cook legs. I mean if your that good at chicken you should do just as good if not better right? My only point is I think cooking legs is harder then thighs and the main reason why everyone probably cooks thighs, but for someone who gets 9 out of 10 calls you probably won't have any issues get 1rst with legs.

INmitch
10-27-2010, 12:52 AM
And tell me why I should change something that is working? I wasn't bragging about 9 outta 10. The people on here that know me know I'm pretty humble & not that good. Your obviously a judge and have never pulled the skin off a leg qtr. If you had you would have never replied the way you did! I"m headin to bed now so I can get up & spend 2-3 hrs triming chicken for the last time this year (thank God), Then off to Degaque to have a riot with my bbq freinds!!!:clap2::thumb:

Smokedelic
10-27-2010, 08:05 AM
In all honesty I think it would be a mistake. Even the best leg will fail in comparrison to an average thigh. Bottom line is the meat just isn't the same tenderness or texture. Legs are good eating don't get me wrong, but I never really cared for them much when comparred to a thigh. Because a leg is somewhat of a tough lean piece of meat, if put side by side cooked to the same level of tenderness and they both have the same flaovor the thigh will always win in my book.
I'm glad you don't judge in my area. Your preconceived, prejudicial notions have no place at a judging table. With an attitude of "Legs are good eating don't get me wrong, but I never really cared for them much when comparred to a thigh", you are a detriment to every team that you judge.

LGHT
10-27-2010, 11:22 AM
I'm glad you don't judge in my area. Your preconceived, prejudicial notions have no place at a judging table. With an attitude of "Legs are good eating don't get me wrong, but I never really cared for them much when comparred to a thigh", you are a detriment to every team that you judge.

Your right I should prefer to eat legs that in my opinion are a lesser quality cut of meat and appreciate that cut of meat as long as it cooked as best as it possibly can be and not worry about how much more tender a juicy all the other cuts of meat at the table are. It's just odd that I have never once seen a leg turned in a box at all??? I wonder why that is? I mean I would be really impressed to see a team turn in legs. Do you turn in legs or ever have or do you use thighs? If you don't use legs why not?

Boshizzle
10-27-2010, 04:23 PM
I have judged some beautiful drum sticks in competitions, in fact they received 9's from many judges at my table. However, the flavor in most of them was lacking. So, the skin problem can be overcome. Just don't overcome it at the expense of flavor.

Bentley
10-27-2010, 05:38 PM
In all honesty I think it would be a mistake. Even the best leg will fail in comparrison to an average thigh.


A a CBJ I could not disagree more, alas as a CBJ I must try and not make my personal choice a factor...my favorite piece is the drumstick, and to be frank, it would be refreshing to eat insted of a candied thigh...

They look very good to me, please have some avaiable this Sunday at Atwater Villege FM and I will be happy to give you my CBJ score, 7-10 legs should be enough...

Bentley
10-27-2010, 07:02 PM
It's just odd that I have never once seen a leg turned in a box at all??? I wonder why that is?


Not to bang on you to hard, but I think the reason you don't is your initial comment...As a competition cook, the comment makes me think, why turn it in if some CBJ's have a predisposition to say the thigh is better before they have taken a bite.

As a side note, I have overheard many CBJ's in the past in CA say that they judge down for baby back ribs because they think it is cheating and that only spares should be turned...They sure never seem to make that comment when I am turning in a select brisket and 5 other teams are turning in $150 Waygue brisket, wonder why that is...

Sorry for the side track Neil...

bigdogphin
10-27-2010, 07:12 PM
http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff72/bbq-brethren/Yakimachickensmall.jpg


Here is a chicken leg box I turned in and did fairly well with.

Alexa RnQ
10-27-2010, 07:14 PM
Drums were recently turned in at a California contest and did well. Just sayin.

boogiesnap
10-27-2010, 07:40 PM
if you think your drum BBQ is better than your thigh BBQ than 100% turn em in!
for my first KCBS comp i did wings. at the time(and still today) they are better than my thighs.
was ribbed pretty hard by the other competitors...
they were great Brethren so it was all in good fun.
despite a poor cook on my part, we still got a call.
to put it another way, same as it's the cook not the cooker, it's the cook not the choice of meat.

boogiesnap
10-27-2010, 07:42 PM
here's a pic...

bam
10-27-2010, 08:00 PM
http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff72/bbq-brethren/Yakimachickensmall.jpg


Here is a chicken leg box I turned in and did fairly well with.

With that box I would give legs a try.

LGHT
10-28-2010, 10:27 AM
Not to bang on you to hard, but I think the reason you don't is your initial comment...As a competition cook, the comment makes me think, why turn it in if some CBJ's have a predisposition to say the thigh is better before they have taken a bite.


I said a leg is a lessor cut of meat and in my opinion it is. It's often not as tender or juicy as a thigh and meat is a bit on the lean side with little to no fat. If you disagree why don't you stay on track and tell me exactly why you think a leg is a better cut of meat? Do you really cook thighs because your worried about the predisposition or do you cook them because you honestly know you will end up with a better end result?

I never said that I would score a leg less because it was a lessor cut of meat. In fact I would be really impressed if a team turned in legs and actually did it right and was able to get that leg to test just as good as a thigh and if not better. Based on the feed back and post it seems like some teams have the balls to go for legs, but just not you...

Jorge
10-28-2010, 11:09 AM
Mod Note: Some folks are taking this a little too personally. Having read the posts I can understand why, from each perspective. Keep it friendly, or keep it to yourself.

If I have to put on my mud boots to end this pissing contest nobody is going to be happy.

Bentley
10-28-2010, 11:19 AM
I said a leg is a lessor cut of meat and in my opinion it is. It's often not as tender or juicy as a thigh and meat is a bit on the lean side with little to no fat. If you disagree why don't you stay on track and tell me exactly why you think a leg is a better cut of meat?


The leg is the better tasting piece of meat for the exact opposite reasons you stated above...Which one of us is right?

smokinhot
10-28-2010, 11:37 AM
:thumb:I am toying with the idea of turning in drumsticks this year. I did an experiment the other night and this is what I came up with...

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j67/bigmista/chicken%20experiment/SDC10869.jpg

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j67/bigmista/chicken%20experiment/SDC10874.jpg

I am happy with the color but I am not happy with the way the skin rolled back. I think that I would have to buy leg quarters and cut the drummies myself so I could leave extra skin to wrap over the top. I also need to pull back on the rub because it was too spicy.

You see here that the meat was juicy and it was quite flavorful...

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j67/bigmista/chicken%20experiment/SDC10880.jpg

I'll give more updates as I experiment.

What do you think?

LGHT
10-28-2010, 05:37 PM
The leg is the better tasting piece of meat for the exact opposite reasons you stated above...Which one of us is right?

In all honesty there is no right or wrong. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion and voiced mine and have given the reasons as such. If you care to interject some meaningful discussion toward the topic at hand great, but if not please refrain from useless post that are only focused on attacking the opinions of others.

Big Poppa
11-02-2010, 02:14 PM
Neil I would love some of those....As someone who was there...Mistas rasberry sauce was outstanding as is all his cooks. Im waiting to buy some of it.....or trade for my double secret rub! I can't believe the trouble Neil stirs up with his cooking! hehehe